Light Loads - Unique vs Winchster 244 - Questions

[ikocher]

I'm back to doing research for light plinking loads for various calibers again. Previously, every time I started down this path, I inevitably end up seeing suggestions or posts on the various forums where someone used whatever caliber and a level of Unique powder. For example, a small game load for .30-06 might be a small charge of Unique along with a lead round ball. Not that this is what I'm doing but it's an example.

The problem is getting Unique but it keeps coming up as a good choice for light weight plinking loads for the likes of .38 Special and .30-30.

The burn rate chart shows that Winchester's 244 has a similar rate compared to Unique but I don't know if I could actually use 244 as a substitute in this case. I assume that ball vs flake will come into play here.

Can anyone much more educated in this subject matter shed some light?

If context can help, I'm hunting down a decent subsonic plinking load that's as cheap as I can make it, for my Marlin 1894 in 357 mag (I have a suppressor on it) but so far, the best I have is a heavyweight 200 gr cast with some HS-6. The lightweight bullets (105 gr from Slippery Bullets) are supersonic with a similar charge but are excessively dirty using HS-6. Too much unburnt powder. Normally, I would use Trail Boss but I can't get that either. Every time I start doing research, I keep getting hits for Unique but I can't find Unique. I can, however, find Winchester 244 locally. Bullseye has come up but that's also Alliant. Getting it locally here in GA is tricky so I'd have to ship it. $90 for 1 lbs of powder isn't cheap.

My question is, will W244 be a good substitute for Unique? Is there anything that's just as good for 244 isn't going to work? I am open to suggestions including places I could go look around or ask questions on.

[GunnyMack]

With Alliant nonexistent look into Hodgon Universal. Supposedly their answer to Unique. Universal is 1 step slower than Unique. But again if you can find it...

[Griff]

I've not done any loading of the .30-30 with pistol powders, but have heard that light loads were quite satisfactory @ around 10 grains of Unique also. So, being curious, I looked up on Quick Load what that was predicted to produce. I looked at a 117 grain GC bullet from a Lyman mold and from my 26" bbl, they predicted the following:

30-30 Unique.jpg

My data list in QL (3/22) doesn't list Winchester WinClean 244, (might be a good excuse to update my data files), but does contain Hodgdon Universal. Note that the same powder charge gives a higher pressure and yet lower velocity:

30-30 Univeral.jpg

Maybe someone with a later data file can comment.

[Rimfire McNutjob]

I don't think W244 is in the latest powder file yet. The NECONOS guy should put an updated powder PDF up on his site.

Here's what I have as of June 2024.

[Glenn]

Try TiteGroup for "cat sneeze" loads. Not supposed to be position sensitive. Also works good in 223 with a 70 gr. cast bullet at about 1450 fps.
Glenn

[1894cfan]

All this is per Marlinowners.com lighter bullets in 30/30 thread (which microsoft has reported as unsafe)

45gr round ball 4.0gr 231
Lee soup can 113gr w/GC 7.5gr 231
Lee soup can 113gr w/GC 17.0gr 2400 @2,100fps
Lyman 311008 115gr PB 5.5gr 231
Lyman 311008 115gr PB 6.0gr Universal @1,150fps
Berry's 150gr 23.0gr Varget
30carbine bullet (all) 8.0gr 231 @1400-1500fps
30carbine bullet (all) 9.0gr Trail Boss

I've tried all of the above loads in my Win 94 30/30 with no problems. YMMV HTH

Sorry about the Trail Boss load. Picked up a couple cases when it was still available several years ago.

[Rockrat]

There was a post on another forum about subsonic 30-30 loads using the 170gr Sub-x bullet and Titegroup was mentioned. Friend uses it in his 38 special 105gr bullet loads. Think he is only running around 850fps out of his Ruger.

[ikocher]

Try TiteGroup for "cat sneeze" loads. Not supposed to be position sensitive. Also works good in 223 with a 70 gr. cast bullet at about 1450 fps.
Glenn

Titegroup was on my list of powders to play with. Sounds like I just need to buy both and keep on testing.

I wish we could get Trail Boss still.

[ikocher]

I tried to grab a bottle of Titegroup from the local Academy but they were out. On the way back from our 4th of July vacation, we stopped at the Bass Pro in Lawrenceville. They did have the 244 so I got a bottle.

The load data shows that 38 Special and 105 grain bullets is 4.1 to 4.4 grains of powder with a max velocity of 724 or so. It would work just right for the subsonic, suppressed rifle load I'm looking for. It's also nice that I didn't have to pay HAZMAT fees so we're looking at 2.2 cents per charge.

I'll try to load up some .38 Special and see if we have a winner.

[wvfarrier]

I have been shepherding my last two containers of Unique since it has become unibtainium. I use it in 30-30, 45-70, 38, 45 colt and 45 acp

[Griff]

I believe that silver & red can is the last 1lb can of Unique I bought. However, since 2013 when this shot was taken,

there's much more in there. Including a 8lb jug of Unique. But, it doesn't get used much, I think I've only filled that 1 lb can once since I bought the bulk can. I like having only 1 lb of powder out on the bench at a time and just the powder I'm using at the time. As of the last time I looked, there isn't any room for any more powder in that refrigerator, except on the BP shelf. A few more cans of the Goex "Cartridge" have been used!

[horsesoldier03]

Not sure what gun you are shooting these in, but if it is rated for +P you can go up to 6.2 grains.

[ikocher]

Not sure what gun you are shooting these in, but if it is rated for +P you can go up to 6.2 grains.

They are being launched from the thing on the right. The goal is quietness and cheapness.





I followed the Hodgdon RLDC information and loaded a batch of test rounds. All but 1 round were subsonic with 105 grain cast. Too bad they don't have load data for stuff like 30-30 but plenty for the common pistol calibers. I assume that's based on prior people's experimentation with Unique.


https://www.youtube.com/shorts/sPb4cXgPEbs