If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
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If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
He was at 65 yards standing broadsided . The 44wcf took out both lungs with complete penetration and he was down in 20 yards . I fired 1 shot and it hit the right spot . The weather was nice temp was mid 30's and I was hunting from a stand about 15 foot high
Rowdy Fulcher Cas City
Here's a test I did with an original b.p. factory round after replacing the dead primer...
24+" penetration nice mushroom!
1875 Winchester Catalog testimonials...a few of many!
..."I have fully tested the late improved Winchester Rifle and take pleasure in stating that it is the best rifle I have ever used. I have killed a number of deer, at distances from one to two hundred yards and in every instance, the bullet passed clean through the body."
..."The killing qualities, at large game, is all that could be desired, to the wonder and admiration of the guides and sportsmen who saw its working during my visit to the Adirondack woods last fall."
..."I can say for one, that I think the Winchester Model of 1873 is the best firearm now in use for hunting and sporting; they give the best satisfaction to everyone that has used them here. James Gary and C.S. Martin have killed 17 bears and 100 deer since the first of September with Model 1873.
AMEN!
w30wcf
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aka Jack Christian SASS 11993 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Philippians 4:13
aka w44wcf (black powder)
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.22 WCF, .30 WCF, .44 WCF Cartridge Historian
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Looks like a very nice buck & rifle!!
for the last 8 years ive been taking a gun hunting that has not shot game for me, this year its the
44-40 & 38-55s turn
Brad
for the last 8 years ive been taking a gun hunting that has not shot game for me, this year its the
44-40 & 38-55s turn
Brad
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
You hunt water jugs?
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Great post, thanks!
Ive not had great interest in the 44 WCF in the past, the larger rounds and the 30 WCF have mainly held my interest, though recently Ive had much more interest in the 44 Winchester round. The bunged up shoulder and back may have some bearing on that. Hoping one day I can aquire another 44 WCF in a 73 carbine.
Anyone have any Lyman 310 dies in 44-40 theyd turn loose of?
Ive not had great interest in the 44 WCF in the past, the larger rounds and the 30 WCF have mainly held my interest, though recently Ive had much more interest in the 44 Winchester round. The bunged up shoulder and back may have some bearing on that. Hoping one day I can aquire another 44 WCF in a 73 carbine.
Anyone have any Lyman 310 dies in 44-40 theyd turn loose of?
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs even though checkered by failure, than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much because they live in the gray twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat." -Theodore Roosevelt-
Isnt it amazing how many people post without reading the thread?
Isnt it amazing how many people post without reading the thread?
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Nice, this trumps all thoughts and theories on what the "older" weak cartridges can do! Nice rack, how was the meat?
30/30 Winchester: Not accurate enough fer varmints, barely adequate for small deer; BUT In a 10" to 14" barrelled pistol; is good for moose/elk to 200 yards; ground squirrels to 300 metres
250 Savage... its what the 223 wishes it could be...!
250 Savage... its what the 223 wishes it could be...!
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Congrats John! Nice looking buck!
Griff,
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
I got this doe with my 38 55 last seasonollogger wrote:Looks like a very nice buck & rifle!!
for the last 8 years ive been taking a gun hunting that has not shot game for me, this year its the
44-40 & 38-55s turn
Brad
Gonna use my 38 56 this year
My son said he's goin to use his 1873 in 44 40 a bit this year also
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
thank you for picture and post..
both of you. I feel we need good examples of hunting
and teaching us truth of the old rounds..
both of you. I feel we need good examples of hunting
and teaching us truth of the old rounds..
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
man said stopped 4 jug critters one shot!!!!!MrMurphy wrote:You hunt water jugs?
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
w30wcf, that's the best post I've seen in ages......
Whatever you do always give 100%........... unless you are donating blood.
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Agreegamekeeper wrote:w30wcf, that's the best post I've seen in ages......
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Good post Jack-0!.........but you already knew the killing qualities of the 44.
BTW, I picked up a F.O.92 in 44 and a F.O. 94 in 30 yesterday from a neighbor (74 years old) down the street who I never knew he played with guns. They were bought new by his grandfather in 1908 and 1916. Been in the attic of the same house they were originally in since as long as he can remember. He never remembers anyone shooting or handling them and he has lived there since being born....family owned house since the 1880's..... Very, very dirty.
I'll make a post in a week or so after cleaning and testing out.--------6
BTW, I picked up a F.O.92 in 44 and a F.O. 94 in 30 yesterday from a neighbor (74 years old) down the street who I never knew he played with guns. They were bought new by his grandfather in 1908 and 1916. Been in the attic of the same house they were originally in since as long as he can remember. He never remembers anyone shooting or handling them and he has lived there since being born....family owned house since the 1880's..... Very, very dirty.
I'll make a post in a week or so after cleaning and testing out.--------6
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Wow six, that's all but winning the lottery
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Great post - thank your for info and photos!
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Sixgun wrote:Good post Jack-0!.........but you already knew the killing qualities of the 44.
BTW, I picked up a F.O.92 in 44 and a F.O. 94 in 30 yesterday from a neighbor (74 years old) down the street who I never knew he played with guns. They were bought new by his grandfather in 1908 and 1916. Been in the attic of the same house they were originally in since as long as he can remember. He never remembers anyone shooting or handling them and he has lived there since being born....family owned house since the 1880's..... Very, very dirty.
I'll make a post in a week or so after cleaning and testing out.--------6
I'm sure he does but us living world gun mags need hear and see it. you cannot hunt deer here SD with 38wcf 44wcf . F.O. ????? we do need pictures
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Gregg,
FO means full octagon. It will be a few days...the better half has me painting. I hATE to paint. Then the old crow wants every room a different color. I'm supposed to be newly retired.----6
FO means full octagon. It will be a few days...the better half has me painting. I hATE to paint. Then the old crow wants every room a different color. I'm supposed to be newly retired.----6
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
I have never fired a .44-40, and all I know is what I have read about it. It was considered to be a great round by the writers from back in the late 1800s. It seems to me that the bolt action rifles and the faster calibers of WWI sort of pushed it off of the front pages. That is probably due to a lot of advertising dollars. At the distances in woodland cover where most whitetail deer hang out, there really doesn't seem to be any reason that the.44-40 wouldn't continue to work quite well. I guess that the deer in the post by 30wcf doesn't know it wasn't killed by a magnum in a bolt action.
D. Brian Casady
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Quid Llatine Dictum Sit, Altum Viditur.
Advanced is being able to do the basics while your leg is on fire---Bill Jeans
Don't ever take a fence down until you know why it was put up---Robert Frost
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Great post
"I own but one levergun, a Winchester 94, 30-30 circa 1976"
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Awesome post! Good to see old Winchesters doing what they should be doing!
A man can never have too many WINCHESTERS...
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Very nice buck sir. Excellent choice in weapons. I enjoy collecting my meat in a similar fashion.
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Sixgun wrote:Gregg,
FO means full octagon. It will be a few days...the better half has me painting. I hATE to paint. Then the old crow wants every room a different color. I'm supposed to be newly retired.----6
Thank You. .FO I get it.. Please hurry with that paint brush Dear... We do need pictures
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Guys,
Thank you for the kind words. Another fellow, Rowdy Fulcher over at Cas City, is the one who harvested that nice buck in 2014.
Last year, he took another one with the .44-40 with the same one shot performance.
Six,
Nice find! I'm sure you will be a great parent! It sounds like your wife was counting the days until you retired during which time she worked on her list of things for you to do. I don't like painting either and wallpapering I like even less!
Have fun!
w30wcf
Thank you for the kind words. Another fellow, Rowdy Fulcher over at Cas City, is the one who harvested that nice buck in 2014.
Last year, he took another one with the .44-40 with the same one shot performance.
Six,
Nice find! I'm sure you will be a great parent! It sounds like your wife was counting the days until you retired during which time she worked on her list of things for you to do. I don't like painting either and wallpapering I like even less!
Have fun!
w30wcf
aka John Kort
aka Jack Christian SASS 11993 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Philippians 4:13
aka w44wcf (black powder)
NRA Life member
.22 WCF, .30 WCF, .44 WCF Cartridge Historian
aka Jack Christian SASS 11993 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Philippians 4:13
aka w44wcf (black powder)
NRA Life member
.22 WCF, .30 WCF, .44 WCF Cartridge Historian
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Nice post. There is no denying the effectiveness of the early lever rifles. I chose a 32-20 with the same attributes, rifles made to handle stubby lead bullets, flat noses, necked and tapered case for excellent feeding, well suited to iron sights, sure reads like a dandy hunting rifle.
I think one thing that gets missed, not by this group, is the superior terminal performance of big bullets, specially lead, with some respectable weight.
I think one thing that gets missed, not by this group, is the superior terminal performance of big bullets, specially lead, with some respectable weight.
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Thank you for this [post. It's very educational on both the round and the ranges it's used at.
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
A great source of dedicated info. for fans of the model 73
http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index. ... oard=109.0
http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index. ... oard=109.0
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
A solid report, and thank you for the original cartridge test and the excellent photos of the lethal payload. They knew what they were doing.
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Nice Buck, but not surprised, the .44WCF. has been killing North American big game since 1873
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
By the time the smokeless 30 WCF was developed, the black powder lead bullet 44 WCF had already wipe out most of the deer in North America, as well as larger game.
Last edited by 765x53 on Mon Aug 29, 2016 7:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Man........... You Guys are a bunch of I'll informed old Geezers,....... at least get into the 20th century and hunt with a 7mm mag. .
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Probably some truth in the "old Geezers" part of that..45colt wrote:Man........... You Guys are a bunch of I'll informed old Geezers,....... at least get into the 20th century and hunt with a 7mm mag. .
"I'll informed" not so much.
We've just had enough time on this planet to first handedly come to the conclusion the old Geezers of long ago were right.
And fortunately we still have some of their rifles to continue to prove their point.
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
I love all the old ones, just had to stir the soup a little.... .
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
[quote=".45colt"]I love all the old ones, just had to stir the soup a little.... .[/q
Love the " at least get into the 20th century "............
Love the " at least get into the 20th century "............
Whatever you do always give 100%........... unless you are donating blood.
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Been there, done that... love the 30WCF more... both as a fun cartridge & far less meat damage..45colt wrote:Man........... You Guys are a bunch of I'll informed old Geezers,....... at least get into the 20th century and hunt with a 7mm mag. .
Griff,
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There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
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There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
My 30wcf kills deer dead just like my .45 caplock Kentucky rifle and the 38-55. So how much deader will the 7mm mag kill them???
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
If you kill them dead enough, next season their surviving offspring will walk up to your front door and fall over dead too.JerryB wrote:My 30wcf kills deer dead just like my .45 caplock Kentucky rifle and the 38-55. So how much deader will the 7mm mag kill them???
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מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Congrats on both the rifle & deer. I remember a saying from long ago, which goes, "There've been more deer, legal & illegal, & more men, good & bad, killed by the .44WCF than any other cartridge, at least until the .30-30 was introduced. And as far as killin 4 jug critters with one shot, I remember a movie from the late '50s called "Villa Rides" with yul Brynner as Pancho; Charles Bronson as his right hand man; & Robert Mitchum as a mercenary pilot. Reason I bring it up is that Villa's men didn't have an abundance of ammo, so Bronson took 4 men who were to be given the firing squad, lined them up one behind the other; took out his .45Colt hogleg & killed all 4 with one bullet. Talk about penetration!!! jd45
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Glad to see the 44 W.C.F. (aka 44-40) is getting its due respect! A couple years ago, I took a nice, fat doe with my original Winchester 1874 44 W.C.F shipped in 1889. The load was 18 gr of 5744 under an Accurate Moulds 200 gr soft cast bullet for a velocity of about 1,250 fps at 30 degrees F. The shot was at about 35 yards broadside. The bullet went clean through both lungs, exited the far side, and kept on truckin'. Here is a photo of the doe and '73, with the entrance wound this side up.
Kirk: An old geezer who loves the smell of freshly turned earth, old cedar rail fences, wood smoke, a crackling fireplace on a snowy evening, pristine wilderness lakes, the scent of
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cedars and a magnificent Whitetail buck framed in the semi-buckhorn sights of a 120-year old Winchester.
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
the only problem with that set up, HERE in the PRK (Peoples Republik of Kaliphornia) is we can no longer hunt with lead bullets...
other wise it looks really cool.
other wise it looks really cool.
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
This was posted on another forum by a hunter who lives in Minnesota.
Well, I had success this weekend with the 44-40. It had been raining and sleeting for two days. I was not using my deer stand, because the deer were not moving. I was still hunting and pushing the marshes and watering holes. I pushed this 6 point out and he went up into some higher ground and pines. When I worked my way to the pines I spotted him again. The shot was from 75 yards and in thick cover. The whole buck was not visible due to trees.
I could see the rack and left front quarter between two 4" pine trees. We were both looking at each other and I knew I had very little time before he'd be gone. I thought about all the practice shots with this rifle for the last nine months and lined the old Marlin up. I aimed a little high due to the range. One shot from the 44-40 and he just dropped. I cycled the action and waited for any movement. Retrieved my brass and I'm a very happy Hunter.
He reported that the shot did go completely through the deer. He was using a cast 200 gr. RNFP .430" dia. 14.3 BHN loaded to original factory ballistics of about 1,300 f.p.s.
Well, I had success this weekend with the 44-40. It had been raining and sleeting for two days. I was not using my deer stand, because the deer were not moving. I was still hunting and pushing the marshes and watering holes. I pushed this 6 point out and he went up into some higher ground and pines. When I worked my way to the pines I spotted him again. The shot was from 75 yards and in thick cover. The whole buck was not visible due to trees.
I could see the rack and left front quarter between two 4" pine trees. We were both looking at each other and I knew I had very little time before he'd be gone. I thought about all the practice shots with this rifle for the last nine months and lined the old Marlin up. I aimed a little high due to the range. One shot from the 44-40 and he just dropped. I cycled the action and waited for any movement. Retrieved my brass and I'm a very happy Hunter.
He reported that the shot did go completely through the deer. He was using a cast 200 gr. RNFP .430" dia. 14.3 BHN loaded to original factory ballistics of about 1,300 f.p.s.
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Kirk,
Nice!
cshold,
Thank you for the story and pic. I recognize him from the Marlin forum.
Here's one going back to 1878....
w30wcf
Nice!
cshold,
Thank you for the story and pic. I recognize him from the Marlin forum.
Here's one going back to 1878....
w30wcf
aka John Kort
aka Jack Christian SASS 11993 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Philippians 4:13
aka w44wcf (black powder)
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aka Jack Christian SASS 11993 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Philippians 4:13
aka w44wcf (black powder)
NRA Life member
.22 WCF, .30 WCF, .44 WCF Cartridge Historian
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
late 1800's...
I'll bet a lot of these deer were harvested with the grand ole .44 W.C.F. aka 44-40...
w30wcf
I'll bet a lot of these deer were harvested with the grand ole .44 W.C.F. aka 44-40...
w30wcf
aka John Kort
aka Jack Christian SASS 11993 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Philippians 4:13
aka w44wcf (black powder)
NRA Life member
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aka Jack Christian SASS 11993 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Philippians 4:13
aka w44wcf (black powder)
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
So.......
Did anyone harvest a deer this year with the vintage .44-40?
I do know that Rowdy got another one this year. Not as big as the one shown in the 1st post but another 1 shot kill with the '73 and black powder.
http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index. ... tach=57961
w30wcf
Did anyone harvest a deer this year with the vintage .44-40?
I do know that Rowdy got another one this year. Not as big as the one shown in the 1st post but another 1 shot kill with the '73 and black powder.
http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index. ... tach=57961
w30wcf
aka John Kort
aka Jack Christian SASS 11993 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Philippians 4:13
aka w44wcf (black powder)
NRA Life member
.22 WCF, .30 WCF, .44 WCF Cartridge Historian
aka Jack Christian SASS 11993 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Philippians 4:13
aka w44wcf (black powder)
NRA Life member
.22 WCF, .30 WCF, .44 WCF Cartridge Historian
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Not read every comment but will say, you can not beat a soft lead bullet at a moderate velocity period.
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
If a 22 LR will kill just about any reasonable large animal, the 25-20 will as well( I shot a few deer with mine) so will 32 s&w so there is no reason why the 44/40 can't & won't do it better! Just hit the animal RIGHT and lights out.
Great topic , the proof is in the pictures!
The train load of deer is a bit disturbing, we really didn't know better did we. About 15 years ago I can remember seeing butcher shops here almost that crowded!
The old rimmed rounds work no doubt about it!
Great topic , the proof is in the pictures!
The train load of deer is a bit disturbing, we really didn't know better did we. About 15 years ago I can remember seeing butcher shops here almost that crowded!
The old rimmed rounds work no doubt about it!
BROWN LABS MATTER !!
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Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
I didn't get this one this year, but it is another nice doe I took with a Winchester Model 53 44-40 several years ago. The cast bullet left the barrel at around 1,500 fps, hit the doe between the eyes, went through the lower part of the brain, hit the spine just behind where it joined the skull and wrecked a few vertebrae, then deflected down the throat, travelled through the vitals and wound up somewhere in the lower bowels. It was roughly 28" penetration, which is pretty good considering all the bone it wrecked in the spine.
Kirk: An old geezer who loves the smell of freshly turned earth, old cedar rail fences, wood smoke, a crackling fireplace on a snowy evening, pristine wilderness lakes, the scent of
cedars and a magnificent Whitetail buck framed in the semi-buckhorn sights of a 120-year old Winchester.
Blog: https://www.kirkdurston.com/
cedars and a magnificent Whitetail buck framed in the semi-buckhorn sights of a 120-year old Winchester.
Blog: https://www.kirkdurston.com/
Re: If anyone has any doubts - 44WCF /44-40 on deer
Kirk that is a nice deer on the hood. Did you load it by yourself?
hayabusa
hayabusa