Intresting thought.

[Rifleman336]

I was reading in American Handgunner Magazine about a review of Rugers Redhawk 4" in .45LC (darn, I WANT ONE!). John Taffin wrote the artical. John Toffin wrote how he and Jim Taylor were shooting Ruger Blackhawks (with 71/2" barrels) with 300gr. heavy loads at a log cabin 800+ yards away. When they hit it, the rounds went through both sides of the cabin!


I was wondering I don't like keeping a large amount of diffent guns at home. And I was wondering does anybody have any experiance on shooting .357 magum cartriges out of a rifle to long distance, especally heaveier bulliet weights like 180 and 200 grain pills. Can it be dangerous to a human being at longer distances than the accepted 200 yards at the out side for dear?
Rifleman 336

[Hobie]

You are confusing "dangerous" as being the same as "humanely lethal" or "effective". You are also confusing humans and animals. If the idea is self-defence at a distance then any bullet still moving is dangerous to a human. No, you wouldn't use it on game but those rules don't apply so why consider them. However, you'd best be able to explain why you shot at somebody at over 800 yards distance.

In practical terms, I'm not going to see a rifleman at 800 yards who takes a concealed position and shoots at me. I'm going to be looking at dirt, the backside of a tree or something.

[El Chivo]

I haven't tried shooting my .357 more than 200 meters, but it still packs some punch. Anything that size that is still airborne is dangerous.

I wanted to bring up the issue of stability at long range. Someone was telling me about their 30-30 bullets tumbling sideways once they lose energy. It seems to me a .357 bullet wouldn't do that because they are by comparison short and fat.

So, would a short fat bullet be more deadly at long range than a long thin one?

[Old Ironsights]

"deadly" to what?

People with owies lie down and whine. Sometimes they die when the wound isn't "fatal".

Animals with owies run away and either heal or die. The wound MUST be "fatal" for them to die,

The object of Self Defense is to make the goblin lie down and whine.

The object of Hunting is to kill somthing before it runs away enough to hide.

Those require majorly different bullets, velocities and tactics.

[jnyork]

In metallic silhouette, the .357 Magnum knocks down the 55 pound rams with no problems to speak of.

Makes me wonder why we are talking about shooting at human beings at 200 yards with a levergun. Is that what we do here?

[Old Ironsights]

In metallic silhouette, the .357 Magnum knocks down the 55 pound rams with no problems to speak of.

Makes me wonder why we are talking about shooting at human beings at 200 yards with a levergun. Is that what we do here?

No, but it is an interesting discussion/question none the less.

Most folks think that an EBR is the end-all to be-all in Homeland Defense Rifles.

I prefer my .357 M92. Enough so I just sold my M4.

If I am forced to shoot 2 legged Predators at range, I have no real issues with using my .357. It will make goblins lie down and whine just fine.

[Gryphon Black]

If I have to look at the "goblin" through a scope to see him clearly enough, I don't see it as "defense". Any bad guy close enough to identify as a bad guy for certain is dangerously within effective range of a .357, especially if the bullet is 158gr or heavier. Especially if it's shot from a 20 or 24 inch barrel and was a "stoked up" load, but even garden variety factory loads with a reasonably heavy slug will do that job at "visually verifiable bad guy" ranges. I'm talkin' 100yds or less here.
If you're in a situation where it's open combat, with enemy troops advancing on your position, you have a very different situation, and the standard "personal defense" rules of engagement don't apply.

But that's just my uneducated opinion, talkin' right outa my hat!

gryphon

[Old Ironsights]

Look at my Handle... I don't use scopes. Somehow still shot Expert with my Peep & Post M16...

I won't shoot at game beyond 150yds. But you're danged skippy I'll plink away at BGs at more than that... especially with my 1886.

"Crank that sight up Vern... They're about 500yds out..."

[Andrew]

I believe that technically a .50 RB is "dangerous to a human being" out past 400yds.

I like the idea of using a 30-30 for the pupose you are proposing(no real particular reason other than availabity and reliabilty) unless you have a wheel gun campanion in the same caliber. Of course there is the BFR and you could use 2 different loads....wow, this is a good topic.

[Dewight]

We had a saying in Viet Nam, "If there is lead in the air, there is a danger there!"

[jnyork]

We had a saying in Viet Nam, "If there is lead in the air, there is a danger there!"

"If you aint scared, you dont understand the situation"!

[awp101]

However, you'd best be able to explain why you shot at somebody at over 800 yards distance.

Because he wouldn't get any closer...

OI, I don't plan on disposing of my friendly black rifles but I AM pondering which would be the better choice for an Urban Threat Lever Rifle: .357 or .44 Mag?

I already have the .357 but a .44 just calls to me so I can make a fair comparison.

[gundownunder]

If you're in a situation where it's open combat, with enemy troops advancing on your position, you have a very different situation, and the standard "personal defense" rules of engagement don't apply.

I would think that your in the wrong position and should bug out, and if the goblins are 800 yds away theres plenty of time.

I wouldn't discount the lethal ability of big lumps of lead falling out of the sky at a 30% angle, the 45-70 proves it works.

[Rifleman336]

I was just amazed to hear that a heavy .44mag or a .45LC could do like it's grandpa could the .45-70. I'm just amazed that it could do a man in at 800 yards!

My question is has anyone shot a large tree (over 8" around), at 600 to 800 yards away, with a .357 magnum heavy load of 158, 180, or 200gr bulliets. What was the result.

I won't be expecting the moon from it. It won't knock a man on his can. But he won't be doing the happy dance ethier. I know better than to shoot a deer at that distance. Just think to that scene in the made for TV movie "Lonesome Dove" When Robert Devul was being chased by bad guys and to make a long story short got into a gunfight using rifles Deval was using a pistol calibered Henery and when the bad guy was macking him be cause it appered his rifle could shoot the distacne. Deval flip up his ladder site and gave the head bad guy a new belly button!

I just like the idea that my cocealed 5 shot, my duty revolver and rifle can share the same pool of ammo.

But if the bigger calibers are the only ones then my problem becomes the concealed carry gun I don't know of any 5 shot revolvers on the market in .44 mag or .45LC.


Rifleman 336

[Gryphon Black]

I recommend you stick to the .357 and call it good. That round can do a lot if you load for it, and the supplies are plentiful. If you want urban tactical capability, 1894c with the 18.5 inch barrel. If you want longer range, cowboy rifle in 24 inch barrel.
Ken Waters says a .357 case stuffed full of 2400 works just as well in a rifle or pistol, and 180gr silhouette bullets will punch through walls, or carry the fight to the enemy waayy off.
And in a pinch, that rifle will eat any .357 or .38 off the shelf, some of the easiest-to-get ammo around.
And furthermore, you get to keep the carry pistol you're used to.

And get Steve to slick the action for you.

Gryphon