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I agree with Doug Giles that it is refreshing to see violent criminals stopped, but....
....is it safe/reasonable to shoot through your own windshield at the rear of a moving vehicle so far away....? I'd think the odds of success (stopping the vehicle by disabling it or severely injuring the driver, or slowing it by deflating a tire) would be very minimal, given what I'd assume would have to be a huge potential deflection of the bullet by virtue of it hitting hard glass, at an angle, shortly after leaving the muzzle. The street was busy, and there were residential buildings behind the line of fire.
The other thing I noticed is what I fear I'd do in a life-and-death situation - trying to seat a magazine that is backwards....
Anyway, my extensive law enforcement background consists of watching Dirty Harry and the Longmire series, so I'm interested in what professionals would say about shooting through a windshield that close to the gun, and that far from the target.
It's 2025 - "Cutesy Time is OVER....!" [Dan Bongino]
Did I miss what the bad guy had done? Depending on the crime, the Officer might have been trying everything to prevent the perpetrator from getting away. I am waiting to find out before I pass judgement.
D. Brian Casady
Quid Llatine Dictum Sit, Altum Viditur.
Advanced is being able to do the basics while your leg is on fire---Bill Jeans
Don't ever take a fence down until you know why it was put up---Robert Frost
It would still suck if your wife or kid were 'collateral damage', unless it were truly a bad-guy worth sacrificing their life to get arrested (and probably turned loose anyway ).
Did I miss what the bad guy had done? Depending on the crime, the Officer might have been trying everything to prevent the perpetrator from getting away. I am waiting to find out before I pass judgement.
Yep. Big difference between 'terrorist with a bomb' versus 'owes child support'...hopefully NOT a 'prohibition' crime (you'd think we'd have learned by now ).
It's 2025 - "Cutesy Time is OVER....!" [Dan Bongino]
He obviously never watched "The Box O Truth" (or any other "windshield deflection of bullets" video) or learned that shooting at the rear of a leading vehicle is essentially pointless unless you are shooting a .308.
He also totally borked his reload.
I'm just glad he didn't die the while fumbling with his gun after opening his door.
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough. מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976 Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
There's a thread running on Facebook about this shooting with several hundred comments. It runs from "Yeah, that guy got huge balls" to "what a moron, shooting through a windshield while driving one handed in a neighborhood". I'm normally pro-LEO, but this guy acted irresponsibly and seemingly out of an uncontrolled rage...
Mike
Vocatus atque non vocatus, Deus aderit...
I've learned how to stand on my own two knees...
I dont give a rat's patootie if he acted safely, reasonably, responsibly or whatever. One bad guy is dead, one in the hospital jail ward, officer goes home to his family, nobody else hurt. Good shoot as far as I'm concerned.
I am not a police officer but I DO watch "Live PD" on TV every Saturday night.
I dont give a rat's patootie if he acted safely, reasonably, responsibly or whatever. One bad guy is dead, one in the hospital jail ward, officer goes home to his family, nobody else hurt. Good shoot as far as I'm concerned.
True, but if he did the exact SAME thing, only the bullets went a different path, and killed your ten-year-old kid, would you still be as happy...???
I know, that DIDN'T happen, but he sure took some risks of harming innocents. Since the bad guys were shooting at him and the other cop or whoever, one could argue that terminating THAT activity, even if risky, justified the risk.
One of those glad-I'm-not-a-cop situations. No really good answer.
It's 2025 - "Cutesy Time is OVER....!" [Dan Bongino]
Shooting out through the windshield is a known technique now, and many departments train for it with old cars or damaged windshields to get people used to it. Its an effective method when used in its place. As one person that has experience with it commented "it works best if you can shoot mostly through the same hole", though thats not always possible.
Shooting through windshield glass, mostly from the outside in, is one of the bullet test parameters of modern pistol and carbine ammo. The better grade bonded ammo will hold together and not break up, and will also expand and penetrate ballistics test gell well. The m193 and 855 dont do very well on windshields, as many seem to assume for whatever reason.
Good discussion of the event, and another one on vid with another suspect shjooting at the officer behind him, he returns fire with his carbine through the windshield.
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs even though checkered by failure, than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much because they live in the gray twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat." -Theodore Roosevelt-
Isnt it amazing how many people post without reading the thread?
The problem is not so much that the bullet will break up (which they can) but that the POA/POI is radically altered by the slope of the barrier (glass).
When coupled with the fact that any bullet that was on a "correct" trajectory would also have to pass through the entire length of a full size SUV before having an infinitesimal chance of hitting the driver or gunnner?...
Meh.
Tactics and ballistics are apparently not a part of training.
Then, couple that with a HK reload?
Much training needed...
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough. מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976 Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
I wouldn't criticize his reloading technique all that much. You don't know how much adrenaline affects your motor skills until you've experienced that particular "rush". Mag holders sometimes place magazines so that the toe of the mag points in two different directions... IMHO, they might look "cool", but... if you don't practice with that setup a LOT, that mag swap might just be result for most folks. I also noted that he'd just swapped gun hands... I wonder how often that'd been practiced in a stress situation?
Griff,
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession! AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
That last one was just unfortunate. Playing armchair quarterback to it is difficult. I do hope that the person who was shooting at the cops is found guilty of contributing to the death of the victim, and that he never sees the outside of a prison again.
D. Brian Casady
Quid Llatine Dictum Sit, Altum Viditur.
Advanced is being able to do the basics while your leg is on fire---Bill Jeans
Don't ever take a fence down until you know why it was put up---Robert Frost
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