OT--Long Bow ignorance

[getitdone1]

Recently bought a used JD Berry custom long bow for a reasonable price. I am right eye dominant, shoot a sling shot left handed, shovel left handed, shoot right handed, play a guitar right handed. I call the nicest, most helpful sales person I've ever talked to at 3Rivers today and he tells me if I am right eye dominant then I HAVE to use a right handed bow. I am right eye dominant, period.

Well, the guy I bought this bow from evidently didn't know all he needed to know. We both knew I was right eye dominant and the bow was a left handed bow. He also sold me aluminum arrows with plastic fletching which the guy at 3Rivers said would not work well and this type of fletching was for compound bows not long bows or recurves.

Seller did not take charge cards so I gave him 50 down and will pick up in few days. Don't know whether to go through with this deal and try to make some money on the bow or ask him to refund my money. Really nice looking bow in excellent condition. 40# pull. Feels like 100# to me and I'm stronger than the average guy. Typical, I guess, for the beginner.

I bought a couple of items from the true expert at 3Rivers. They are on the internet. I've never experienced a nicer sales person and I've read that about 3Rivers many times on the internet. I may end-up buying a bow and arrows from them.

By the way, I read at the 3Rivers site that the primitive Hun-style bow shot arrows over 900 yds. 880 is a half mile. Wow!

Don McCullough

[kimwcook]

Personally I'd think a right eye dominant person would need a left handed bow. Because as you draw you pull the string with your right hand to your right eye, which in turn you aim along the arrow to your target. I'm no expert and haven't shot a long bow since I was about 14, but that's the way I see it. Oh, sighting a long bow is different than say a composition bow. You'll get some real advice soon.

[Hobie]

A right handed shooter holds the bow in the left hand and draws the arrow with the right. I use plastic fletch with my Bear recurve (55 lb. draw weight at about 27") on aluminum shafts (2217 IIRC) Bear broadheads (sans the "bleaders"). Works just fine. Keep shooting and 40 lbs will become an easy draw.

[win38-55]

I dont know what to tell you on the bow. I am right handed,right eye dominate and shoot a right Handed bow.
A righty will hold the Bow in there left hand. And draw with there right. using there right eye for aiming.
It might be tough to sell a left handed long bow? Three Rivers archery is the best Traditional shop around.
If you get a chance stop by and visit there shop. it is open to the public.
If you cannot stop in just order online, they have the fastest shipping I have ever seen.
Back to the bow, I have a old bear cub longbow from the 50's that lets you shoot right or left handed.
Maybee you could find one of these on ebay and see if you like left handed or right handed shooting better.
Goo d luck.

[TWHBC]

I am left eye dominant and shoot a right handed recurve bow (actually several). Was the way I started a left handed bows were unknown when I started as a youngster. My Dad bought me my first bow.
Opposite of what you are describing, but the same concern.

I shoot a rifle, shotgun (left shoulder) and pistol as a lefty but can do everything but the shotgun as a righty (meaning right shoulder), but it takes a lot of thinking and is slower to do this.

The only thing I have ever encountered is that I shoot instinctive, rather than any type of sights, as you need to have your eye and hand coordination the same to use a sight. Some of the compounds have a rear sight on the string used in combination with the pins of the front sight on the bow.

There are books out there that explain the instinctive method in detail but check out Traditional Bowhunter magazine for good articles and a list of suppliers of tradtional gear and methods.

My experience and references from others with 3 Rivers Archery is very good

[rjohns94]

I shoot a longbow, and have for the last 40 years. I shoot about 100 arrows a day with my longbow. I am right handed and right eye dominant. If you shoot instinctive, then you look down the arrow shaft with your dominant eye. There is no doubt you will grow into the left handed bow, but I would recommend the right handed bow. that or close your right eye and shoot the left handed. The folks at three rivers are awesome. As for fletching, I would not shoot anything but feathers from a longbow. Recurves are centercut, longbows are not. plastic fletching does not give on a longbow. You need to shoot feathers on a longbow. The recurves are much more forgiving with their center cut shelf. You can shoot any shaft material you want in a longbow. But spining is most important. Generally, the heavier the better. My longbow shoots graphite arrows fast (with feathers) and very well. It shoots heavy cedar shafts better. You can use alum. shafts but I'm not sure why you would want to. IF they get nicked, dented or damaged, they stop flying well. I would use cedar for big game hunting. I use graphite for shooting aerial targets.

[getitdone1]

Just now read that the famous bow hunter, Fred Bear, was right eye dominant but shot left handed. Is this true? If so I'm guessing he didn't aim but shot instinctively like you would with a sling shot. Do believe I saw a picture of him pulling the string back with his left hand.

Just how common is this? Surely for good target shooting--to be competitive/aim properly--you'd have to shoot a right hand bow if right eye dominant and vice versa.

From what I read, Fred Bear was great and Howard Hill was THE GREATEST. Fred a used recurve and Howard a long bow. To my knowledge the two greatest names in archery--well.......in America. With the newer style long bows don't believe the recurve has as much advantage these days. I'm new to this but learning and know, just like guns, there's no end to the learning.

Don

[geobru]

I started shooting recurves in about 1964, and shot a right hand bow in spite of the fact that I am left eye dominant. It probably took longer to learn to shoot looking across the arrow rather than down the shaft, but after a lot of practice, anything inside of 25 yards was in trouble, and out to about 40, I would take the shot. I never did shoot with sights, and I learned to shoot instinctively with the bow.

[Bruce]

getitdone1,

According to many sources (including his son-in-law Charlie Kroll), Fred shot left handed because he developed a bad case of target panic shooting right handed. Target panic is a curse (I personnely know this) and you don't even want anyone to explain it too you because it is that contagious. Never try to learn to shoot fast.

I have personnaly held many of Howard's bows, including his only known surviving Snake Wood self bow (from his Miami Fla. days). I have his books and even have a copy of his notes on making bows that was never published. The books written by Fred and Howard (and about them) are excellent reading. Some of the old short films with Howard hunting and shooting are beyond belief.

I still have a (modern) custom made Hill long bow that I can not shoot because of TP.

[getitdone1]

Boy, there's some outstanding responses here! Thank you all.

rjohns94:

You've been shooting a long bow for 40 years, 100 arrows a day and arial targets. Pretty impressive. Good to see you agree with the sales person at 3Rivers about feather fletching being best with a long bow. I'm wondering how powerful your bow is? I'm also wondering about using a bow over 40 pounds so I won't, later, have to buy another more powerful bow. Expect just about all knowledgeable archers would tell me to stick with the 40 pounder as a beginner. But, I think this applies more to aiming/target shooting than to instinctive shooting. Seems like you could start with a too heavy pull and just take your time until you could pull it back the limit and still shoot accurately.

I know most of you know this but there's some great bow hunting videos on YouTube. Trick shooting too. Even hunting with spears! Last night on YouTube I watched a guy kill a male lion with his bow. You'd think after being hit the first time the lion would be charging. Didn't happen and the lion stayed where he got hit and growled--he was going nowhere. Must be a lot more shock and killing power to an arrow than I and many people realize. The guy shot him one more time, well aimed, and that lion was done.

As many of you know, Howard Hill shot all kinds of big and dangerous game in Africa with his long bow. I read that Howard Hill took two 70 lb bows, held them side by side and pulled them BOTH back the limit. As most of you know there's videos of Howard and Fred Bear on YouTube.

Don

[getitdone1]

Well I just got through watching a Fred Bear video and it's for sure he shoots a left handed bow, left handed. Unlike the target shooters Fred cants the bow 45 degrees or more to the left. Can see where this would ensure the arrow stays on the arrow rest. They said he used a bow with a 65 lb pull. Recurve and believe it said Fred Bear on it somewhere.

Seen him being interviewed. What a nice, down-to-earth guy. He mentioned some guy in Alaska being a better bow hunter than himself and also a better shot. Think this guy's first name was Ed. Fred said this guy lived in the wilds all his life so that kinda gave him an edge.

Don

[Hobie]

[86er]

Good info above so just a little input from me. My longbow and recurve will both kick arrows with vanes to the left (RH bow) so feathers are a must. The draw weight is at a particular draw length. Depending on the bow characteristics, an average +/- draw weight would be about 1.5 pounds weight per inch of length. For example, my 1969 Bear recurve says 35#, however when I fully draw I am over-drawing by just over 2 inches. If you bother to do the math it works out to be 38# of draw weight, right in line with the average for +/- draw weight. With that in mind, I have killed deer, hogs and other small critters just fine with that bow out to 25 yards. I practice and am willing to shoot to 30 yards but I have not have the opportunity or need to shoot an animal at that distance yet. So a 40# bow could shoot with as much as 44# draw weight if you are overdrawing. Also, the KE, momentum, velocity and penetration are factors more related to the arrow than the actual draw weight. My longbow will shoot an extra-length wood arrow (Barta made) just right. It is a bit finicky with other types, weights and lengths although I cannot explain why. On my recurve, the most forgiving arrows are carbon thin shaft Axis with 5 inch feathers 15/16th tall at the crest with no helical. I can shoot others but the groups open up noticably no matter what I do. As far as a RH or LH bow, I personally go with what feels most natural and for me archery shooting is RH. Good Luck!

[Nath]

If you want to go with that bow how about an eye patch on the right eye!?

Nath.

[rjohns94]

My current longbow, and my favorite to date is a 64# takedown made by wes wallace. It is bamboo laminate and hits hard. I sent my old bamboo wes Wallace one piece which i think was #54 to Mescalaro as a gift. I have shot up to #80 pounds with previous longbows but above #70, my fingers take a beating, despite the conditioning and I can't keep my arrow count up in practice. I settled on 68# but when the bow was made, it came out at #64. I am very happy with it. I have hunted and taken bull frogs, turtles, carp, bass, mullet, gar, and other fish and rays and sharks, squirrel, rabbits, raccoon, deer, pheasant, goose, duck, a few feral critters and snakes with the longbow. IT is my favorite weapon of choice. I love the take down feature. I shoot both wooden and graphite arrows depending on the game of choice. Good luck.

Fred shot left handed. I had a shooting session with him at the factory when I picked up a custom made takedown. He was an awesome shot and a very nice gentleman. He gave me a tour of the factory. This was about a year or so before his death. It was a highlight of my formative years. He and Howard, along with Glen St Charles and a few others were early heros and inspiration when I just could not hit the broad side of the barn. Lots of practice over the years, 100s of thousands of arrows, have made the bow quite a natural extension of me. Weekly I shoot 3-D targets but my current favorite game is to shoot ping pong balls, at about 20 yards, while they are being balanced/bounced on a column of air. Last time I shot them I hit 3 out of 6, impalling two of the three on the arrow. The trick to success with the long bow is come to the same anchor point every time, start with the bow in the vertical, dont mess with angles in the beginning, then hold your bow hand steady through the shot and follow through, and pick a spot for aiming, a very small spot, like a hair, or a hole. those are the things I go through in every shot. anchor, hold steady on the shot, pick a spot. Blessings

[getitdone1]

Hobie,

Nice pictures and books. Now you did it. Hey, I got too many books already but I'm afraid you made your point and I'll have one or more books on archery within a week. You sell'in? Ha.

All you guys, thanks again for your helpful posts.

I think I know why archery and archery hunting are so popular on this lever gun site. They both go back to a simpler time, have historic significance and give us the challenge of accuracy with a projectile. They also give us the magic of standing in one spot and having a very fast "effect" several yards away. Accurately, we hope. There's also the pleasure of owning and using a quality gun or bow.

There's a kind of "brotherhood" here at this site and it's a lot about enjoying "talking" to people all over the country--even the world--about things we all have a strong interest in and enjoy. I'm especially lucky in having many interests. I've sometimes said: "I'm rich with interests." I don't think you'll find any greater riches, and in this sense, some monetarily rich people are actually poor.

I think you'll all agree, though sometimes computers can be a real pain-in-the-neck, they make some really nice things, like this site, YouTube and several other very nice things, possible.

Don McCullough

[getitdone1]

Anyone who likes archery should really like this video. Ed Scott Bow--YouTube. Parts 1-8. I've come back here and changed this. Just type Ed Scott Bow--not Bowyer--in the YouTube search box and you'll get 8 Parts rather than 3 like I previously told you.

This guy is a real pro and makes all kinds of bows. Authentic "Indian Bows", bows from horns, etc.

Anyone here know what he'd charge for an "Indian Bow?" He talks about how the Indians road along side the buffalo and shot them--sometimes through a cow and into her calf running along side. Some of their bows were not as weak as I thought. Was told most Indian Bows had about a 35# pull but surely not those that could shoot through a buffalo.

This is a really interesting interview and demonstration of bow making.

Don

[win38-55]

Here is an old bear cub that I shoot from time to time it was made in the 1940's
It is 49 pounds and still shoots like a dream after all of these years.
I made the arrows I shoot out of it also. I Love Archery almost as much as I love Guns.
Notice I said almost.

[getitdone1]

I talked over the phone with James Berry, the maker of my JD Berry long bow. He gave me information that may have kept me from destroying my bow. Previous to calling him today I strung this bow and when I told him it only had a 3 3/4" brace height he told me if I had shot it I might have broken it. He told me about twisting the string, the right direction, so I could achieve a brace height between 6 3/4 and 7 1/4". We talked for over an hour and every time I apoligized for taking so much of his time he said to think nothing of it. Well the conversation just kept on going. I've never before experienced such a helpful person.

He told me he's been making bows now for over 30 years. He's killed several elk with a bow and believe he said the bows were only in the 50-58# range.

It's quite something for me to find the two most helpful people I've ever run into once I got my bow. James for one and the sales person at 3Rivers for the other. Got a list for 3Rivers in the morning! And, if the bow bug really bites I'll be giving James another call sometime in the future.

Don McCullough

[jnwaco]

I've been shooting bows since I was young and I'm right-eye dominant and shoot left handed. This was mostly due to being left handed, having left handed bows available, but not having good advice to go along with it. I do most things left-handed, but I shoot rifles and my pistol right handed. My brother is right handed, but he shoots a rifle and a shotgun left handed. He's left-eye dominant.

If you can close your non-aiming eye, you can make it work.

Plastic vanes can also work, but IMHO, the feathers work better for shooting off the shelf, because the feathers will actually fold back whereas a stiff vane can cause the arrow to be off just a hair. I've ordered a good bit from 3Rivers over the years, and they've been great to work with.

Shooting a longbow is fun. I stick to recurves and compounds. My wild cousin has a 80# longbow, and it strains me just to get the thing strung!

[Birdman]

I got to jump in here too. I Have three longbows. A Martin and two Black Widows. My favorite is my 60 inch Black Widow takedown with a draw weight of 55 pounds at 25 1/2 inches. Yes, I have a very short draw length. I shoot feathers off the shelf. My son shoots a Pearson compound with all the whistles and bells and shoots it very well. Our favorite game is playing tic-tac-toe. We draw out our board and we have to call our shot in advance. We also draw a two inch circle and a 1/2 inch circle inside of each square. If I hit the two inch circle I get another shot. If Garrett hits the 1/2 inch circle he gets another shot. The games generally go pretty quick and it is a great way to spend an evening with my son. We can shoot up to 18 yards in our basement and out to 40 yards in our driveway but I don't play tic-tac-toe out past 25. We also do some 3-D along with hunting. I prefer my guns but it's mighty handy shooting archery in our basement or drive.