Lite load for Shiloh Sharps 45-70

[JNG]

I received my Sharps in Sept. After reading over the responses on my post on which caliber, I chose the 45-70. After I received it, I tried it out with a few bullets that was loaded for my Guide rifle. Not good! As I have had 2 surgeries on my right shoulder, the steel butt plate is not my friend. I have a pad for my shoulder, but it's a pain to use. So going through the internet here and elsewhere I found some light loads. I tried 2. First was 15 of Unique and the next was 20 of 2400. I am using 405 grain bullets. ( I know if I drop down to the 300's it might help, but I have a bazillon of them on hand) The Unique load was all over the place, but the 2400 load shoot dang good. I am going to go up and down a grain or so to see if there is a sweeter spot. My question is powder placement in the shell. Will a filler of some kind help hold the powder down? If so, what kind would work best. Also any other thoughts on light loads from you guys.
I am going to read how to post pics on this forum and post a few. Lastly, I you want a Sharps I sure would recommend Shiloh.

Thanks

[Tycer]

You can try 13 grains on the Unique. My light load is 13 grains under a 420

[Chas.]

Can't advise on filler, but I use 24-25gr 2400 w/405gr. and 300gr. cast without any filler and have had no problems.

You can find other lite loads here http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm

[J Miller]

JNG,

I can't help with light loads but how about a custom made but pad for the rifle? We have a couple leather workers here on the forum and make butt cuffs with pads built in for rifles. I can't remember which members they are, but it might be a help for you shoulder.

Joe

[Borregos]

My light load for the 45-70 and a 405 grainer is 12gr Trail Boss, very accurate out of my Marlin and only creeps out at around 950fps, very easy on the shoulder

[longarm4146]

I like 25 - 27.5 of XMP 5744......very consistent and easy on you with 405s

[pshort]

Howdy,
I vote with Longarm....
I'm using about 26 gr 5744 with a 405 and get about 1300 from a 34" bbl... (Weighs about 13 lbs..)
Also, using 23gr 5744 with a 520 to get about 1150 from same rifle.
Either will allow me to shoot a 60 round match with no shoulder owies whatsoever..

YMMV,

Paul

[Nate Kiowa Jones]

You could also go with black powder. Unlike smokeless, BP is more of a push than a kick. Plus, done right no smokless loads will acheive the accuracy of BP particulaly with big bullet 400 and larger. Push them 12 to 1400 FPS and they will be very accurate. Big and slow deviates much less than small and fast.

If you have a bunch of those 405's and they are smokeless lubed just boil them in water to remove the lube then hand lube them with a BP lube.

[Nath]

You could also go with black powder. Unlike smokeless, BP is more of a push than a kick. Plus, done right no smokless loads will acheive the accuracy of BP particulaly with big bullet 400 and larger. Push them 12 to 1400 FPS and they will be very accurate. Big and slow deviates much less than small and fast.

If you have a bunch of those 405's and they are smokeless lubed just boil them in water to remove the lube then hand lube them with a BP lube.

+1

N.

[Old Savage]

The most accurate light load with my Marlin 1895s has been 25 gr of 2400 with a 400 gr Speer.

[Don McDowell]

Go with 70 grs of Goex 1f or 72 grs of Cartridge with a .060 fiber wad under the bullet. If your shoulder can't take either one of those loads, about the only thing left is to get a Crossno 22 liner either direct from Crossno or from Buffalo Arms.

[rjohns94]

I use black powder in mine, behind a 500 grain goverment cast bullet.

[CEMENTHEAD]

My light load for the 45-70 and a 405 grainer is 12gr Trail Boss, very accurate out of my Marlin and only creeps out at around 950fps, very easy on the shoulder

I agree !! +1

I use 13 grains of TrailBoss under a 405 grain Lead FN. Good stuff!

Have fun with that Shiloh !!

Thanks, Tom

[Ysabel Kid]

IIRC, one of Kirk's AA5744 recipe's duplicated the original 405 grain BP government load. I think it was around 26 grains with 1/3rd sheet of TP rolled loosely and folded. Pretty mild. Check this out first though!

[SFRanger7GP]

I have 3 Shilohs. One is a Sporter #3 in 45-70 with all the bells and whistles. The other 2 are special edition light weight hunter models ordered by Bill Goodman from Shiloh. One is 45-70 and the other is 50-70. I would never dream of tainting any of the barrels with smokeless powder. My right shoulder has been repaired/rebuilt twice so I understand your problem. I can shoot my Shilohs all day with black powder, and I use 500+ grain bullets. There is a definite difference in felt recoil between black and smokeless powder.

I was worried about loading black powder ammo and cleaning up after it. The loads do take a little more care to prepare but clean up is really easy. ScottT mentored me in the joys of shooting black powder cartridges and I am truly grateful.

[rjohns94]

I agree, I use ScottT'S load for my sharps. Same as he uses for Big Nose Kate.

[awp101]

You could also go with black powder. Unlike smokeless, BP is more of a push than a kick.

+1! GOEX Black Dawge loads out of a H&R Buffalo Classic were much more pleasant to shoot than factory smokeless loadings.

Heck, full house .45-120 BP loads out of a Pedersoli Sharps were fun too. About like a 3" Mag 12ga. 14# of rifle probably didn't hurt either...

[Thunder50]

I load up 25.5gr 5744 under a 405gr slug. I put a card wad over the powder (you could probably use a bit of TP), the put grits in the case so when I seat the bullet, it compresses the grits about .200"--.250".

Little more work, but cuts the group size in half vs powder only. Would be like loading Balck powder, no airspace in the column. Don't shoot it out of a Sharps or Sharps clone, but out of my 1884 Trapdoor. Velocity, IIRC, is a little over 1300fps

[Old Ranger]

The loads with Trail Boss do show little in the way of heavy recoil. However, the do have a slightly higher pressure than some. I use 15.7 gr. of TB behind a 340 cast Lee RNFP in a Marlin Guide Gun. It is mild enough that my "wimpy" 11 year old grandson will shoot it and ask for more rounds. Now with the old Ideal #457124 (385 gr RN) cast with soft lead gives me a 405 gr. projectile. Cutting back to 14.5 of TB and the lead 405's from the Ideal casting, gives me a mild round but will still carry well at a distance. It's easy on the shoulder too....

That same 405 will go easy with 12 gr. of W231 with a bit of toilet paper stuffed in to keep the powder at the primer. Real accruate with my stubby Marlin and a creampuff on the shootin' end! I have found that using pistol powders in this big case you will have a time that you'll get some that will go off like a cannon and burn the brass and such. Powder got toward the front of case and not to the rear....Not fun. Lessons learned: Small amount of powder, use a wad. Full or near full case, no wad. Simple but effective.

I use the TP wad with 2400 and Unique as well. Never had that "BOOM" from the powder shifting to the nose!

Oh well, that's my two cents worth,

Have fun,

Wade

[JNG]

Thanks for the ideas. As of this time with Christmas coming, along with a recent land purchase money is tight. That said, next year I'll talk my wife to go to Indiana to visit that Belterra casino while I drive up to Friendship and buy a few pounds of BP. I have Mike V's book on loading with it.
So as for now, I can't let that puppy sit in the safe thus this post.
Have a Merry Christmas.

The other Joe

[Old Ironsights]

The most accurate light load with my Marlin 1895s has been 25 gr of 2400 with a 400 gr Speer.

+1

I really liked my 350 Gould HP over 2400 out of my 1886... Gonna be my starting point for the 1895.

[Noah Zark]

13 to 13.5 gr of Unique under a 400 gr cast bullet is what I use in my Pedersoli Sharps, two H&R repro Trapdoors, and my Marlin Cowboy. From bags on the bench, I've made 1.5" groups with that load and bullet.

Noah