AK-47s

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 6:30 am

I know some of you don't care for the AKs and their variants, but I've had at least one, off and on since I was a teenager. Just thought they were cool, like the cartridge and all but one of them worked every time I pulled the trigger. I didn't even own an AR-15 until I was in my late twenties.
My favorite was a Zastava with an under folding stock and milled receiver. It was a well made, hefty carbine that was a blast to shoot. Unfortunately, that one got caught up in the Purge, while I was in the hospital. I've seen a few over the last couple of years, but they have been going for big bucks. I've bought a couple AKs since, but they were junk.
About a month ago I stumbled across a new one from Atlantic Firearms made from Romanian and US parts. The ALG trigger group is outstanding!
Got it out to the range Monday and it ran flawlessly. I forgot to take a picture of the target with the 123 gr JHP ammo, the group was about half the size of the 154s.

Local shop had the Sig dot sight on sale for $99 so I stuck one on there. Not a huge fan of the red dot sights, but it works well enough. Probably going to get a side mount and standard optic for it. Targets just aren't as clear as they used to be.

jb

Scott Tschirhart · Post by **Scott Tschirhart** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 7:22 am

An AK is a reliable tool. I think they are cool as well.

wvfarrier · Post by **wvfarrier** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 7:40 am

Ive always felt the Galil was a better variant of the AK than the original but they are reliable weapons

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 8:23 am

If you're going all out, might as well run with the big dogs and get a Valmet.

jb

piller · Post by **piller** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 8:34 am

I have fired a good SKS, and with handloads it gives 3 inch groups at 100 yards on a consistent basis. The SKS and the AK-47 are not target rifles, but they are proven to be reasonably effective and mostly reliable to the point of never needing to think about it. For under 100 yards and deer or pigs, it is just fine. I have carried an M16, and it is not what I would choose for deer size game. Plenty accurate, but the bullet shape is not good for that hunting style for me.
No experience with the other rifles mentioned.

Pisgah · Post by **Pisgah** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 11:14 am

It's heavy, has poor ergonomics and so-so accuracy, and is ugly as homemade sin -- but it is a machine that is absolutely as reliable as a rock, and that makes up for a lot.

Pisgah · Post by **Pisgah** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 11:15 am

It's heavy, has poor ergonomics and so-so accuracy, and is ugly as homemade sin -- but it is a machine that is absolutely as reliable as a rock, and that makes up for a lot.

Tycer · Post by **Tycer** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 12:07 pm

I can bang a 12x12 plate at 200 all day with Ulyanovsk Cartridge Works 8m3 and one Wolf 123grainer I don’t remember the part # at the moment. That’s from a Clinton era Bulgarian reman. There were a lot of bubbassembled guns made in the 90s-00s that were barely able to run. It’s my understanding that the current us assembled rifles are first rate. It’s a good platform, easy to run, easy to clean and man accurate to 300 with the 7.62x39 the 30WCF ballistic twin.

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 12:28 pm

GREAT topic, and nice gun too. I'm still kicking myself for not obtaining a few. I have an AR47 pistol with a side-charging upper and steel made-in-usa mags.

got this and got rid of my 30 blackout uppers because i could make that mistake.

ollogger · Post by **ollogger** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 1:34 pm

I think they are a worthy addition to any ones herd, i dont have a AK but have been on the
hunt for a mini 30, with no luck, since i turned 65 i found a greater need for more fire power
so in the last 2 years i picked up 2 mini 14s & one AR 15, cant belive i waited that long to try
a semi auto, been looking on gun broker at the new psa & pioneer AK 47, they seem worth the money
but not all that sure on that

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 1:58 pm

I've had two Mini-30s. Couldn't make either one shoot worth a snot. Even spent a considerable amount of cash on the last one, and still wasn't reliable enough for me to keep it around. Never had a problem with a Mini-14. My dad still has one my mom bought him in '83, probably a couple thousand rounds through that one.

I've had Egyptian MAADIs, a Hungarian AMD and a few others that all worked well. The one that put me off for a couple of years was a Riley Defense. My FFL friend and I both bought one, his works fine. Mine was a total thing. Each time I called the factory it was "try this" or Try that. Wouldn't exchange it for another. I could shoot circles around it with a '60s vintage, beat to snot, Chinese SKS.

Only one minor complaint with the new one, is it came with a US Palm magazine. Big, bulky and ugly piece of plastic. I have a couple dozen mags from around the world, like the Bulgarian production the best.

jb

piller · Post by **piller** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 2:58 pm

Sounds like reliability is a high priority for all of us.

Sarge · Post by **Sarge** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 7:40 pm

I've had three Romanians over the years and all were reliable. Re-cutting the crown helps them a bunch, a longer stock & better trigger in makes them lots more comfortable and decent sights make them easier to shoot well. For me the best combination is Zukhov furniture, the Red Star 2-stage trigger and Series 100 Tech sights with the A2 aperture. With that combination I could routinely keep five shots in 4-5 inches on my 200 yard plate using Tula FMJ.

I don't see 'sporting purpose' as having a role in the whether a particular firearm should be available to private citizens; and any honest reading of the Founder's statements on that topic makes it clear the Second Amendment was never about duck hunting. Of course this won't keep gun haters from asserting the AK and its progeny have no sporting purpose at all.

I happen to know better.

piller · Post by **piller** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 9:09 pm

Sarcasm mode on.
That deer was obviously killed by a weapon of war as it was going about its life. We must stop the slaughter!
Sarcasm mode off.

Nice looking deer.

kaschi · Post by **kaschi** » Thu Jun 23, 2022 9:59 pm

AK= Best, most reliable, self defense rifle make. 50+ million copies have been proving it for over seventy years.

marlinman93 · Post by **marlinman93** » Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:19 am

I've always appreciated the AK's and their variants, and thought they were great guns. But for some reason I've never owned one. I've had numerous SKS rifles when they were dirt cheap, and never hesitated to sell them if I had someone offer me a profit. I always figured they'd be on sale again and I'd buy another cheap. But they suddenly took a leap in prices, so stopped buying them.
I'd still like an AK just to own one, but with prices being so high now I doubt I'll want to pay the going rate.

3030 · Post by **3030** » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:05 pm

I think you can go on the Russian side in the Ukraine conflict and pick a slightly used one off the ground...just saying... :(

Tycer · Post by **Tycer** » Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:54 pm

3030 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:05 pm I think you can go on the Russian side in the Ukraine conflict and pick a slightly used one off the ground...just saying...

Or go to the Ukrainian side and pick up a nice Steyr AUG, M4, M14, SCAR…..

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Sun Jun 26, 2022 8:30 am

Good conversation, guys!

I was hesitant to post this, thought for sure someone would have something unpleasant to say. Happy to see I was wrong.

Of all the AKs I've had, this one is certainly the priciest of the bunch, but it also seems to be incredibly well made and had the features I was looking for. A solid folding stock and the scout rail handguard. The exceptional trigger is a definite bonus. It's no match rifle, I have those, but functions perfectly and Minute of Bowling Pin at 100 yds. is all I need.

jb

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Wed Jun 29, 2022 1:21 am

How can you say anything bad about it if it goes bang every time you pull the trigger. Beauty is a form of function.

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Wed Jun 29, 2022 6:25 am

.
I don't have the link handy, but there is a video of somebody taking a square bladed shovel and pounding it into shape to make a receiver then building an AK from that. It functioned...!

Here's a couple stories about it but I think it's possible the original YouTube video is taken down for being politically incorrect.

https://thechive.com/2012/12/06/apparen ... 25-photos/

https://hackaday.com/2012/11/25/beating ... -an-ak-47/

OldWin · Post by **OldWin** » Wed Jun 29, 2022 6:59 am

There are always those who complain about the AKs ergonomics and handling characteristics.
Usually, that is because they have not had the opportunity to carry a rifle in extreme cold, through deep snow, in heavy cover. This puts this weapons system in a whole new light. It is fantastic in these conditions, and can be easily used with Kinko insulated work gloves on. While the sights are crude by US standards, they don't clog with snow like an aperture can. Usually escaping notice and icing up.
While the AR is good at keeping contamination out, the mag release and selector are susceptible to freezing.
The AK mag release does not freeze. The selector can, but provides enough leverage to overcome it most times. Usually, only the fire control group will hinder operation if contaminated. It is usually remedied buy hand cycling or can be quickly cleared by removing the top cover.
This is a weapon designed to run in the cold. It has always been my practice to test any firearms reliability in cold. It is usually where problems will show up first.

A wheelbarrow full of mud, while an interesting YouTube video, is not a realistic reliability test IMO. The real test is constant exposure to the elements, with minimal and rudimentary maintenance, over extended periods of time. It's hard to make a 10 minute video of that. That is where the AK47 shines. However....that requires a properly constructed example. Something that is surprisingly rare in this country.

PriseDeFer · Post by **PriseDeFer** » Wed Jun 29, 2022 7:05 am

Like them or hate them, if you got one, don't ever sell it.

piller · Post by **piller** » Wed Jun 29, 2022 8:32 am

Right now, they are worth more than ever, and with magazines and ammo they are highly valuable.

CraigC · Post by **CraigC** » Thu Jun 30, 2022 9:46 am

During the unpleasantness of 2020, I decided to spend more time with defensive guns than the usual sixguns and levers. Built half a dozen AR's that year but was very late to the AK game. By the time I really wanted one, all the good imports had gone sky high. So I got one from PSA instead. It's been a good one. It has an excellent trigger, better than any out of the box AR. It's been reliable and is reasonably accurate. While it doesn't have the classic look of red wood and Bakelite, I love the Magpul furniture. I still think the AR is a better platform overall, I could absolutely get by with an AK if need be. It currently has a 1x prism optic and a better Streamlight weaponlight.

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Thu Jun 30, 2022 3:44 pm

Cool!

I looked at several of the PSAs. Had it narrowed down to one of theirs and the one I bought from Atlantic. The customer service at Atlantic has been fantastic over the years and that made the decision easier.
I've had it out a couple of times now and am quite pleased.

jb

CraigC · Post by **CraigC** » Fri Jul 01, 2022 9:36 am

I'd still like to have one of their 9mm versions, as a braced pistol. They seem like a really fun bullet hose, for times when you're in the mood for such a thing.

Tycer · Post by **Tycer** » Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:00 am

CraigC wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 9:36 am I'd still like to have one of their 9mm versions, as a braced pistol. They seem like a really fun bullet hose, for times when you're in the mood for such a thing.

The AK-47 platform doesn’t like being altered much. 7.62x39 is it’s favorite caliber. I’ve taken two day courses where every single non 7.62x39 and all of the bubbassembled rifles failed to run and needed the on-site armorer to make repairs to get them going again. I chose a Bulgarian for the same reason I chose a Colt AR. It has to run. Always. The Kel-Tec SUB-2000 would be my choice for 9x19.

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:43 am

The Kel-Tec SUB-2000 would be my choice for 9x19.

mine weighs a small fraction of the AK, it shoots straight. has 20 round mags. i think. and is much preferable to me for indoor use. i may put a green laser on it so i can shoot from any position. everything about it is easy. ugly and easy

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Fri Jul 01, 2022 11:18 am

Grizz wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:43 am
The Kel-Tec SUB-2000 would be my choice for 9x19.
mine weighs a small fraction of the AK, it shoots straight. has 20 round mags. i think. and is much preferable to me for indoor use. i may put a green laser on it so i can shoot from any position. everything about it is easy. ugly and easy

Mine uses any mag that fits a Glock...

They make nifty rail offsets that still allow folding:

Screenshot_20220701-121902~2.png

CraigC · Post by **CraigC** » Fri Jul 01, 2022 12:55 pm

The reviews on the 9mm version have been very good. For now, this is my favorite "subgun". Which uses the same mags as the 9mm AK. Actually that's PSA's 32rd magazine in the pic.

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:11 pm

Here's my 9mm / house gun(s).

They both feed anything and the MPX is deadly accurate.

jb

piller · Post by **piller** » Fri Jul 01, 2022 4:39 pm

My Sub 2000 is the .40 S&W cal version, old style handguard and sights. Uses Glock magazines for Glock model 22. Never had a failure of any kind. 50 yard accuracy is great. So far, it has only punched paper. Someday it needs to try the 180 grain bullets on pigs.

CraigC · Post by **CraigC** » Fri Jul 01, 2022 4:45 pm

Nice! The MPX is really the Cadillac. Probably the only thing that gives the MP5 a run for the money but also more modernized.

piller · Post by **piller** » Fri Jul 01, 2022 4:53 pm

Nothing at all wrong with the MP5. I just didn't have the funds at the time, and went with the Kel Tec. If something like the MPX comes along when I have the funds, it will join my group. I sort of like .40 S&W better than 9mm, and personal preference is not a reason to argue calibers. That said, 9mm has its uses. There seems to be one or two of them around here.

piller · Post by **piller** » Fri Jul 01, 2022 5:02 pm

Mini 30 rifles are not known for accuracy, but they are almost as reliable as an AK-47. The stainless version with an aftermarket barrel stiffener makes for a 3 inch group at 100 yards all day gun. Not exactly competition accuracy, but a deer or wild pig is not going to quibble about it. The old steel Russian ammo has never failed to feed or eject. It is reasonably compact, and carries well.

Tycer · Post by **Tycer** » Fri Jul 01, 2022 6:06 pm

piller wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 5:02 pm Mini 30 rifles are not known for accuracy, but they are almost as reliable as an AK-47. The stainless version with an aftermarket barrel stiffener makes for a 3 inch group at 100 yards all day gun. Not exactly competition accuracy, but a deer or wild pig is not going to quibble about it. The old steel Russian ammo has never failed to feed or eject. It is reasonably compact, and carries well.

I looked and looked but never found a definitive fix for the mini30 being such a random shooter. I had a friend with one. We tried everything to get that rifle to group. He switched to a MPX and never looked back.

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Fri Jul 01, 2022 6:36 pm

Tycer wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 6:06 pm
piller wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 5:02 pm Mini 30 rifles are not known for accuracy, but they are almost as reliable as an AK-47. The stainless version with an aftermarket barrel stiffener makes for a 3 inch group at 100 yards all day gun. Not exactly competition accuracy, but a deer or wild pig is not going to quibble about it. The old steel Russian ammo has never failed to feed or eject. It is reasonably compact, and carries well.
I looked and looked but never found a definitive fix for the mini30 being such a random shooter. I had a friend with one. We tried everything to get that rifle to group. He switched to a MPX and never looked back.

Similar experience here as well. I've had two, First one was years ago when the only option other than the 5 round factory magazines were promag. Put me off promag to this day and I gave up on the first one. The second one was just a couple years ago, put a ton of $ into it and still couldn't get it to feed, no matter what magazines I tried. Mini 14s are an entirely different animal. Not match grade, but reliable.

Brian, I'm happy to hear you got a good one. They are out there, but I give up. I have a beat to snot, '60s dated, Chinese SKS that has been one of the most reliable autoloaders I've ever had and it would shoot circles around the Rugers. The $65 I paid for it is almost absurd at this point.

I should add it to Jim T's Ugly Gun contest.

jb

CraigC · Post by **CraigC** » Sun Jul 03, 2022 11:56 am

Now that color cased SBH is a looker! I bought a secondhand Bowen cut to 5.5" that I really like but it's all blue.

2ndovc · Post by **2ndovc** » Sun Jul 03, 2022 1:22 pm

Sweet!

Bowen did mine, going on twenty years ago. Colors have faded a bit, and it's getting a little wear on it, but I rarely go anywhere without it.

jb

JimT · Post by **JimT** » Sun Jul 03, 2022 2:36 pm

2ndovc wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 6:36 pm The $65 I paid for it is almost absurd at this point.

They are one of those "shoulda bought more" .... J&G Sales has Chinese-made SKS's for sale ... fair condition $399.00 .... Good condition $499.00 .... I've seen 'em for a lot more.

Tycer · Post by **Tycer** » Sun Jul 03, 2022 4:43 pm

JimT wrote: ↑Sun Jul 03, 2022 2:36 pm They are one of those "shoulda bought more" ....

Those and the $80/1000 UCW 8m3 7.62x39. I blew through tons of that stuff. Wish I had more.