.357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Welcome to the Leverguns.Com Forum. This is a high-class place so act respectable. We discuss most anything here ... politely.

Moderators: AmBraCol, Hobie

Forum rules
Welcome to the Leverguns.Com General Discussions Forum. This is a high-class place so act respectable. We discuss most anything here other than politics... politely.

Please post political post in the new Politics forum.
Post Reply
bdhold

.357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by bdhold »

Image
I have been loving shooting this little carbine, in spite of the frustrations - it's been giving me fits getting the 3X short Malcolm scope stuck to it (literally). But it's a kick in the pants to shoot.
22" barrel and with the scope it weighs in a 5-1/2 lbs.
Leatherwood hasn't yet made an exact scope mount for the Remingtons, but I really liked the idea of using the exiting dovetails, so I started with a mount set they make for an 1885
Image
First trick was getting the height right on the receiver mount.
Image
In spite the fact my gunsmith said he bore-sighted it, first time out with cowboy loads, couldn't quite get enough elevation to hit the paper at 50 yds. - back to the drawing board.
Tried a .425 mount (the photo above), and it ended up being too tall. This time I was at 100-yd range, and I could dial it down to the top of the paper. I actually shot some windage adjustments aiming at the bottom of the paper,
and noticed a bugaboo - the scope slid a little bit in the compression ring locking collar which holds the scope tube at the front mount - the scope was sliding forward, driven by the recoil. So I tightened the screw. One reason I bought this gun was to shoot big loads - this time out I had been shooting BVAC reloads, 158-gr. 1300 fps, and threw in a couple of Buffalo Bore 180-gr, rated at the same velocity. I noticed the bigger loads hammered the scope a little faster.
Image
A .325 receiver mount is probably perfect for this application, but I had .225 that came with the scope, a .425 I purchased, and a .275 that came with the 1885 mount set. I made a .030 steel shim and installed it under the .275 mount.
Image
It put me on the paper, into the red, and then started walking everywhere.
I had shot about 20 rounds of BVAC 180-gr 1200-fps. I looked down, and the scope had traveled so far forward the eyepiece was into the rear mount, which is where my calibrations had gone. To top it off, the rear mount base was loose.
Back to the drawing board. First thing, I contacted Leatherwood, because I had horsed on the locking collar screw so many times, the screw slot was opening up. They kindly send me a pair.
I remounted everything with Locktite 242, and one extra addition - I used Locktite 609 between the scope tube and the locking collar.
Nice thing about this carbine is you can bore-sight at the range - open up the block and look down the range, which is where I started yesterday. 2nd shot was on the paper. As I was making my scope calibrations, I noticed my pairs were grouping very nicely - an inch or better at 100 yds.
Again, I was shooting BVAC realoads, 180-gr JHP 1200 fps.
My last 6 shots were at the 1" squares on each side of the paper, and I put 3 shots in each one - very happy with the result. I actually plan to dial this down to 80 yds, which is a flatter range for the .357, but again, I was very happy with yesterday's result. Sorry, no paper to show you (this guy doesn't shut down the range to retrieve paper)
The Locite solved it - everything was rock solid.
User avatar
TedH
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 8250
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 5:19 pm
Location: Missouri

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by TedH »

That is too cool! Glad you got it figured out. 8)
NRA Life Member
User avatar
gamekeeper
Spambot Zapper
Posts: 17458
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 3:32 pm
Location: Over the pond unfortunately.

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by gamekeeper »

TedH wrote:That is too cool! Glad you got it figured out. 8)
+ 1 I love the color of the wood too. :mrgreen:
Whatever you do always give 100%........... unless you are donating blood.
User avatar
Griff
Posting leader...
Posts: 20864
Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2007 4:56 pm
Location: OH MY GAWD they installed a STOP light!!!

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by Griff »

Very nice!
Griff,
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93

There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
Ben_Rumson
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 2569
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2007 12:51 pm

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by Ben_Rumson »

Well done! I knew that beauty would drill 'em in there like that..
"IT IS MY OPINION, AND I AM CORRECT SO DON'T ARGUE, THE 99 SAVAGE IS THE FINEST RIFLE EVER MADE IN AMERICA."
WIL TERRY
firefuzz
Senior Levergunner
Posts: 1351
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 7:17 am
Location: Central Oklahoma

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by firefuzz »

As Daffy Duck used to tell Bugs "You're dispicable!!!!" :wink: I want one of those so bad I can taste it.

Really nice piece.

Rob
Proud to be Christian American and not ashamed of being white.

May your rifle always shoot straight, your mag never run dry, you always have one more round than you have adversaries, and your good mate always be there to watch your back.

Because I can!

Never grow a wishbone where a backbone ought to be.
User avatar
geobru
Levergunner 3.0
Posts: 912
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2007 12:19 am
Location: Washington

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by geobru »

Is that sling set up available commercially?
bdhold

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by bdhold »

geobru wrote:Is that sling set up available commercially?
from Dixie gun works - $13.
http://www.dixiegunworks.com/product_in ... ts_id=9963
firefuzz wrote:As Daffy Duck used to tell Bugs "You're dispicable!!!!" :wink: I want one of those so bad I can taste it.
Really nice piece.
Rob
thanks Rob - I'm proud of it, and find myself petting it more often than any of my other firearms.
Cast Bullet Hunter
Levergunner 2.0
Posts: 235
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:51 pm
Location: Sandy, Utah

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by Cast Bullet Hunter »

Bulldog,

The reason you are having problems with the band slipping is it should be in front of the front mount instead of behind it. It isn't intended to take recoil, it is a stop to position the scope for the next shot. You pull the scope back to the stop, and when the shot is fired the scope remains stationary and the gun recoils away from it. The reason is to not put recoil forces into the scope that can damage it!. After the shot, reload, and then gently pull the scope back to the stop for the next shot. The scope will last a lot longer. If you don't believe me, find someone old enough to have been around when the old Lyman, Unertl and other of the long tube, adjustable mount target scopes were still common.
bdhold

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by bdhold »

CBH, thank you for your reply, and you may be 100% correct - but every short Malcolm scope example (12 of them) shown on Leatherwood's page is shown mounted the same way.
http://www.leatherwoodoptics.com/index. ... &Itemid=52

Image
kasTX
Levergunner 1.0
Posts: 68
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2007 9:34 pm

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by kasTX »

Sorry I don't have anything to add that will help you, but did want to say those are some really nice pictures!
awp101
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 5670
Joined: Mon Apr 09, 2007 7:13 pm
Location: DeeDee Snavely's Used Guns and Weapons

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by awp101 »

firefuzz wrote:As Daffy Duck used to tell Bugs "You're dispicable!!!!" :wink: I want one of those so bad I can taste it.

Really nice piece.

Rob
+1! :mrgreen:
Nothing so needs reforming as other people's habits.
-Mark Twain

Proverbs 3:5; Philippians 4:13

Got to have a Jones for this
Jones for that
This running with the Joneses boy
Just ain't where it's at
bdhold

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by bdhold »

kasTX wrote:Sorry I don't have anything to add that will help you, but did want to say those are some really nice pictures!
thanks, I shot a tripod and timer, except the last, which offhand with a flash (and indoors - could have been any color lights around).
airedaleman
Levergunner 3.0
Posts: 982
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 9:05 pm
Location: New Kent County, VA

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by airedaleman »

Cast Bullet Hunter wrote:Bulldog,

The reason you are having problems with the band slipping is it should be in front of the front mount instead of behind it. It isn't intended to take recoil, it is a stop to position the scope for the next shot. You pull the scope back to the stop, and when the shot is fired the scope remains stationary and the gun recoils away from it. The reason is to not put recoil forces into the scope that can damage it!. After the shot, reload, and then gently pull the scope back to the stop for the next shot. The scope will last a lot longer. If you don't believe me, find someone old enough to have been around when the old Lyman, Unertl and other of the long tube, adjustable mount target scopes were still common.
I'm one of those old guys, and CBH is right. I had a 10-power Fecker 1-1/4" scope that served me well back in the 60's and early 70's. The stop belongs in front of the front mount. Inertia keeps the scope in place as the rifle recoils, and it is up to the shooter to pull it back against the stop. Otherwise the scope will slide further and further forward. Higher end scopes than my old Fecker - like like the Lymans and Unertls - had a collar and coil spring that bore against the back of the front mount and compressed on firing, automatically bringing the scope back into position when it relaxed.

I think Leatherwood ought to look at those examples they show. Someone (the photographer?) didn't set them up correctly.
Riamh Nar Dhruid O Spairn Lann
- motto on the Irish Regiments' flags
bdhold

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by bdhold »

thanks again, gents.
I checked MVA, and sure enough, they post installation instructions showing the battery stop mounted in the opposed direction.
http://www.montanavintagearms.com/scope ... tions.html

may be back to the drawing board here again.

p.s., this is not something we mounted - this is the way all the scopes come from Leatherwood.
bdhold

Re: .357 baby carbine and short Malcolm - saga and range report

Post by bdhold »

I sent the link to this thread to Technical Support at Leatherwood.
They replied that my scope is installed correctly, and they were complimentary.

I found this thread on ASSRA
http://www.assra.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB. ... 02222863/0
This mount is really the way they intended it.
I borrowed this quote from the ASSRA thread
their scope tube is not supposed to move in recoil so the bases take all the force, and will tear out of the dovetail without the extra base. I bought one of their early production before they had the recoil base and I have pictures of the damage. ...
All of this being said, if you want this scope for casual plinking, it will be fine, if you have used a scope like an MVA and try to shoot a match with the Leatherwood Malcolm you may hate it. I forgot to mention use plenty of Locktite.
Post Reply