Modern 45-90

[1972RedNeck]

We have an elk problem here where I farm. According to the FWP biologist, somewhere in the 2500+ head type of problem. I grow a lot of hay and the elk like to destroy our haystacks. As such, I have to do a lot of elk depredation.

I used to elk hunt back in the day with a 7mm Rem Mag. Worked fine for hunting, but it always took multiple shots to put them down. When I started getting damage tags by the 10 pack, I wanted something that would drop them instantly in one shot so I could move on to shooting the next one. 300 Win mag wasn't any more effective than the 7mm in this regard. Much to my surprise, it still takes an extra shot or two with a 375 Weatherby. Elk are tough. And after 3 or 4 shots, I'm empty and have to take time to reload while the elk run off to the nearest fence to flatten it.

So last spring I did a bunch of research and decided I needed an 1886 Winchester in 45-90. Found a new one with a 22" barrel (wanted a 26" so it could hold one more round, but there were none to be found). Worked up some hot loads - 405 gr hardcast at 2400 FPS and 300 gr Hornady interlock HPs at 2600 FPS. Seemed like one of them should be good elk medicine.

Anyways, the elk started showing up in hordes. Turns out that a 405 gr hardcast through both shoulders broadside will drop an elk instantly with one shot. Clean pass through. Took one at a little over 300 yards and it dropped like a ton of bricks. Still a clean pass through. Surprised myself with my iron sight abilities as well.

The 300 gr hollow points are also extremely effective for shots to the vitals. One shot in the lungs destroys everything in the chest cavity. One and done.

405s in the vitals just poke holes (albeit big holes) and do not result in one shot stops.

300 HPs in the shoulder destroy the shoulder but don't reliably penetrate the vitals.

Hoping I have harassed them enough so they stay away for the year but we will see.

If they come back, I am going to try some 350 gr Hornady jacketed flat nose bullets. Should be the happy medium between both bullets.


Anyways, the 45-90 is by far the most effective elk cartridge I have ever personally seen. I have no doubt a 458 Win/Lott would be equally as effective, but 8 rounds in a lever action is much quicker. Would highly recommend to any serious elk hunter.

[jkbrea]

What bullet were you using with the 7mm? I used to hunt with a 7mm RM and one shot was what it usually took. I used Nosler Partitions. I switched to a 30-06 and usually one shot is all it takes. I use factory 178 gr Eld-X. I have noticed they work better at 150 yards or more.
Can you sell tags to select hunters where you're at? Or is that a pain in the ***.
That 1886 is cool though!

[1972RedNeck]

What bullet were you using with the 7mm? I used to hunt with a 7mm RM and one shot was what it usually took. I used Nosler Partitions. I switched to a 30-06 and usually one shot is all it takes. I use factory 178 gr Eld-X. I have noticed they work better at 150 yards or more.
Can you sell tags to select hunters where you're at? Or is that a pain in the ***.
That 1886 is cool though!

I tried several different bullets. One will usually do it eventually, but I don't want them left wounded so I shoot until they drop before I move on to the next one. Who knew that a 150 year old cartridge would be just what the doctor ordered...

Pretty sure anyone can buy 2 over the counter tags here, even out of staters. Our ground is all in block management so anyone and everyone can come hunt. The problem now is that hunting season is over and the elk know it. They stay in the rugged mountains during the season so very few get harvested. We are trying to get them (FWP) to extend the hunting season through the middle of February ("shoulder season" as they call it) which would pretty much take care of the problem. Doubt many would actually get harvested, but the hunters would keep them ran off for us. Only have to worry about fences then.

[wvfarrier]

I cannot imagine being allowed to shoot elk......repeatedly. Heck, I have been in the PA lottery for 15 years and not drawn a tag

[1972RedNeck]

I cannot imagine being allowed to shoot elk......repeatedly. Heck, I have been in the PA lottery for 15 years and not drawn a tag

It sucks. I used to enjoy hunting. Nowadays I don't even like the thought of doing anything with elk. Really hoping they'll give us an extended season this year so I don't have to deal with them and maybe more people can actually harvest and utilize them.

[Bill in Oregon]

Redneck, your curse would strike many of us as a blessing, until we factored in depredation of our hard-earned crops. Your experience with the the big .45 slugs suggests the "Old Dead Guys" knew a thing or two about how to decommission large mammals. Be curious how that 405-grain slug would do at black powder Sharps/Winchester velocities. Bet it would be very similar.

[Grizz]

Redneck, your curse would strike many of us as a blessing, until we factored in depredation of our hard-earned crops. Your experience with the the big .45 slugs suggests the "Old Dead Guys" knew a thing or two about how to decommission large mammals. Be curious how that 405-grain slug would do at black powder Sharps/Winchester velocities. Bet it would be very similar.

a glance at the impact velocities with that performance is all anyone could want to know about hand gun hunting with 405 grain bullits. [ just sayin' ]

[marlinman93]

Never had the situation where I needed to harvest elk to save crops, but I have hunted area here where land owners invited hunters, and even posted their land "welcome to hunt". Of course as time went by many changed to charging hunters to hunt their land as they wanted to make even more money off their land.
The .45-90 is a great hunting cartridge for large game, but I've never used it myself. I have taken one cow elk with .45-70 and it did a great job using my usual 480 grain cast bullet. I've also taken elk with my .30-06 and 165 grain bullets and they did the job well.

[hfcable]

have used the hornady 350 gr on large caribou and on moose. its a very good choice. it worked great. one and done every time.

[Rimfire McNutjob]

Oh man, that 405 @ 2400fps is hustlin' from a 22" barrel. Pretty darn good shot at 300 with opens. I wonder if it was still doing maybe 1800-ish when it hit ... maybe more.

I load the 350 grain Speer JFP in my 20" rifle in 450 AK but I can't quite get to 2400 without getting nervous about the pressures. I don't think that bullet would be appropriate in a 45-90 ... too long in the ogive from nose to crimp groove. It's 0.650" nose to crimp. I think it's meant for the 458 Win Mag or the Lott.

The Hornady 350 is shorter nose to crimp for use in the 45-70. I expect those bullets meant for 45-70 would be appropriate in 45-90.

Are you casting your own 405's or did you get them from somewhere online? Something like these?

Hard times, having to constantly shoot elk.

[mnmarlin]

405 grains at 2400 fps is .416 Rigby/Remington territory, that's gonna hurt both ways.

[1972RedNeck]

Are you casting your own 405's or did you get them from somewhere online?

Missouri Bullets Hi Tek coated.

[Galloway]

405s hurt at 1400fps in my 86 carbine, i cant imagine 1000 fps more!

[1972RedNeck]

405s hurt at 1400fps in my 86 carbine, i cant imagine 1000 fps more!

Limbsaver slip on and some light bruising if I shoot a bunch of them. Definitely a lot of wallop with the lever gun style stock compared to a bolt gun.

[Eddie Southgate]

A proper loaded .45-70 will kill them Elk just as dead as the .45-90 and the 26" Marlin holds 9 in the mag and 1 in the chamber. More Elk before you have to reload .

[348win]

Interesting thread and good shooting

Jeeze I'm a wimp, my 348win shoots a 220gr @ 2300fps and that Carbine HAMMERS me, your just about doubling the bullet weight

If you dont mind sharing, how much do you weigh man to shoot a 405gr @ 2400fps????
I got to wonder how big a guy is that can soak up that recoil.

1886......crescent buttplate??????
Ouch

[348win]

It amazes me the wood stocks hold up to that tremendous shock.

[samsi]

I once picked up an original 1886 in 45-90 cheap, it was cheap because someone once upon a time made it a 22" short rifle. It still wore the crescent butt and when I worked up some smokeless loads for it (nowhere near 2400 f/s) it near beat me to death. Other than the recoil it handled nicely at that length though.

My "serious" 405 grain load in the 450 Alaskan runs right about 2000 f/s, I had worked it up higher but backed off to the 2000 mark as it didn't rattle my teeth so much. It still lets you know you shot something.

[Rimfire McNutjob]

I'm glad my rifle has a shotgun butt.

[1972RedNeck]

Interesting thread and good shooting

Jeeze I'm a wimp, my 348win shoots a 220gr @ 2300fps and that Carbine HAMMERS me, your just about doubling the bullet weight

If you dont mind sharing, how much do you weigh man to shoot a 405gr @ 2400fps????
I got to wonder how big a guy is that can soak up that recoil.

1886......crescent buttplate??????
Ouch

6' 1" and low 170s. Down from almost 200 a couple years ago.

Halfway between a crescent and shogun butt plate. I have a slip on limbsaver on it to get the LOP right for me.

[veeman]

Get yourself a shotgun converted leather butt cover. Adds an inch of LOP (which I needed anyway) and makes shooting much more comfortable.
https://gunstockcover.com/
My Browning 1886's

[wvfarrier]

There is a guy on youtube who built a bolt action rifle in 45-110 and was shooting it to well past 1000 yards. It was impressive