OT - Custom Contender Barrel

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Mar 22, 2011 3:27 pm

I just purchased a TC Contender 444 Marlin barrel that was made by "Marshall" in Preston Idaho .

Anyone know about this company or person making barrels back in the early 1980's ?

Post by **Hobie** » Tue Mar 22, 2011 3:30 pm

That is a new maker to me but that doesn't mean much!

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Tue Mar 22, 2011 8:45 pm

What chambering is it...?

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Mar 22, 2011 8:57 pm

AJMD429 wrote:What chambering is it...?

Wow I thought I had put that in !

It's a 444 Marlin

jnyork · Post by **jnyork** » Tue Mar 22, 2011 11:09 pm

6pt-sika wrote: TC Contender 444 Marlin

Brutal. Just brutal.

Streetstar · Post by **Streetstar** » Tue Mar 22, 2011 11:19 pm

SSK Industries ? ------ Was JD Jones around in the 80's (well i'm sure he was around, but was he in the industry then?
)

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Mar 22, 2011 11:43 pm

Streetstar wrote:SSK Industries ? ------ Was JD Jones around in the 80's (well i'm sure he was around, but was he in the industry then?
)

Don't quote me but I think he may have started around 1969 with the Contenders .

Post by **Hobie** » Wed Mar 23, 2011 1:48 pm

6pt-sika wrote:
AJMD429 wrote:What chambering is it...?

Wow I thought I had put that in !

It's a 444 Marlin

Shoulda known...

Antietamgw · Post by **Antietamgw** » Wed Mar 23, 2011 4:44 pm

I believe I recall hearing about some stretched frames with .444 Contenders. My interest has been with milder chamberings in carbine barrels so don't take it as gospel - just what I think I recall from the past. Ought to be a handfull, even with reduced loads!

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Wed Mar 23, 2011 10:21 pm

Antietamgw wrote:I believe I recall hearing about some stretched frames with .444 Contenders. My interest has been with milder chamberings in carbine barrels so don't take it as gospel - just what I think I recall from the past. Ought to be a handfull, even with reduced loads!

Before they brought the Encore out we had several silhouette shooters here have barrels made by SSK for the 45-70 and they all seemed to hold up nicely . So I don't think this one will be a problem . Plus I don't anticipate shooting the assstomper loads I shoot in some of my 444 rifles !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Wed Mar 23, 2011 10:23 pm

To be honest I am thinking 207 to 250 grain cast bullets at 2 to 3 grains off my max rifle loads !

And with all likelyhood I will stay with a 207 , 215 or 225 grainer !

I've been looking for a round nose gas check mold to shoot in this thing . But I'm not seeing much if anything !

mikld · Post by **mikld** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 9:56 am

6pt-sika wrote:To be honest I am thinking 207 to 250 grain cast bullets at 2 to 3 grains off my max rifle loads !

And with all likelyhood I will stay with a 207 , 215 or 225 grainer !

I've been looking for a round nose gas check mold to shoot in this thing . But I'm not seeing much if anything !

Have you looked at Ranchdog's 265 gr. FNGC? My mold drops them at .432" - .433" cast from wheel weights.

Pete44ru · Post by **Pete44ru** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 10:07 am

While I've hear on BullBerry, SSK, T/C's Fox Ridge Custom Shop, and IIRC E.W.Brown barrels, I've never heard of Marshall.

I wouldn't be concerned about frame stretching, with anything like normal loads - the frame of the .45-70 T/C Contender Hunter Super 14. I once had, stood up much better than my hands did.

.

awp101 · Post by **awp101** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 10:18 am

A .444 TC? My carpal tunnel is flaring up at just the thought and I had it fixed 5 years ago...

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 11:30 am

mikld wrote:
6pt-sika wrote:To be honest I am thinking 207 to 250 grain cast bullets at 2 to 3 grains off my max rifle loads !

And with all likelyhood I will stay with a 207 , 215 or 225 grainer !

I've been looking for a round nose gas check mold to shoot in this thing . But I'm not seeing much if anything !
Have you looked at Ranchdog's 265 gr. FNGC? My mold drops them at .432" - .433" cast from wheel weights.

Yes I have looked at it !

Matter of fact I have one of the four original test molds for that bullet !
Used that bullet 3 or 4 years ago to take a whitetail doe or two with one of my old 444 rifles .

Matter of fact I have RD 44 molds for 265 , 285 , 300 and 350 grain bullets . Also have a NOE version of the RD 350 thats set up with a hollow point !

My choice in bullets is more of one to cut back on the recoil to my hand . What I would reaaly like is a 225 grain RN GC mold to use in this barrel .

2X22 · Post by **2X22** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 4:04 pm

SSK rechambered a 14" .44 mag T/C to 444 and put in stronger springs for me probably 25 years ago. One of my more accurate T/C's and they are ALL accurate.

I use Lymans 429640 and AA#2520 for a velocity in the 1980fps range. A great deer and elk load.

In the years I've had it I bet there has been over 3-4000 rounds through it with absolutely no problems except for a couple Leupold scopes were eaten.

2x22

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 8:02 pm

2X22 wrote:I use Lymans 429640 and AA#2520 for a velocity in the 1980fps range.

I have a Lyman 429640 double cavity FP GC mold and it's shot very nicely in one of my 444 rifles . However a 280 grain bullet moving along at a good clip is more then I wanna deal with in a handgun .

Incidently I used the Lyman 429640 HP Devestator in a 444 rifle last year on a whitetail buck and I wasn't overly happy with the way that bullet held up . He required a second shot !
Maybe this summer I'll try that bullet water quenched and pushed with H322 instead of XMP5744 and see what happens .

2X22 · Post by **2X22** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 8:42 pm

6pt-sika wrote: I have a Lyman 429640 double cavity FP GC mold and it's shot very nicely in one of my 444 rifles . However a 280 grain bullet moving along at a good clip is more then I wanna deal with in a handgun .

I use about 50/50 WW/lead and they weigh about 296 grs from my mould. I like this bullet so much I think I have about 2 or 3 of them and one I bought from Glenn Fryxell that he had wallered out to a PB that shoots very well at revolver velocities.

Incidently I used the Lyman 429640 HP Devestator in a 444 rifle last year on a whitetail buck and I wasn't overly happy with the way that bullet held up . He required a second shot !

That surprises me. Glenn has been trying to turn me to the darkside and almost had me talked into purchasing that mould since he's had such great luck with it. What did the recovered bullet/parts look like? I've taken a couple dozen bucks and a 1/2 dozen bull elk with the heavier FN version with fantastic results. One shot, one kill in every instance.

Maybe this summer I'll try that bullet water quenched and pushed with H322 instead of XMP5744 and see what happens .

Why water quenched? Just curious since I tend to run a 50/50 mixture upwards of 2000fps with no leading and wonderful performance on game!

2x22

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 9:23 pm

2X22 wrote:
6pt-sika wrote: I have a Lyman 429640 double cavity FP GC mold and it's shot very nicely in one of my 444 rifles . However a 280 grain bullet moving along at a good clip is more then I wanna deal with in a handgun .
I use about 50/50 WW/lead and they weigh about 296 grs from my mould. I like this bullet so much I think I have about 2 or 3 of them and one I bought from Glenn Fryxell that he had wallered out to a PB that shoots very well at revolver velocities.

Incidently I used the Lyman 429640 HP Devestator in a 444 rifle last year on a whitetail buck and I wasn't overly happy with the way that bullet held up . He required a second shot !
That surprises me. Glenn has been trying to turn me to the darkside and almost had me talked into purchasing that mould since he's had such great luck with it. What did the recovered bullet/parts look like? I've taken a couple dozen bucks and a 1/2 dozen bull elk with the heavier FN version with fantastic results. One shot, one kill in every instance.

Maybe this summer I'll try that bullet water quenched and pushed with H322 instead of XMP5744 and see what happens .
Why water quenched? Just curious since I tend to run a 50/50 mixture upwards of 2000fps with no leading and wonderful performance on game!

2x22

All I ever use is straight wheelweights so I water quench to up the hardness a bit !
I think i am somewhere in the 30 mold range for my herd of 444's !
At the moment I have three HP molds for the 444 , the Lyman 429640HP as well as the MiHec 433-295GC HP and the NOE rendition of Ranch Dogs 432-350GC with a HP ! I've used all two to take Virginia whitetails ! But so far I've not used the NOE/RD 432-350GC HP although I'm playing with the rifle for that one now at the range .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Fri Apr 01, 2011 2:35 pm

Finally got the Contender barrel today .

Added a Leupold 2x scope !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sat Apr 02, 2011 7:46 pm

Well I didn't do what I said I was gonna do !
I had said I'd shoot the barrel ona friends frame before buying a frame of my own but.......................................!

I got a Contender with a pair of barrels on Gunbroker a couple hours ago !

Gun was priced right and didn't look very used . So I figure by the time I sell the 10" 22LR bull barrel , the 10" 44 MAG vent rib barrel and the little forend I'll have about $150-175 in the frame and grip . Then all I'll need is a forend for a 12-14 inch barrel . And that'll put me at about $300-325 for the whole mess excluding the Leupold scope .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sat Apr 02, 2011 7:52 pm

I checked my bullet selection last night !

I have plenty of the castboolits group buy 434-207GC bullets ready to go as well as Lyman 429215 and RCBS 44-240 SWC GC .

This coming week or possibly tommorrow I'll cast about 100 of the RCBS 44-225 SWC GC and maybe some more of the Lyman 429215 .

It'll be another week before I've got everything as it just so happens the Contender I just got is in the Pacific Northwest !
By the time I get a check out monday it'll be wednesday or thursday before they get it and more then likely tuesday or wednesday of the following week before I get it !

2X22 · Post by **2X22** » Sat Apr 02, 2011 9:46 pm

Can't wait to read and see the results!

2x22

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sat Apr 02, 2011 9:55 pm

2X22 wrote:Can't wait to read and see the results!

2x22

If I'm able this coming season it'll get a chance at black bear and a whitetail !

txpete · Post by **txpete** » Sun Apr 03, 2011 7:35 am

I have a stubby encore 444 carbine all I can say your the man.the recoil is brutal with full house loads.
that said the RD 265 gr gc and 25.0 grs 2400 (encore) is very accurate load and recoil is mild.

http://www.impactguns.com/store/90161023567.html

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sun Apr 03, 2011 9:07 am

txpete wrote:I have a stubby encore 444 carbine all I can say your the man.the recoil is brutal with full house loads.
that said the RD 265 gr gc and 25.0 grs 2400 (encore) is very accurate load and recoil is mild.

http://www.impactguns.com/store/90161023567.html

I'm gonna try the three cast bullets I mentioned earlier with H4198 , H322 and maybe XMR2015 . If they are to much I'll try SR4756 and SR7625 and possibly Unique .

This thing in my hands hunting is gonna be a 50 yard proposition at max distance !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Mon Apr 04, 2011 12:34 pm

Cast a few bullets for the Contender today !

Steelbanger · Post by **Steelbanger** » Tue Apr 05, 2011 5:55 am

Hello 6-pt,

Is that a rechambered T/C 44 Mag barrel? The front sight ramp looks like the style used on the original Super 14 barrels.

Marshall Stanton from Beartooth Bullets, like you, is a dedicated 444 fan and since he is from Idaho maybe he would be the person that rechambered it. Just guessing here though.

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Apr 05, 2011 8:07 am

Steelbanger wrote:Hello 6-pt,

Is that a rechambered T/C 44 Mag barrel? The front sight ramp looks like the style used on the original Super 14 barrels.

Marshall Stanton from Beartooth Bullets, like you, is a dedicated 444 fan and since he is from Idaho maybe he would be the person that rechambered it. Just guessing here though.

This barrel appears to be a newly made barrel at the time of manufacture rather then a rechamber . As there are no TC markings whatsoever on the barrel .

Post by **Hobie** » Tue Apr 05, 2011 3:45 pm

Now that would be interesting. I don't suppose that a gunsmith stamping his product with only his first name is unique. I seem to remember that somebody else did that, although I can't remember who. Never thought of that as the answer...

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Apr 05, 2011 6:54 pm

Steelbanger wrote:Marshall Stanton from Beartooth Bullets, like you, is a dedicated 444 fan and since he is from Idaho maybe he would be the person that rechambered it. Just guessing here though.

I sent him an email asking if he knew anything about the barrel and told him everything thats stamped on it !

Sounds reasonable since the barrel lug is stamped "Marshall S 12/81" on one line and MAX+PSI 45000" beneath it !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Apr 05, 2011 6:56 pm

I should have the Contender I purchased early next week !

So then I'll have a donor frame and can take this brute to the range and decide if I made a mistake or not

Post by **Hobie** » Tue Apr 05, 2011 8:10 pm

6pt-sika wrote:I just purchased a TC Contender 444 Marlin barrel that was made by "Marshall" in Preston Idaho .

Anyone know about this company or person making barrels back in the early 1980's ?

Had this suggestion from elsewhere...

Years ago there was a guy named Al Beckstead that made TC barrels, myself & Elgin Gates spent quite a bit of time in his shop. His wife's name was Marsha (I think) & he called his business "MarshAl's"

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Apr 05, 2011 8:54 pm

Hobie wrote:Years ago there was a guy named Al Beckstead that made TC barrels, myself & Elgin Gates spent quite a bit of time in his shop. His wife's name was Marsha (I think) & he called his business "MarshAl's"

[/quote]

The boss under the barrel is marked "MARSH AL S -12/81"

So you may very well have the answer .

But the designation on the top of the barrel is "MARSHAL" .

Post by **Hobie** » Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:34 pm

He just ran the stamp together. Cheaper. I'm betting that's him. Congrats!

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:39 pm

Hobie wrote:He just ran the stamp together. Cheaper. I'm betting that's him. Congrats!

NOW the million dollar question is going to be whether this thing likes a load I like and that I can control

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Tue Apr 12, 2011 8:00 pm

Well I got the frame yesterday and messed with the action and trigger a little today !

Then after dinner tonight I went out to the range for about an hour and shot 9 groups with this animal !

And I will say this "It is a Handfull !" !

I'm gonna drop down a grain or two with each weight and go again friday or monday !

Oh yeah I have pics but my laptop is messed up and this desktop at home with dialup is a bitch to get from my files to photobucket to here !

But when the laptops straightened out I'll post pics of the gun it actually looks pretty decent I think !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 11:01 am

Well I've fired it 53 times now and my right wrist is still a little sore !

But it seems to be starting to come around . Quite possibly a good bit of it is me remmembering how to shoot a Contender and deal with pistol recoil .

I've only been shooting it at 50 yards so far , but wanna work my way out to 100 yards by hunting season with a nice cast bullet load !

Oh yeah have several pics for posting but at the moment , my laptops in the shop and it's a excercise in futility to try and do it here at home with dial up !

Post by **Hobie** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 11:40 am

Keep it up, we'd like to see the photos of your set-up.

BTW, do you shoot at Rivana?

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 11:52 am

Hobie wrote:BTW, do you shoot at Rivana?

I was a member at Rivanna as well as Piedmont back 25 years ago when I shot skeet and trap all the time !

But now I'm a member at Piedmont still and a little single field skeet club close to Ashland called "Horseshoe" !
At "Horseshoe" we only have 40 members !

But back to the original question , I've not fired a gun at Rivanna in over 25 years .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 11:57 am

My fiancee/wife in the Philippines is left handed !
She is also a bit "petite" .

So I am thinking I might get a walnut junior rifle stock for this thing along with a 50 cal ML barrel and a 6.8 SPC rifle barrel for her to use once I get her here !

Post by **Hobie** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 2:12 pm

I was told they are up to 1700+ members.

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 3:46 pm

Hobie wrote:I was told they are up to 1700+ members.

I honestly don't know how many they have at Rivanna . I don't think it was anywhere near that many when I was a member and I kinda doubt that it's that many now but one never knows !

We have a max membership of 400 at Piedmont and always have 50 or so on the waiting list !
At Piedmont our annual turnover is about 30 . So as you can see there's a steady stream of people going and coming . But most of our new folks are coming from NOVA where as Rivanna may be picking their's up from the Richmond are I would think and possibly your direction into the valley !

Whats the membership at Shenandale and Stonewall now ?

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sun Apr 17, 2011 5:46 pm

Well I think I'm heading to the range in the morning with my "Hand Cannon" !

Already have stuff loaded with H322 , think I may also load some of what I used in a lever gun . The Ranch Dog 432-265GC with XMP5744 and see how that does !
I am thinking the recoil should lessen a bit !

Post by **Hobie** » Sun Apr 17, 2011 5:51 pm

6pt-sika wrote:
Hobie wrote:I was told they are up to 1700+ members.

I honestly don't know how many they have at Rivanna . I don't think it was anywhere near that many when I was a member and I kinda doubt that it's that many now but one never knows !

We have a max membership of 400 at Piedmont and always have 50 or so on the waiting list !
At Piedmont our annual turnover is about 30 . So as you can see there's a steady stream of people going and coming . But most of our new folks are coming from NOVA where as Rivanna may be picking their's up from the Richmond are I would think and possibly your direction into the valley !

Whats the membership at Shenandale and Stonewall now ?

I don't know about Shenandale but Stonewall has a limit of 150. I'm 2d or 3d on the waiting list now. Didn't expect to get in for a year or two. Might get in next year. Wife is interested in shooting skeet but Stonewall only has trap. Might have to join there, too!

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Sun Apr 17, 2011 8:13 pm

Hobie wrote:
6pt-sika wrote:
Hobie wrote:I was told they are up to 1700+ members.

I honestly don't know how many they have at Rivanna . I don't think it was anywhere near that many when I was a member and I kinda doubt that it's that many now but one never knows !

We have a max membership of 400 at Piedmont and always have 50 or so on the waiting list !
At Piedmont our annual turnover is about 30 . So as you can see there's a steady stream of people going and coming . But most of our new folks are coming from NOVA where as Rivanna may be picking their's up from the Richmond are I would think and possibly your direction into the valley !

Whats the membership at Shenandale and Stonewall now ?
I don't know about Shenandale but Stonewall has a limit of 150. I'm 2d or 3d on the waiting list now. Didn't expect to get in for a year or two. Might get in next year. Wife is interested in shooting skeet but Stonewall only has trap. Might have to join there, too!

I do not know if they have waiting list or not ?

Here at Piedmont we cutoff at 400 and there are about 50 waiting . I would suggest you join here but you'll wait atleast 2 years . If you want a Piedmont application let me know and I'll send you one !

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Mon Apr 18, 2011 7:46 pm

Finally made it to the range today after dinner !

The Contender is doing okay with the Lyman 429215 and RCBS 44-225 GC SWC . It however isn't showing any great improvement with the Castboolits 434-207GC , I may try that one with H4198 later this week !

Didn't get any RD 432-265's loaded up with XMP5744 either , might try that one as well .

6pt-sika · Post by **6pt-sika** » Thu Apr 21, 2011 8:09 pm

Well I made it out to the range this afternoon !

Shot a couple 444 rifles first !

Got my Marlin circa 1975 Second Model 444 sighted in with the Lyman 429640 pushed with 50 grains of H322 .
Then went to my circa 2001 Marlin 444 . Shot the Mountain Molds 433-400GC with 43 grains of Varget first and it was doing okay . Then I tried the BRP/RD 432-400GC pushed with 37 grains of RL-7 , that one put 3 shots in exactly one inch !
Shot a couple more groups with both loads later and none were better then that 1" group !

Then I got out the Contender !
Tried the Castboolits 434=207GC first with H4198 and it didn't do any better . Next came the Lyman 429215 with 47 grains of H322 and those 3 shots were in 7/8's of an inch . The same bullet with 48 grains of H322 was almost as good !
Then I tried the RCBS 44-225GC SWC again with 45 and 46 grains of H322 . The 46 grain load was as good as the last trip and 45 grains did no better . I had also loaded the RCBS 44-225 with two different loads of H4198 , but they didn't show me much .

So next trip we will go with the Lyman 429215 with 47 and 48 grains of H322 as well as the RCBS 44-225GC SWC with 46 grains of H322 !