some tech info ..... Penetrating Oils

[new pig hunter]

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/ge ... il-196347/

Penetrating Oils

Machinist's Workshop Mag, April 2007 edition published some information on various penetrating oils. The magazine reports they tested penetrates for breakout torque on rusted nuts. Results listed below, as forwarded by an ex-student and professional machinist. They arranged a subjective test of all the popular penetrates with the control being the torque required to remove the nut from a "scientifically rusted" environment.

*Penetrating oil ....... Average torque load to loosen*
No Oil used ................. 516 pounds
WD-40 .................... ... 238 pounds
PB Blaster ................... 214 pounds
Liquid Wrench ............. 127 pounds
Kano Kroil .................... 106 pounds
ATF*-Acetone mix......... 53 pounds
*ATF=Automatic Transmission Fluid

NOTES:
The ATF-Acetone mix is a "home brew" mix of 50 / 50% automatic transmission fluid and acetone.
Note this "home brew" released bolts better than any commercial product in this one particular test.
Our local machinist group mixed up a batch and we all now use it with equally good results.
Note also that "Liquid Wrench" is almost as good as "Kroil" for about 20% of the price.
ATF-Acetone mix is best, but you can also use ATF and lacquer thinner in a 50-50 mix.


Cheers,

Carl

[Borregos]

Interesting, thanks for posting.

[TedH]

Interesting.

[octagon]

Cool info, thanks.

[Rusty]

Years ago we used to mix ATF and mineral spirits. I'm wondering if the acetone does something different?

[AJMD429]

Does the acetone just serve to carry the heavier molecular weight ATF ingredients down into the nooks and crannies*...?




*(I believe that 'crannie' is the proper SAE term, but in metric they are usually known as 'krannies'; not to be confused with 'grannies', which occasionally seize up as well, but respond better to ibuprofen, without the acetone...)

[jeepnik]

Does the acetone just serve to carry the heavier molecular weight ATF ingredients down into the nooks and crannies*...?




*(I believe that 'crannie' is the proper SAE term, but in metric they are usually known as 'krannies'; not to be confused with 'grannies', which occasionally seize up as well, but respond better to ibuprofen, without the acetone...)

Yep. It lowers the viscosity so that it prenetrates better without adversely effecting the lubricating properties of the ATF.

[Mac in Mo]

Very good info. I'll be mixing some soon. Thanks.

Kevin

[jdad]

My dad always had Liquid Wrench, in his shop, and to think that I thought Kroil was far superior.

[olyinaz]

My dad always had Liquid Wrench, in his shop...

Same here. It works great but stinks. I suspect that the ATF-acetone stuff stinks even worse!

Oly

[olyinaz]

Years ago we used to mix ATF and mineral spirits. I'm wondering if the acetone does something different?

The ATF-mineral spirits stuff makes a pretty good general purpose gun cleaner.

Oly

[m.wun]

I came up with a penetrating oil mix that worked so good you couldnt keep it in a can without seeping right out!

[jeepnik]

I must be older, dad kept three in one oil in the garage. Squirt a bit on and come back the next day. It usually broke free, and if not, well, that what heat was invented for.

[JohndeFresno]

Thank you, N P H.

Saved for my archives!

[J Miller]

IL is insidious for rust due to road salt. Even things not driven on the streets will rust due to how it spreads.

Vehicles are prone to rusting here so that's no surprise. My Pathfinder has an external spare tire mount. The mount has a latch that uses two spring loaded hooks on the same shaft. They work as a primary and secondary latch and had rusted with one in the open position.
I priced a new latch and it was well over a hundred dollars 5 years ago. I said screw that and mixed up a batch of acetone / ATF and began to use it on the latch. I got the two hooks freed up enough that when I'd oil them with the mixture I'd manually move them. I had to open the latch to both open and close the tire carrier or the primary latch would stick in the open position, but at least I got it to work.

Last year my wife just closed it and I heard both latches snap into place. The ATF / acetone mixture had worked and I have a working latch.

After the last snow this year I've got to do a lot of cleaning and servicing on my vehicle, and I'll be using that mixture on anything that moves.

Joe

[Mike Hunter]

I would take the above test results with a grain of salt. The test data has been around for a while, and has been posted many times on various forums. Unfortunately, some of the clarifications have not. The author clarified in the article that he had mistakenly used power steering fluid ; as many folks found out ATF and acetone do not mix very well, and tend to separate rather quickly. Another point not quoted in the above text was that the parts sat immersed in the solutions for 8 hours prior to testing.

There are some very good products out there, formulated by professional chemists with PhDs. Something else to consider, the companies that purposely formulate and manufacture penatrants, design them to work in most environments i.e... from 8 below in Duluth, Minnesota to + 106 in Prescott Arizona. See how long acetone stays liquid at temps above 100+ degrees.
Use stuff that was made for the job… I like Kroil

[M. M. Wright]

Thanks nph. I'll remember this when I'm tearing down my '41 Mercury.

[K1500]

I tend to side with Mike. I am sure almost any oil mixed with a solvent works to some degree or another. I personally use so little of the stuff over the course of a year that the cost savings for me are negligible at best. The same goes for using ATF or Mobil 1 oil on guns. I have no objection to it, but the cost savings are just not worth it to me.

[J35]

I just use ED'S RED,Since It is already on the shelf.

--- J

[mikld]

Personally, I use Kroil. I even use it to loosen lead deposits in barrels; squirt it in the bbl. and let it sit overnight. My "soak"/gun cleaner is Mineral Spirits/Kroil/Marvel's Mystery oil.

I would think the results would be valid no matter how long the test pieces sat in the solution, if all sat the same amount of time...