Planning Ahead

[44/40]

Like many here, I have been collecting and shooting guns for many years and have now accumulated "some" guns. Having finally gotten around to the estate planning part of life, it occurred to me that other than the few that I'll leave to family members and close friends, the rest will be a saleable asset for my wife to dispose of and who, will have no idea of their value.

Question: Since, when my time comes, I won't be available to do a last minute update, I'm cataloging them now and approximating their value based on selling prices and completed auctions because I don't find Blue Book prices to be particularly accurate. Since I'm not planning on leaving any time soon , what would be a reasonable annual rate of appreciation ? I wouldn't want her getting scalped by someone like me, but I'm thinking 3 - 4% per year appreciation based on guns I bought (or should have bought) 10 and 20 years ago. What do you guys think - inquiring minds want to know....

[C. Cash]

I'm not the guy to give you an answer on how much, but from watching gun prices it seems that desirability and how much it's been shot plays a big part no? Some guns are simply wonderful, yet have no big following and do not appreciate like one would think. Examples that I can think of are the Winchester Big Bores or the US Arms Abilenes. NIB changes things for sure. Last time I checked, NIB Big Bores were going for 900-1000(probably a 300 dollar increase over the last five years), but used or like new seem to hover around the same mark during that time period. Not sure what I'm really trying to say, other than that I would guesstimate on a gun to gun basis myself. Some have a potential for a dramatic increase in a short amount of time, while others just seem to not be worth much more on the market at all over the same time frame. A blanket approach of 3-4% on all might set your wife up with either not getting enough for what is a highly desireable/NIB firearm, or not being able to sell an overpriced one.

[TedH]

I have a list of all my guns and the price I paid for them. At least that way my wife wouldn't loose any money on them. I would hope after my demise that one of my brothers or friends would step up and assist with getting reasonable prices set up for her.

[Chas.]

I have a list of all my guns and the price I paid for them. At least that way my wife wouldn't loose any money on them...

That's what I've done, rather than try to anticipate the market. I would hope most of mine will appreciate some, but a couple of others may not.

[Hobie]

This subject comes up every 18-24 months. It is one we should well consider and every now and then one sees an article about it.

I haven't been able to figure out any sort of standard rate of appreciation. I just update my values periodically based on prices I've seen comparable items fetch AND/OR on completed auctions on Gunbroker and Auction Arms.

[AJMD429]

Yep. Just a list of YOUR cost is a starting point.

You should have two or three 'reference' people (relatives who know guns, or gunsmiths you trust), who she can trust who will advise on particulars, and make sure she isn't taken advantage of.

[Mokwaw]

From what I have seen in this area of Indiana, leave advice for her to sell them at auction, with a reputable auctioneer, and have them charge a small buyer premium that pays the auctioneer so your wife gets all the money for the guns. They usually bring a fair price and some go above and beyond normal value.

[Sixgun]

From what I have seen in this area of Indiana, leave advice for her to sell them at auction, with a reputable auctioneer, and have them charge a small buyer premium that pays the auctioneer so your wife gets all the money for the guns. They usually bring a fair price and some go above and beyond normal value.

Thats how to do it. I have seen many, many times when a gun crank dies, his friends, associates, and family members all come running over to the widow like vultures---all with a great story and how much they can "help" her.

As values change almost by the month depending on whats "hot" at the time, the auction thing is the way to go but.................I have also seen auctioneers that are vultures who work in cohoots with gunshop owners.

Get a gun "Blue Book" and get the approximate values---write 'em down every year. Do some research and find an auctioneer who has an FFL and does seasonal or yearly gun auctions. -----Go talk to him and explain the situation as to what needs to be done "when the time comes". Put all that in your will.

Above all, don't trust anybody even remotely associated with local gunshops. I might add the "trust thing" to most everyone who knows you or your guns. People do strange things when it comes to money. -----------Sixgun

[wecsoger]

Price that you paid for "the toys" but date is also important. Realistically, very few guns appreciate much more than the rate of inflation.

But yes, a spreadsheet or listing of what you have, serial numbers, bought for price and estimate selling price is a valuable thing to have.

You should have a list, maybe part of your will not (depending on your feelings) as to who gets what. And a list of two or three people you really trust on helping with the disposition. Sadly, they should probably not be family members. (grin)

Don't forget you'll probably have a big stack of accessories and other parts, everything from extra ammo to reloading gear laid aside too, that will have to be accounted for. Everything from original boxes, scopes, sights, magazines are part of the total package.

And seriously, this is something all of us should do. None of us are really planning to having a final log out of the lever guns board, but take a look at the oncoming traffic next time you're on the road and see how many of them are talking on the cell phone, texting, putting on make-up, eating and doing other activities that may take them left-of-center.

[Booger Bill]

Most of us have the same problem. I havent been doing it, but I think everytime you see a gun just like one you have sell, to make a note of the price and date it sold in your records. That said I bet its a rare time that any widow or family member ever sold a inherited gun for what it is worth, or auction prices. Most get neglected, maybe put where they rust out, or are eventualy taken to a dealer who at best might offer 25% of what he will try to sell it for----if he is real honest!
Really, I think person should leave exact directions of how to put guns up on gun broker, or at least give the wife names of dealers or persons you trust to help her. I think I am preaching to myself here. Lets say you do have a gunshow pal or close friend. Its still a lot to ask of them to take over and sell your guns. I dont have a son or grandsons. I do have a daughter and very young grand daughters. In my case as far as my own personnal property go`s, its a huge percentage of my net worth! The only way I would want my wife to go to a dealer is to one that would agree to 10 to 15 % commission. Never in my life have I sold a gun to a dealer, or trade one in, for that matter. That is insane! Lets say a dealer marks up a gun 25 to 30% ? Lets say you might have even a new one in the box, unfired. He has to sell it as used. Now if its a current model still in production, why should he give you even 60% of a new one? He can set out new stock and sell it for new retail. And I dont blame him either. Do the math. A $400 retail gun his cost is maybe $280s (400-120 @ 30% = -120s =$280s). You want $300s for yours when he has to sell it as used, when it costs him $280s and he can sell that new for retail?
I have a close friend like that. The dealer loves him! He will buy a gun new, get tired of it, go back to the dealer and trade it partialy on something else. Once in awhile he would get something I was interested in. I would say let me know if you want to get rid of that. He would too! Right after he traded it back to the dealer!

[jdad]

This is just my opinion.

Find someone, you trust, to post them on line. Let the market determine their value. If you consign them to someone who is a professional (like Jack the Dog), takes high quality photos, and posts honest & detailed descriptions, your heirs will do well.

[Pete44ru]

I assign neither a buying price, aka: history, nor a rate of appreciation/depreciation.

I simply list my current firearm inventory by make, model, SN, and chambering, with a current selling price in an inventory headed: "Late Updated: Aug 1, 2010 (whatever)", and do an update every 30 days, minimum.

The selling prices I post therein are for "bareback" guns - i.e., w/o any scopes, cases, or other accessories - most of which I carry on a separate inventory/spreadsheet.

FWIW, each line item can be annotated with your intent for it's disposal: "sell", "give to son", whatever.

My wife & eldest child not living at home is given full disclosure, and a hardcopy of the spreadsheet/inventory - along with my written recommendations of the best avenues for disposal/sale.

.

[Cliff]

I had a cousin who while a child suffered heart problems. All his life he was told he could drop dead at any time. Down the road some of the damage was repaired. But the prognosis stayed pretty much the same. He did marry and fathered a child. He was an avid gun collector, started collecting Colts when they were cheap and he was single, sold them off and went to Winchesters, always going for the best he could find. After he married he got rid of his Winchesters, going into American Military Cartridge arms, no class III stuff. This was for his life insurance as he could not obtain it any other way. He included his wife in all his dealings, she got interested in antique glass. They cataloged everything with values. Redid his basement into a museum quality show place. Only lacked three rifles which were from the trapdoor experimentation period and about 8 or so were made of each type. Never did complete that but one night he woke his wife asker her to get him a drink of water. When she came back with it he had died. After the services and such, a fellow collect who knew him and his collection called wanting to buy everything he had. His wife quoted the price and the next day the collector showed up with help in a big truck and a cashiers check for the amount asked. No hassles and she was well satisfied with all how it worked out. Clever way for life insurance for someone who cannot get it. Good idea if you have a lot of interesting guns and you want your wife or family to get maximum return when they need the money. Auctions as mentioned can be the best way. Fortunately none of his brothers and such ever tried to interfer.
Good luck and keep an up to date catalog of what you have and estimated value and any sentimental attached in case family want some. Have a good day.

[Old Time Hunter]

I have a list of all my guns and the price I paid for them. At least that way my wife wouldn't loose any money on them. I would hope after my demise that one of my brothers or friends would step up and assist with getting reasonable prices set up for her.

I do that also....but I want 30-35 of them buried with me. Sealed in containers that will resist rust for a thousand years they will be a treasure when some alien digs me up.


Just kidd'n

[firefuzz]

When someone calls me wanting info on a guns value I usually search on the gun auctions. GunBroker offers an advanced search feature for checking only closed auctions that have sold. If you can find one, hopefully several, like it in about the same condition that at least gives you a starting point on what they'll bring.

Rob

[madman4570]

JMO----
Your guns in your safe/safes are a very sound investment if even periododically checked on)
Sit down with the wife(now)and maybe the older kid/kids(in case somthing happens to you both) and go over their present condition/current value(as of right now)Dont "wait" or it wont ever get done!
I dont give a hoot what you paid for them 10/20/30/40 years ago.(Guns kept in good shape go up in value)
Write down in a notebook/and maybe record it on DVD or video on a Digital camera memory card so she wont forget later right now in case a truck runs over you tomorrow.(my wife/daughter know mine right now) Use the current year Gun Trader Pricing book along with using a site like Gun Broker and look at a bunch of similar shape models and what they are selling (sold)for as of right now and that date if that selling time ever comes.Heck ask on here also cause most of the people on here have good input and that can aid in this.
Myself, unless its maybe---Hobie, or my immediate family member/best friend owns a gun shop going to a gun shop asking their values(nope)Also trying to put a percentage additive to their price with time(Nope)

Also, show her how to wipe down/lube the guns and run a oiled cleaning patch down the bores.
Women are smart and once you show/explain have them do it(no problem) Mine do!
Tell the wife that after your death to (wait)dont sell anything for a very good while cause she might wish she hadnt later.Also tell your wife if somthing happened to you and she remarries the guns are for the KIDS when the time comes not new Bo if she remarried (but thats just me though,so whatever with that one)?
Not that then I can do anything about it(maybe though, we dont know)? But Bubba, he can go buy his own

In my house I have told my wife/daughter my wish would be (dont sell none)
They know how to shoot/clean them/as of right now and I have instructed them how to get their value with the passing of time as it goes by, along with all the ones that have special family history behind them.(all of them )
I would like to see after me and then the wife are gone/the daughter has them all and keeps it going down that chain through the generations.(funny, she does keep saying Dad,when you going to croke so I can get them HBARS and M1's)

Selling the guns for some cash in my household would indeed be a very sad day!
Would be better to have that extra amount if need be added to a life insurance policy or somthing?
Thats just me, but everyone has their own reasons!
My wish is to have my great/great/great etc. grand children owning all my guns and know all the stories past/present/future behind them all.