WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
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- Old Ironsights
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WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
"As I have always said, if you really want to change the climate, go big and go two stroke.
The Wartsila-Sulzer RTA96-C turbocharged two-stroke diesel engine is the most powerful and most efficient prime-mover in the world today. It is available in 6 through 14 cylinder versions, all are inline engines. These engines were designed primarily for very large container ships. Ship owners like a single engine/single propeller design and the new generation of larger container ships needed a bigger engine to propel them. The cylinder bore is just under 38" and the stroke is just over 98". Each cylinder displaces 111,143 cubic inches (1820 liters) and produces 7780 horsepower. Total displacement comes out to 1,556,002 cubic inches (25,480 liters) for the fourteen cylinder version.
Maximum power: 108,920 hp at 102 rpm
Maximum torque: 5,608,312 lb/ft at 102rpm
Fuel consumption at maximum power is 0.278 lbs per hp per hour (Brake Specific Fuel Consumption). Fuel consumption at maximum economy is 0.260 lbs/hp/hour. At maximum economy the engine exceeds 50% thermal efficiency. That is, more than 50% of the energy in the fuel in converted to motion. For comparison, most automotive and small aircraft engines have BSFC figures in the 0.40-0.60 lbs/hp/hr range and 25-30% thermal efficiency range. Even at its most efficient power setting, the big 14 consumes 1,660 gallons of heavy fuel oil per hour."
Crankshaft...
The Wartsila-Sulzer RTA96-C turbocharged two-stroke diesel engine is the most powerful and most efficient prime-mover in the world today. It is available in 6 through 14 cylinder versions, all are inline engines. These engines were designed primarily for very large container ships. Ship owners like a single engine/single propeller design and the new generation of larger container ships needed a bigger engine to propel them. The cylinder bore is just under 38" and the stroke is just over 98". Each cylinder displaces 111,143 cubic inches (1820 liters) and produces 7780 horsepower. Total displacement comes out to 1,556,002 cubic inches (25,480 liters) for the fourteen cylinder version.
Maximum power: 108,920 hp at 102 rpm
Maximum torque: 5,608,312 lb/ft at 102rpm
Fuel consumption at maximum power is 0.278 lbs per hp per hour (Brake Specific Fuel Consumption). Fuel consumption at maximum economy is 0.260 lbs/hp/hour. At maximum economy the engine exceeds 50% thermal efficiency. That is, more than 50% of the energy in the fuel in converted to motion. For comparison, most automotive and small aircraft engines have BSFC figures in the 0.40-0.60 lbs/hp/hr range and 25-30% thermal efficiency range. Even at its most efficient power setting, the big 14 consumes 1,660 gallons of heavy fuel oil per hour."
Crankshaft...
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough.
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
- kimwcook
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Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Now that, my friends, is an engine. WOW!
Old Law Dawg
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Impressive!
Sincerely,
Hobie
"We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best that we find in our travels is an honest friend." Robert Louis Stevenson
Hobie
"We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best that we find in our travels is an honest friend." Robert Louis Stevenson
- Old Ironsights
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Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Note that that engine is more efficient at converting Fuel BTUs to Movement than aircraft or automotive 4 stroke engines...
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough.
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Two thoughts:
1. Man, oh man, oh man, oh man....
2. Do they make a big bore kit for it?
1. Man, oh man, oh man, oh man....
2. Do they make a big bore kit for it?
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Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
How do you even start an engine like that? We used compressed air on both my ships, but the engines were nowhere near THAT large.
"...In this present crisis, government isn't the solution to the problem; government is the problem." Ronald Reagan
"...all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed." Declaration of Independence
"...all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed." Declaration of Independence
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Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Set a bag of Black Powder on a piston at TDC?Otto wrote:How do you even start an engine like that? We used compressed air on both my ships, but the engines were nowhere near THAT large.
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough.
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Can you imagine the size of the machine tools needed to produce that thing!!
The meek shall inherit the earth, but I reserve the mineral rights!
All the knowledge in the world, is of no use to fools! (Eagles-long road out of Eden)
All the knowledge in the world, is of no use to fools! (Eagles-long road out of Eden)
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
thunderhead50 - that was my exact thought. Amazing
Mike Johnson,
"Only those who will risk going too far, can possibly find out how far one can go." T.S. Eliot
"Only those who will risk going too far, can possibly find out how far one can go." T.S. Eliot
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
I'm impressed that the motor in that truck can pull it! Also, I would hate to have to change a flat on that trailer.
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Check out what this guy did some time. I read a book about him one time called "Mover of Mountains and Men."
http://www.letourneau-inc.com/about/RG_bio.htm
http://www.letourneau-inc.com/about/RG_bio.htm
If you're gonna be stupid ya gotta be tough-
Isiah 55:8&9
It's easier to fool people than it is to convince them they have been fooled.
Isiah 55:8&9
It's easier to fool people than it is to convince them they have been fooled.
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
The biggest thing I've ever worked on is a 14 liter Cummins N14 and I thought those cylinder heads were heavy!!!
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Can't imagine machining those surfaces, wow.
Bro has a shop that can handle 14 foot long parts so I've seen a few large parts, lol.
Bro has a shop that can handle 14 foot long parts so I've seen a few large parts, lol.
KI6WZU
NRA member
"When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'present' or 'not guilty.'"
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“Democracy must be something more than two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner”
NRA member
"When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'present' or 'not guilty.'"
--President Theodore Roosevelt (1858-1919)
“Democracy must be something more than two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner”
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Just the thing to shoehorn into the 4X4. Sure, you'd have to lengthen the
frame a little, and maybe beef up the springs a bit..........
THAT is some motor. And a two-stroke, too..........
VERY cool stuff, Ironsides.
-Tom
frame a little, and maybe beef up the springs a bit..........
THAT is some motor. And a two-stroke, too..........
VERY cool stuff, Ironsides.
-Tom
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Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Do you have to mix the oil?stretch wrote:... And a two-stroke, too..........
"...In this present crisis, government isn't the solution to the problem; government is the problem." Ronald Reagan
"...all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed." Declaration of Independence
"...all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed." Declaration of Independence
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Otto wrote:Do you have to mix the oil?stretch wrote:... And a two-stroke, too..........
Last I checked diesel was oil.
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Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
It was a joke. Kind of like the guy above me who wants to put it in his 4x4. He isn't really going to try to do that.Bear 45/70 wrote:Otto wrote:Do you have to mix the oil?stretch wrote:... And a two-stroke, too..........
Last I checked diesel was oil.
"...In this present crisis, government isn't the solution to the problem; government is the problem." Ronald Reagan
"...all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed." Declaration of Independence
"...all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed." Declaration of Independence
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
You forgot to use a smily.....
The Rotten Fruit Always Hits The Ground First
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DAV
Proud Life Member Of:
NRA
Second Amendment Foundation
Citizens Committee For The Right To Keep And Bear Arms
DAV
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Wow, I'd hate to hafta torque the head bolts and main caps on that rascal!
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Whaddya mean I ain't gonna REALLY put it in my 4X4??!?!
Hold my beer and watch this.........
Hold my beer and watch this.........
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Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Looks like it's electric start. Note the huge, geared electric motor on the left of the huge flywheel. With pre-heated fuel and full compression relief on all but one cylinder (momentary decomp on the "start" cylinder), she'd start easy (maybe a forty horse electric motor?). It only runs at 100 rpms, and would probably stay running at half of that or less.
Certified gun nut
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
I would rather work on it than to have to pay to feed it!slimster wrote:Wow, I'd hate to hafta torque the head bolts and main caps on that rascal!
Always Drink Upstream From The Herd
- Sixgun
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Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
I'd like to drop that baby in my old '89 YJ (my avatar) Of course, I would probably have to change the motor mounts and rejet the carb, but, I would add nitrous!--------Sixgun
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
I emailed the link to this subject to a friend of mine who
works in Dallas for Nokia. He's from Finland originally. Here's his reply:
"But of course.....that engine originates from Wärtsilä Marine. From Finland.....
While you're at it, google where do Azipods come from. And all those Princess cruisers from Aker Yards"
Small world, eh?
works in Dallas for Nokia. He's from Finland originally. Here's his reply:
"But of course.....that engine originates from Wärtsilä Marine. From Finland.....
While you're at it, google where do Azipods come from. And all those Princess cruisers from Aker Yards"
Small world, eh?
- Old Ironsights
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Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Dang Vikings will rule the world some day...stretch wrote:I emailed the link to this subject to a friend of mine who
works in Dallas for Nokia. He's from Finland originally. Here's his reply:
"But of course.....that engine originates from Wärtsilä Marine. From Finland.....
While you're at it, google where do Azipods come from. And all those Princess cruisers from Aker Yards"
Small world, eh?
Good thing I'm a Beserker eh?
Ragnarok & Roll baby!
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough.
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
I remember being very impressed when my engine design instructor listed the cylinder dimensions of those big marine diesels. The bsfc has improved since those days, of course. Actually, I'm surprised the bsfc isn't better than .260. I looked at Caterpilllar's web site and find their railroad and marine series is rated in the low .26s, and they are medium speed engines. Of course, those big marine engines burn fuel that's really low grade, bottom of the barrel stuff, stuff that would choke an ordinary diesel.the most powerful and most efficient prime-mover in the world today... consumption at maximum economy is 0.260 lbs/hp/hour
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Yea back in the good old days before the EPA started running things the old Detroit diesels were all strokes.. I cut my teeth on 'em. A 318 Detroit with a 13 speed Road Ranger was good for about 85 MPH loaded. Around here that's all you could wind it up to. Life was sure simple then.
If you're gonna be stupid ya gotta be tough-
Isiah 55:8&9
It's easier to fool people than it is to convince them they have been fooled.
Isiah 55:8&9
It's easier to fool people than it is to convince them they have been fooled.
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
A nice piece of engineering indeed. However, to compare the BSFC of .260 for that engine,which runs on fuel oil, to that of a gas aeroplane or automotive engine with a bsfc of .40, is an unfair comparison. 0.40 bsfc is very good for a gas motor.The density and calorific values are different for both types of fuels.
( MODIFIED POST DUE TO SLACK BRAIN SYNDROME)
( MODIFIED POST DUE TO SLACK BRAIN SYNDROME)
Last edited by flatnose on Thu Apr 23, 2009 3:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Gasoline has a greater heating value (kJ/kg) than Bunker C, which makes the .260 of this engine all the more impressive.
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Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
How many grades of bunker are there?KWK wrote:Gasoline has a greater heating value (kJ/kg) than Bunker C, which makes the .260 of this engine all the more impressive.
Also, do you think this engine has rod caps. I remember years ago reading about big massive marine engines that turned so slow the rods didn't have caps. The weight of the pistons held the rods on the journals. I suspect this one is the same. There's not much room to swing a rod cap by the case wall.
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Steve's Guns aka "Rossi 92 Specialists"
205 Antler lane
Lampasas, Texas 76550
http://www.stevesgunz.com
Email; steve@stevesgunz.com
Tel: 512-564-1015
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
KWK,
You are correct. I should redo my previous post, but cant be bothered. There is less energy in 1 lb of bunker C #6 than there is in 1 lb of gasoline. The opposite is true if we were to compare by the gallon.
A quick bit of maths here,
bunker C 8.25lbs per gall =153,600btu's
Gasoline 6.13lbs per gallon =125,420btu's
Thus,
Bunker C is 18,618btu's per lb
gasoline is 20,460btu's per lb.
thus,
18,618 x .260=4,840 btu's/hp/hr efficient fuel oil engine
20,460 x .40 = 8,184 btu's/hp/hr efficient gasoline engine.
I think I have it right this time.
You are correct. I should redo my previous post, but cant be bothered. There is less energy in 1 lb of bunker C #6 than there is in 1 lb of gasoline. The opposite is true if we were to compare by the gallon.
A quick bit of maths here,
bunker C 8.25lbs per gall =153,600btu's
Gasoline 6.13lbs per gallon =125,420btu's
Thus,
Bunker C is 18,618btu's per lb
gasoline is 20,460btu's per lb.
thus,
18,618 x .260=4,840 btu's/hp/hr efficient fuel oil engine
20,460 x .40 = 8,184 btu's/hp/hr efficient gasoline engine.
I think I have it right this time.
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
Just had an unrelated thought.
Is it math or maths, or mathematic or mathematics?
Arithmatic or arithmatics? Its plural.....right...........i'm off to bed....
Is it math or maths, or mathematic or mathematics?
Arithmatic or arithmatics? Its plural.....right...........i'm off to bed....
Re: WAAAY OT... a small engine for Motorheads...
I recall Bunker C is the bottom of the barrel. In poking around the web, it seems "bunker" fuel is anything burned on a ship, which includes common diesel fuel.
The comment on these big two strokes lacking rod ends sounds familiar, but I find it hard to imagine. Were an exhaust valve to fail to open, I can see the piston & rod flying into the head. Keep in mind the average piston speed on these babies is not trivial. At 102 rpm that 98" stroke implies a mean piston speed of 28 fps and a peak speed above that. Now, gravity is 32 fps/s so it would take a second to stop a piston traveling at the mean piston speed, but at 102 rpm you have to decelerate in under a 1/4 second. However, there is back pressure even if the valves stick open, so maybe, but it seems unlikely to me.
As for energy/mass vs energy/volume, it reminds me how annoying greenies can be when they talk about how efficient diesels are and point to the mpg ratings of cars. Diesel has about 15% more energy per gal, and this alcohol diluted gas we get in the US ups the difference to nearly 20%. Diesels tend to be sluggish performers, which further boosts their ratings. The gas (petrol) car I had in England was the size of a Camry with a 1.8L engine in it. I got about 34 mpg in the thing overall, which boosted by the 15% energy content difference, gave me the equivalent of 39 mpg, which is only a little below what the normally aspirated diesel version got. (Turbo diesels are another matter.)
As for math vs maths, it seems to vary among the English speaking countries.
The comment on these big two strokes lacking rod ends sounds familiar, but I find it hard to imagine. Were an exhaust valve to fail to open, I can see the piston & rod flying into the head. Keep in mind the average piston speed on these babies is not trivial. At 102 rpm that 98" stroke implies a mean piston speed of 28 fps and a peak speed above that. Now, gravity is 32 fps/s so it would take a second to stop a piston traveling at the mean piston speed, but at 102 rpm you have to decelerate in under a 1/4 second. However, there is back pressure even if the valves stick open, so maybe, but it seems unlikely to me.
As for energy/mass vs energy/volume, it reminds me how annoying greenies can be when they talk about how efficient diesels are and point to the mpg ratings of cars. Diesel has about 15% more energy per gal, and this alcohol diluted gas we get in the US ups the difference to nearly 20%. Diesels tend to be sluggish performers, which further boosts their ratings. The gas (petrol) car I had in England was the size of a Camry with a 1.8L engine in it. I got about 34 mpg in the thing overall, which boosted by the 15% energy content difference, gave me the equivalent of 39 mpg, which is only a little below what the normally aspirated diesel version got. (Turbo diesels are another matter.)
As for math vs maths, it seems to vary among the English speaking countries.