OT- Moisin Nagants

[Rusty]

These rifles have come up quite a bit of late and I was wondering about them. I've always heard that the Finish rifles or even the Russian ones that had been captured and reworked by the Finns were the best. Anyone have any thoughts on these?

[gamekeeper]

Rusty, I have a copy of "GUNS OF THE WORLD" editor Hans Tanner.

It has a very good six page article by Harris R Bierman about the Moisin-Nagant in Finnish service.

http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/BookDet ... 2%26ph%3D2

[Pisgah]

I have very, very limited experience with the Finn MNs -- in fact, I have shot exactly one Finn rebuild which had a Finn barrel on it (Sako, I think), and it was very accurate.

Then again, I have two Russians and they, too, are very accurate.

From what I read, the average Finn rebuild with Finnish barrel is more accurate than the average Russian, and the Finn-built target and sniper rifles are serious medicine. Of course, I seem to recall that the legendary Finnish sniper who laid so many Reds low (and whose name escapes me) used a plain iron-sighted general-issue rifle.

[win38-55]

I have 2 Russian Nagant's and both are fine but crude battle rifles. They are both very accurate.
One of the main things to check when buying these rifles is the condition of the bore,
sometimes this is hard to do because of all the cosmoline inside of it . I also like to get rifles that
are Serial Number matched instead of being forced matched with the aid of an electric pencil.
One of my rifles is a forced matched but it still seems to shoot pretty good. Both of mine are Were built in 1938
they say the pre war rifles are of better quality but who really knows. A good site for learning about these is http://7.62x54r.net/
and another site that has some good info on this is gunboards.com. Buy the way if you buy one of these rifles only shoot
non laquered cases in the rifle because sometimes it makes the case harder to extract. Any way good luck on your search.

[Rusty]

Pisgah, I seem to remember reading about the Finish sniper as well. He said he didn't like a scope because it forced him to expose too much of his head to take a shot. Those were sure tough guys.

[Bogie35]

I've seen them around, but I don't even know how to pronounce it!

bogie

[2ndovc]

Sako and Valmet were the biggies.

The Finns captured huge numbers of rifles from the Russians and reworked them or just remarked them.
During the Winter War of 1939 the Soviets were simply outclassed by the Finns.
The US and the British turned their backs on the Finnish cries for help because they didn't want
to anger the Soviets. The Finns turned to Germany for help. Germany was more than happy to
send arms and supplies due to their hatred of the Soviets.

The 27s 28s and 39s are outstanding rifles.
The Model 39s were used all the way into the 1960s.
My 39 Sako will shoot as well as my 1903A3 Springfield.


Check out Gunboards.com for some real good info on the Mosins.


jb

[AJMD429]

I've seen them around, but I don't even know how to pronounce it!
bogie

Q. How do you pronounce "Mosin Nagant"?
A. MO-seen Nah-GON

http://7.62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinFAQ.htm

[jhrosier]

The Finns are well made and accurate.
They are also getting very expensive.
I bought mine back when they were just over $100.
Now $300 and up is the common price.
You might be better off spending a little more and getting an '03 Springfield.

Jack

[awp101]

Of course, I seem to recall that the legendary Finnish sniper who laid so many Reds low (and whose name escapes me) used a plain iron-sighted general-issue rifle.

Simo Häyhä aka the White Death. 505 confirmed kills IIRC.

[Bogie35]

I've seen them around, but I don't even know how to pronounce it!
bogie

Q. How do you pronounce "Mosin Nagant"?
A. MO-seen Nah-GON

http://7.62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinFAQ.htm

THANKS!!!

bogie

[horsesoldier03]

I think the Finnish Mosins are more desired mainly because they are a bit better on quality but also seem to be more rare. Not sure if your looking to collect or just have a shooter. I have a Russian made M44 Mosin that is awesome. It doesnt have all matching #s and is no where near a collector, however, it has never been arsenally refinished nor has it been counterbored. It shoots awesome groups at 100 yrds with iron sites. I bought it mainly as a kick around rifle that can ride on an ATV or in a Pick-up and I dont have to worry about scratches or dings. If I think I am going to be getting into some nasty areas (Texas, Trinity River Bottom) its the first rifle I prefer to grab.

[OI phones in...]

I can't wait to pick up my 91/30 on Monday...

[Lefty Dude]

I understand some were made by Remington for Russia.

[John in MS]

Interesting!! I have heard many people comment on the excellent
accuracy of the Mosins. Unfortunately, I've never been able to get
any hard numbers. 1 person's "excellent" (say, 4 MOA) might be another
person's "Hideous." Can any members here share any group sizes (and
# of shots fired, ammo type, plus averages of several groups if possible?)

Also, do they prefer any particular type of surplus ammo, such as "light" or "heavy"
ball? Any particular country or type of ammo extra-good?

Our local shop has a big rack of hexagon-receiver MN's for sale that are in excellent
shape. I've been looking at them for some time, but just don't have much of a
frame of reference about them.

Thanks very much!

John

[horsesoldier03]

Interesting!! I have heard many people comment on the excellent
accuracy of the Mosins. Unfortunately, I've never been able to get
any hard numbers. 1 person's "excellent" (say, 4 MOA) might be another
person's "Hideous." Can any members here share any group sizes (and
# of shots fired, ammo type, plus averages of several groups if possible?)

Also, do they prefer any particular type of surplus ammo, such as "light" or "heavy"
ball? Any particular country or type of ammo extra-good?

Our local shop has a big rack of hexagon-receiver MN's for sale that are in excellent
shape. I've been looking at them for some time, but just don't have much of a
frame of reference about them.

Thanks very much!

John

Mine will shoot 3 shot groups to point of aim with groups 1-1.5" at 50 yrds with plain surplus ammo that is corrosive (147 grn FMJ Hungarian) I like the hex receives too but havent purchased one! Hope the link helps with your decision!

http://7.62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinAmmo009.htm

[deerwhacker444]

Can any members here share any group sizes (and
# of shots fired, ammo type, plus averages of several groups if possible?)

Also, do they prefer any particular type of surplus ammo, such as "light" or "heavy"
ball? Any particular country or type of ammo extra-good?

Here's mine, a round barrel 1943 Russian. I've only shot mine with 147 gr. Bulgarian Surplus ammo! Mine seems to shoot very well although I haven't tried any further than 100 yards. Mine likes the Bulgarian ammo so I bought a couple thousands rounds of the stuff while it's cheap. This is 10 rounds, I must have pulled that bottom left one.... The target is a 5.5" circle, so I'd say 2"-3" MOA is easily doable if you're concentrating, and you pick out a "good" one from the rack. This one has a great bore. I've got another one that has a sewer pipe for a bore. It doesn't shoot too far behind this one surprisingly.

Here's a handy site to find out what types of surplus ammo is around.

http://www.gun-deals.com/ammo.php

Find the ammo in the pull down menu and enter your zip code. The prices aren't always correct, but it will get you in the right ballpark.

[2ndovc]

I understand some were made by Remington for Russia.

Remington and Westinghouse.

jb

[Cliff]

Finland broke away from Russia when the communist came to power. They confiscated all the arms and munitions the Russians had in Finland to arm their new army. In the Winter War they completely dismantled the captured Russian rifles, then rebuilt them in their arsenals to their standards. It is said they did burn the stocks for heat and felt the Russian stocks were inferior, so they came up with a two piece laminate stock which was super strong. The Model 28 had a .308 bore and great sights and was desireable for its accuracy. I have read they won competion during the olympics with these rifles. They made a host of models during and after the fighting with the Russians. They are proud of their national standard as a nation of rifleman. They were also smart. Big neighbor had all kinds of neat war materials so the Finns adopted the same calibers and in a lot of cases the same style of guns. Their Valmet varients of the AK-47 are superior in comparison to the soviet made ones. Interesting people and country. ATB

[cshold]

This is my dream sniper rifle & scope: M40a3.


But till the dream becomes reality, this will have to do: Win. 70 Lightweight 243 Win.

[SteveR]

I have many different types of Mosin Nagant rifles, the Finnish rework and Finn built are hands down better than the Russian variants.

The "3 line rifle" was adopted for service by the Czar in 1891, but Russia did not have the machining necessary to build the numbers needed to equip the army, so contract were drawn up with France's Châtellerault armory, the US firms Remington and Westinghouse. By 1893 the Russian armories of Sestroryetsk, Tula, and Izhevsk were able to meet production.

After the Red take over of Russia, the Sestroryetsk was closed down because it was to close to the newly independent Finland. (Finland declared independence when the Reds overturned the Czarist government)

I have a 28/30 Finnish Mosin Nagant that is the same model that Simo Häyhä used so effectively against the Russians in the Winter War. It is the one most accurate rifle I own. It shoots surplus almost as well as handloads!!

I also have a Finnish M91 that shoots almost as well as the 28/30, but all of them my 39's included shoot very well.

The only Russian I have that shoots as well as the Finn's is a former sniper.

Steve

[Ysabel Kid]

Rusty -

A fun gun and caliber! These guns have gone up in price over the last several years, but still can be had pretty darn reasonably. Who knows how long that will last? I've noticed the ammo has jumped a lot too lately - but then again, all ammo is up.