1895 Marlin 444 question.

[Blackhawk]

Got a chance to get an 1895 Marlin 444. I have zero experience with this caliber but do own and shoot a 1895G in 45/70. I've always heard that the 444 has sharp recoil compared to the 45/70, can anyone give thoughts on this. Also, can the 444 be turned into a 45/70?

Johnny

[TedH]

I got mine a few months ago, and have played with it quite a bit recently. I have had a lot of Marlin leverguns in a lot of calibers, and I have no problem saying this 444 is the most accurate of the bunch. Recoil is not much different than my 45-70 Marlin, and certainly no worse, but of course that depends on how you load them. Full house 45-70 with a 405 is going to recoil more than a full house 444 with a 265 gr. bullet, in rifles of the same weight.
Far as turning a 444 into a 45-70, I'm not sure why you would want to do that. Seems it would be cheaper and easier to pass on the 444 and buy what you wanted.

[Blaine]

Got a chance to get an 1895 Marlin 444. I have zero experience with this caliber but do own and shoot a 1895G in 45/70. I've always heard that the 444 has sharp recoil compared to the 45/70, can anyone give thoughts on this. Also, can the 444 be turned into a 45/70?

Johnny

45-70 recoil go from gentle to OMGosh depending on how they are loaded. As I recall, my .444 recoils about like my 45-70 Guide Gun shooting 300 grain Factory rounds....

I suppose you could switch out a .444 to a 45-70, but it would be really expensive, and silly to do so....

[Blackhawk]

Understand that it maybe difficult to go from 444 to 45/70. I was hoping for a barrel and bolt switch and be done. I think I will just leave it a 444. I mainly shoot the 325gr Leverevolutions out of my 45/70. Getting excited bout getting it now!.

Johnny

[TedH]

Well if you're excited now, take a look at this group I shot with mine on Saturday.

[TomF]

I have a '71 model 444T that shoots as well as TedH's gun..........with factory 240s. Keep it and enjoy.

TomF

[Blaine]

I love my .44 Magnum Magnum +P

[AJMD429]

If you're thinking about a 444 Marlin, these articles are excellent reads:

http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell444Marlin.htm

http://leverguns.com/articles/paco/444.htm

This phrase from Paco's article caught my attention:

"Twenty-five....3 shot groups...with a 325 grain Keith Lyman bullet averaged 1.32 inches at 100 yards using a 6 power scope for testing accuracy"

[Old Savage]

I have seen excellent accuracy out of both calibers in the Marlins.

[Blackhawk]

Awesome stuff! Thanks for the reading!

What kind of scope setups y'all using?

Johnny

[Grizz]

Here are three articles that will repay the reader:

http://www.beartoothbullets.com/tech_no ... tes.htm/17

http://www.beartoothbullets.com/tech_no ... tes.htm/19

http://www.beartoothbullets.com/tech_no ... tes.htm/28

I wonder if I could get it to work on the "ar platform"?

[Blaine]

If you're thinking about a 444 Marlin, these articles are excellent reads:

http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell444Marlin.htm

http://leverguns.com/articles/paco/444.htm

This phrase from Paco's article caught my attention:

"Twenty-five....3 shot groups...with a 325 grain Keith Lyman bullet averaged 1.32 inches at 100 yards using a 6 power scope for testing accuracy"

I don't shoot on paper much, but the 73ish .444 Marlin, and all my 1895s would hit stuff with boreing regularity....The little white rocks, and empty shotgun shells of Western Washington are scared to death of me.....I sold my two 1895s, and the 1886EL, but I still have the .444. It could be for sale, but not at a price I would want to charge my friends

[tman]

The 444 is close/equal to the 405WCF that Teddy Roosevelt took to Africa. The 1895 Marlin is a little handier than the 1895 Winchester. It's MORE THAN ENOUGH for all North American game. Mine is chambered in Winchester Bigbore. It does kick lick a mule. But you will never feel it when shooting game.

[TedH]

Awesome stuff! Thanks for the reading!

What kind of scope setups y'all using?

Johnny

I've got a Nikon 2-7x32 on mine. I just used some cheapo rings and base that I had in my spare parts box when I got the rifle. I'm going to replace them with the Talley one piece ring/base setup, and get the scope lower too. The 444 is the bottom rifle.

[Dan 444]

I have a bunch (11) of different calibers in Marlin centerfires and my 444's are the most accurate.

Dan

[Grizz]

Dan,

I always thought 44s are inherently accurate, kind of like 7mm. It seems like you have to work to make one NOT shoot straight.

[Blaine]

Dan,

I always thought 44s are inherently accurate, kind of like 7mm. It seems like you have to work to make one NOT shoot straight.

I find my 1894 .44mag somewhat inaccurate, but not the .444....perhaps the extra FPS? On the other hand, my 629PP with a SpeedDot was a ORH at 30ish yards with my 300 grain loads @ about 1000fps....

[Canuck Bob]

I think the 444 is all anyone needs for hunting in our hemisphere. It is a very good performer. I would suggest save your money and buy a 45-70 Marlin if that is your preference. They are readily available. As you own a 45/70 I would say the 444 will really add to your rifle stable.

444 recoil is manageable. I wouldn't class the recoil as sharp. My old 7MM Mag was a sharp kicker, long gone. Factory level 444 is all the kick I ever want to experience however.

I've used a 444 since the mid 70's and can say it is a dandy stand alone rifle cartridge pair. I used the 265 Hornady handloads and am working on 285 grain cast now. My 444 is unusually accurate as well. Real handy for moose and a great camp rifle for bear country. I think the mid weight, 265 to 300, 444 bullets are best. Many folks like the heavy weights but they don't interest me.

[Blaine]

Can anyone verify that the Remington 240s for .444 are different than the 240s they use for .44 Mag? I've heard this before. Since my .444 is not a plinker, I more than likely have a lifetime supply of Rem factory ammo for mine. I have a decent supply of Gummy Nosed Hornady but have been told that would not stabilize in my MG Marlin....

[Pete44ru]

.

When I bought my 1st .444 Marlin in 1966, the Remington .444 ammo (the only kind commercially available at the time) was simply loaded with 240gr .44 Mag pistol boolits, drived 2x as fast as in the .44 mag guns.

I had them repeatedly blow up on the outside of the near shoulder of a Whitetail deer (4x) - which led me into handloading 265gr Hornady's, that gave perfect performance on those same (large) Maine deer.

AFAIK, years later Remington (and presumeably other loaders) saw the error of their ways, and besides loading 265gr slugs, loaded 240Gr JSP's that had heavier jackets than the pistol JSP's.

I can't verify that, because I just stayed with a 265gr JSP for my (multiple) Marlin & Winchester .444's.

I've also shot Hornady LeverRevolution ammo in my MG .444's (the Winchester 94BB's had conventional rifling), with no discernable difference in their accuracy.


.

[Blaine]

I've also shot Hornady LeverRevolution ammo in my MG .444's (the Winchester 94BB's had conventional rifling), with no discernable difference in their accuracy.

That's pretty much what I heard, and thought before I bought a bunch. The "high priest of .444" at MO thought I wasted my money.....

[Canuck Bob]

Blaine, this question has troubled me for years and worthy of some research. Pete wrote his as I wrote this. My early experience was different on deer. Pete's experience is unsettling, blow-ups on deer are a serious happening.

I had a Ruger 44 Mag Semi rifle many years ago and I was convinced that the bullets were different to my 444 but after Pete's report I question that assumption in the early days of my 444. I used Remington in both. The 240 grain 444 bullets held up well at closer range. This was mid to late 70s ammo and may verify Pete's note about an upgraded bullet. If memory serves me right I read were Remington actually posted the 444 bullets stock number as different to add something to that question. It seems almost impossible to confirm this in todays ammo.

For years I suggested to folks that the 444 240 grain Rem ammo is just fine from my experience. I would use it if 265 Horn FN reloads were not available to me for moose country. However internet reviews occasionally report the 240 grains broke up. The problem with internet reports is the lack of details and the expectations of the shooter. It never stops confusing me when a guy reports poor bullet performance from a good clean kill. I wonder if a great terminal performance is overlooked because recovered bullets don't exhibit perfect magazine style mushrooms.

I cannot report on 240 Rem 444 ammo bullet mushrooms because I always got double blood trails. That is what sold me on the 444 over a 7MM Mag bolt many years ago. The 240 broke bone and continued on, does it get better?

Edit: Post 3 relates the concept of a different bullet in the 444 ammo, no way to confirm though.
http://www.shootersforum.com/leverguns- ... -ammo.html

[AJMD429]

These holes in my 5/16" steel gong were made with the more modern loadings from Remington...

[Canuck Bob]

Here is a test I read years ago. It is interesting but sadly the pictures no longer work on my computer. He finds the 240 bulk bullets and 444 pulls identical! I find Remington QC to be dismal. I read reports of 240 grain 444 standing up for moose and elk then reports that they are too fragile up close on Deer. Wondering if it is a case of different bullets loaded in error for some runs?

http://www.marlinowners.com/forum/444-m ... sults.html

[TedH]

I have a decent supply of Gummy Nosed Hornady but have been told that would not stabilize in my MG Marlin....

I'd say hogwash. My '77 Marlin is Microgroove and I've shot the gummies along side the regular Hornady 265 with not much difference in accuracy. Slight edge to the standard 265.

[Blackhawk]

Buyer backed out. But I'm on the trail of 45/70.