any 4Runners onboard?

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Grizz
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any 4Runners onboard?

Post by Grizz »

I acquired a third generation 1999 SR5 4WD 3.4L V6 4Runner. Presently gathering the external bits and pieces, ignition, injectors, trans oil-cooler, timing belt, water pump, new radiator, etc.

anyone doing this or have done this? i am driving this to Texas for Family Reunion, in the heat of summer, and updating the things that will make the trip do-able. plus some high desert high altitude off-pavement camp out time. and perhaps, maybe, if i can keep the trans and engine temps in check, and the AC working overtime to keep me alive, just maybe we can cross Death Valley at night, because it is one of my favorite places to drive. . . , and i'd hate to miss it.

this v6 is entirely foreign to me, a far cry from the push rod v6 in the chevy van. i never knew what a COP ignition was. my injector experience is confined to milking an amazing number hours out of Detroit diesels. [4-71 and 8V-71, the finest machines], totally different from the toyota version of direct injection, where you have to disassemble and move an obnoxious amount of "stuff" to reach the fuel rails.

if i were a truck-builder, if i had enough time left, i would take the body off of the frame and install a chevy 6-235 in the engine bay, and drive the wheels through a stick shift. and get more torque at lower revs, and no electronic engine parts. which would reduce the failure points by several orders of magnitude. and then head for the dunes and single tracks and go over landing in the mountains.

but, for now, i am confining my tasks to the ones i mentioned, and the ones that develop along the way. just to go 4-wheeling across the wonders of America.

i am distracted from the horrors of the new world order by the prospect of enjoying my kids and grand kids in the flesh.

over,

rossim92
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by rossim92 »

well, imoo, if you are going across death valley and running ac, you should at least upgrade to a bigger radiator and a inline trans cooler. also run professional grade water wetter in the coolant, it helps eliminate air pockets in the coolant and with the transfer of heat from the metal to the coolant. it should run 20 degrees cooler under load compared to not running the wetter.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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rossim92 wrote: Mon Apr 18, 2022 1:57 pm well, imoo, if you are going across death valley and running ac, you should at least upgrade to a bigger radiator and a inline trans cooler. also run professional grade water wetter in the coolant, it helps eliminate air pockets in the coolant and with the transfer of heat from the metal to the coolant. it should run 20 degrees cooler under load compared to not running the wetter.
Thanks for the info. I appreciate it.

yup. on the list. new radiator and new trans cooler. new water pump, thermostat, timing belt, etc. do you have a link to the water wetter agent? i am familiar with the concept in film processing, the analog version. i am going to install a trans temp gauge to monitor the actual temps and drive accordingly. i may install an oil cooler with a fan for more cool. any opinions on that? read a report from a jeep off roader who got transmission temps under control with the fan version. i'm interested in this. if it's running too cool in death valley i can stop the fan. Heh.
Last edited by Grizz on Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by 3leggedturtle »

Only comment I have is: Drive at night so its a little cooler.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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3leggedturtle wrote: Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:25 pm Only comment I have is: Drive at night so its a little cooler.
that's the plan. i can drive the 8000+ foot passes in the daytime, they provide some relief and i can sleep at night at those elevations . . . :)

OTOH the Owens Valley is SCORCHING HOT, and the gas stop at the Bishop casino is grueling. Although the manvan kept me alive through it. bless his heart . . . , :D
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by jeepnik »

On you tube check out chloekuo. She’s building an older 4 runner has some good videos.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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jeepnik wrote: Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:02 pm On you tube check out chloekuo. She’s building an older 4 runner has some good videos.
Thanks. will do.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by harry »

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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by rossim92 »

Grizz wrote: Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:22 pm
rossim92 wrote: Mon Apr 18, 2022 1:57 pm well, imoo, if you are going across death valley and running ac, you should at least upgrade to a bigger radiator and a inline trans cooler. also run professional grade water wetter in the coolant, it helps eliminate air pockets in the coolant and with the transfer of heat from the metal to the coolant. it should run 20 degrees cooler under load compared to not running the wetter.
Thanks for the info. I appreciate it.

yup. on the list. new radiator and new trans cooler. new water pump, thermostat, timing belt, etc. do you have a link to the water wetter agent? i am familiar with the concept in film processing, the analog version. i am going to install a trans temp gauge to monitor the actual temps and drive accordingly. i may install an oil cooler with a fan for more cool. any opinions on that? read a report from a jeep off roader who got transmission temps under control with the fan version. i'm interested in this. if it's running too cool in death valley i can stop the fan. Heh.
https://www.amazon.com/Red-Line-80204-W ... 29758&th=1 +1 on the oil cooler, use steel line and connectors, heck with rubber hoses
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by Grizz »

thanks for the tip. trans cooler is on the way and i'm picking up a toyota radiator at a dealer this week. more "stuff" to accumulate before i can unscrew anything. ignition first, that may devolve to injectors, because gen3 4runners have that kind of identity crises. once the top ends of all those pipes and tubes and exposed wires are checked out and i get some miles on the chains and sprockets { :roll: } i will take apart the front end and get water pump and timing belt in and start paying attention to the transmission temperatures..... fun for me, been a long long time since i did this type of stuff for a long trip. on vehicles rather than vessels. LOL
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by Malamute »

I have an 05 with the v6, its been an excellent vehicle so far. It had about 175K when I got it, its around 245K now. Oil changes and put gas in it. Mine unfortunately is a 2wd, though Ive been getting 22-24 mpg on the road, towing a pickup bed trailer it drops to 17-18 mpg. I cant complain much.

The questions Ive had and searched, the good answers l kept turning up were here, so I joined. https://www.toyota-4runner.org/

I was extremely happy to learn I could reprogram the auto door locks easily, theres several operating modes, or off, which I like. Same for programming a door remote fob. Simple. Dealers often charge people a lot to do really simple things they can generally do themselves.

The check engine light came on. Carp. Who to have scan it..... Checked the question on google with the forum as the target location, found that replacing the gas cap often fixed it, and it did.

I think you can likely find good info on your questions there.

I made a dog/cargo shelf in the back, it gives the dog a place to lay and see whats going on, relatively secure storage, and if I want to sleep in the back, I take the front off and my legs go under the platform, still lots of room for the dog and a small mountain of junk, and I can stretch out and sleep.

https://bushcraftusa.com/forum/threads/ ... st-5719615

I also modified a rear hitch mounted cargo rack and built a box on it, inside is a small Honda generator, which runs a small window AC unit that keeps the dog cool if I have to stop when on the road, or go in stores when tooling around town. It will run about 6 hrs on a gallon of gas in eco mode. I get a lot of pointing and laughing at times, but also people asking about it. I painted the outside of the AC to match the truck, so it blends in better now. I install it in spring when temps get above 65 regularly and remove it when they stay below that in the fall. It works very well. The AC is set to 61 deg and the dog is cool and sacked out up into the 90s without much drama.

https://bushcraftusa.com/forum/threads/ ... le.228995/
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by Grizz »

BIG THANKS! great idea on the genset. i have one that would be perfect for that application for me. heat makes me deathly ill. now i can park under a rock and sleep!! and not have to idle the engine, which i've read overheats the older models. will check out your forum, i'm at https://www.4runners.com/ . reading tales of 4s taking up time these days. watching Timmys Garage on youtube. He is good about listing the part numbers he is using.

thanks again for the links.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by jeepnik »

If you don’t get a gen set at least get a good jump box. Top end ones even have small compressors. I like my Dewalt. Lives in my Tacoma.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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jeepnik wrote: Tue Apr 19, 2022 6:18 pm If you don’t get a gen set at least get a good jump box. Top end ones even have small compressors. I like my Dewalt. Lives in my Tacoma.
you bet, i always have one with me. i've started a lot of cars with it, and kept my tires aired up. one thing i wouldn't want to leave behind.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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Seriously considering putting one of the onboard welders on my Jeep. The ARB fits under the driver’s seat. The welder looks like it would tuck nicely under the passenger side. It’s good old fashioned stick welding but it gets the job done.
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"Go low, go slow and preferably in the dark" The old Sarge (he was maybe 24.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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jeepnik wrote: Tue Apr 19, 2022 11:02 pm Seriously considering putting one of the onboard welders on my Jeep. The ARB fits under the driver’s seat. The welder looks like it would tuck nicely under the passenger side. It’s good old fashioned stick welding but it gets the job done.
I get that. I like welders, I like stick welding. had welders on a boats. What powers that unit?
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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Grizz wrote: Tue Apr 19, 2022 11:06 pm
jeepnik wrote: Tue Apr 19, 2022 11:02 pm Seriously considering putting one of the onboard welders on my Jeep. The ARB fits under the driver’s seat. The welder looks like it would tuck nicely under the passenger side. It’s good old fashioned stick welding but it gets the job done.
I get that. I like welders, I like stick welding. had welders on a boats. What powers that unit?
Higher output alternator. I've read and seen videos from uses that look promising. I'd really like to test one before I buy but these days of internet shopping that's pretty much impossible. I'm going to have to go to a 4WD show and hope a vendor is there.
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"Go low, go slow and preferably in the dark" The old Sarge (he was maybe 24.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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Grizz wrote: Tue Apr 19, 2022 2:55 pm BIG THANKS! great idea on the genset. i have one that would be perfect for that application for me. heat makes me deathly ill. now i can park under a rock and sleep!! and not have to idle the engine, which i've read overheats the older models. will check out your forum, i'm at https://www.4runners.com/ . reading tales of 4s taking up time these days. watching Timmys Garage on youtube. He is good about listing the part numbers he is using.

thanks again for the links.
I looked at all sorts of ways to cool a vehicle when not running, the gen and window AC seemed the best and most reliable all around solution, and having a gen is pretty handy at times. Ive run a skill saw, sawzall, cordless tool battery charger and other things when needed. One could even run a battery charger for the vehicle if need be if your battery died, air compressor, or a heater for that matter for cold weather over nighters. I used a several year old window AC that my dad had, I dont know how many seasons he used it, maybe 3 or 4? It lasted about 3 years for me before it wasnt quite as cold as it should be, I bought another decent one for about $180 I think. Some have suggested using the RV rooftop AC units, but they are expensive, use quite a bit of power, at least the ones I checked several years ago, and require a hole in the roof and catch air when driving. I truly see no point when a small window unit works so well and is relatively simple to install and remove, and cheap to replace if need be. Every walmart or big box hardware store stocks them, so one can walk in and grab one in season if it conks out on the road.

The older AC unit needed the hard start capacitor mentioned in the link to be able to start in eco mode. I had read that newer ones may not, so i tried my new one I bought last fall and it started and ran fine without the added hard start capacitor, they seem to be using better capacitors now.

The Honda seems pretty trouble free. As much as we hear about the poor gas today, Ive tried to get good gas for it. I havent always been able to get pure gas for the gen, and its sat for 5 or 6 months over the winter with no draining or treating of fuel. It takes about 6 pulls to start in the spring, but thereafter one or two does it fine through the season. I didnt even remove it from the cargo box this past winter, it lived out in the box, and 6 pulls started it just like it has when taken in for the winter. I run it 20 minutes to see if it seems happy, so far its been fine each year on start-up.
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Isnt it amazing how many people post without reading the thread?
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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i normally shut down my small engines by choking them with engine oil added into the carb. they normally start right up. my chain saw can sit for a year or two, and will start up with a couple pulls. my daughter left a Honda 4-wheeler at my alaska cabin for several years. i put it up with the same choke it to death with crank case oil. when she finally retrieved it and gassed it up it started on the first kick. used to do the same thing with my truck when i winterized it, choke it. rings might be sealed just enough to up the compression a bit, idk.

i'm pretty sure the 4Runner would have a hissey-fit if it got my standard layup treatment.....

and about "bad gas". I brought six or seven gallons of gas back from alaska. mostly outboard cans. put it in the car, after sitting around for years, and it ran just fine. i have yet to find any gasoline that won't burn as long as all the water is out of it. chamois cloth sees to that . . . maybe the oil in the carb prevents anything from clogging the jets. idk.

@Jeep, how big an alternator?

Oh yeah, one more question. About gauges. i plan to install oil press, trans temp, and voltage gauges. I am having trouble finding anything that passes the smell test on amz. the only thing close is autometer, which sounds ok to me

I can try some other places, but wondering what the car guys use or like. AND how to mount them. I am thinking about a 3 gauge cluster on the binnacle, er, dashboard in the vicinity of the 3 gauges the FJs have.

Two inch gauges are a little big for the purpose, but I just want ones that work right and don't quit after two months like the 7-color merry-go-rounds do.

thanks for links or info, i'm getting close to having enough stuff to start work. once i get all the junk out of the garage so i can take the hood off and have a dry shack to work in . ..

thanks again
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by jeepnik »

Moisture is the big killer of gasoline. Keep it well sealed and it will be good for a long time. Things like Stabil have a place, but their advertising has let to a lot of misunderstanding and great sales.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by Grizz »

took a ferry ride to the "other side" and picked up a new radiator at a ginormous toyota dealer. ate the fish and chips on the ferry on the back tack. lovely day.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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I don’t know the output of the supplied alternator. There’s one fellow that runs an off road recovery service out of Moab. It works well for trailside repairs which is what mine would be for.

Just looked and the output varies from application to application. For my Tacoma it looks like a 180 amp alternator. The outfit is Premier Power Welder.
Jeepnik AKA "Old Eyes"
"Go low, go slow and preferably in the dark" The old Sarge (he was maybe 24.
"Freedom is never more that a generation from extinction" Ronald Reagan
"Every man should have at least one good rifle and know how to use it" Dad
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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jeepnik wrote: Fri Apr 22, 2022 12:35 am I don’t know the output of the supplied alternator. There’s one fellow that runs an off road recovery service out of Moab. It works well for trailside repairs which is what mine would be for.

Just looked and the output varies from application to application. For my Tacoma it looks like a 180 amp alternator. The outfit is Premier Power Welder.
I checked that setup out. Looks like an ideal setup for running 6011 and 7018. you can weld stainless steel to mild steel with 7018. not much penetration but strong enough to hold fishing gear onto a steel deck.

Do you remember when there was still good surplus stuff around you could small motor generators that you could connect by pulley to your engine and stick weld with them. I think ranchers probably have that kind of stuff.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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Yep, saw those on some old CJ5’s. I believe there was an outfit selling complete rigs. Pretty sure they disappeared when smog pumps became mandatory.

Busted spring hangers and such could be cobbled together in a jiffy. More than once I went out with a welded up part or two.

Loved real junk yards where you could find real steel scrap, often free if you knew the owner.
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"Go low, go slow and preferably in the dark" The old Sarge (he was maybe 24.
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"Every man should have at least one good rifle and know how to use it" Dad
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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jeepnik wrote: Sun Apr 24, 2022 7:42 pm Yep, saw those on some old CJ5’s. I believe there was an outfit selling complete rigs. Pretty sure they disappeared when smog pumps became mandatory.

Busted spring hangers and such could be cobbled together in a jiffy. More than once I went out with a welded up part or two.

Loved real junk yards where you could find real steel scrap, often free if you knew the owner.
AND real flea markets where you could find quality tools for reasonable prices. and buy a 30-30 winchester with no paperwork and no difficulties. the good old days. it took a long time for the WWII mil surplus to evaporate.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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getting closer to the mechanics stage. have new radiator and new transmission add on cooler, and new ignition parts and new fuel parts...

AFTER I GET THE REST OF THE STORAGE STUFF OUT OF THE GARAGE so i can take the hood off and have some fun...
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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Grizz wrote: Fri Apr 29, 2022 1:31 pm getting closer to the mechanics stage. have new radiator and new transmission add on cooler, and new ignition parts and new fuel parts...

AFTER I GET THE REST OF THE STORAGE STUFF OUT OF THE GARAGE so i can take the hood off and have some fun...
I looked very hard for an FJ , but couldn't find the right truck at the right time. My Dad's version long ago is one of the vehicles I drove in my wild hormone years. Why any society would give a hormone overdosed teenager a weapon of mass destruction, and turn them loose on innocent walkers and joggers and drivers is something i canna ken

But now I am over the FJ for a while because this gen3 toyota fits me and suits me, and takes my mind off of social distractions, like the more than 9000 Ukrainian civilians buried in mass graves. so i fiddle with the code scanner and the cassette tape player... and the little bits and pieces that are headed for the truck....
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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Does this Toyo have quite a bit of miles/hours on it? The little things are known for their "take a lickin and keep on tickin" personas. The reputation of the older ones is why i currently drive a '18 Tacoma


Id love to make an "overland" type rig out of it as its the Sport model with the lockers and all that, but for me ive come to the healthy conclusion that its not something i need. I dont plan on getting into any situation where the stock toyota is not sufficient .
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by jeepnik »

I’m running a 2020 2WD Sport. For most of what one of what I do it is capable. If I intend anything serious my 82 CJ-8 does what’s needed.

2WD pickups, especially with a limited slip or locker, can handle a lot more than folks think. For all but the most extreme it’s the driver not the vehicle that succeeds or fails.

Of course I’ve only been doing this for 52 year what do I know.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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Streetstar wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 2:58 pm Does this Toyo have quite a bit of miles/hours on it? The little things are known for their "take a lickin and keep on tickin" personas. The reputation of the older ones is why i currently drive a '18 Tacoma


Id love to make an "overland" type rig out of it as its the Sport model with the lockers and all that, but for me ive come to the healthy conclusion that its not something i need. I dont plan on getting into any situation where the stock toyota is not sufficient .
YEAH, it has around 289, but there might have been an engine swap, but haven't seen signs of it. I am going through stuff that will keep the temps down, and new normal maintenance stuff, and maybe fix a leaking engine oil cooler, if that's what it is. Jeep is right, a two wheel drive vehicle is fine, and it is the driver that counts. I was looking for one but this 4WD came up and i guess i needed another project. I have 314k on a chevy uplander, and it's still going, but i don't trust the trans for long road trips any more. This 4runner is the first 4WD i've owned, and I am looking forward to revisiting all the places i got the chevy stuck! but no desire to go rock crawling, although i would stop to watch... i do plan to spend some winter in Death Valley on the roads that pounded the chevy pretty hard. just the few inches of extra ground clearance is what i really wanted. if I want more seclusion i can pack the KL around with me. Heh
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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Grizz wrote: Wed May 04, 2022 1:47 am

YEAH, it has around 289, but there might have been an engine swap, but haven't seen signs of it. I am going through stuff that will keep the temps down, and new normal maintenance stuff, and maybe fix a leaking engine oil cooler, if that's what it is.

Totally. Id be doing the same thing with 289 on it too.
----- Doug
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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Streetstar wrote: Wed May 04, 2022 12:30 pm
Grizz wrote: Wed May 04, 2022 1:47 am

YEAH, it has around 289, but there might have been an engine swap, but haven't seen signs of it. I am going through stuff that will keep the temps down, and new normal maintenance stuff, and maybe fix a leaking engine oil cooler, if that's what it is.

Totally. Id be doing the same thing with 289 on it too.
well, the chevy has 314 on it, and it's still strong and a good town car, but no mo road trips for that one. if this 4Runner gives me too much trouble I might put a chevy 6-235 in it with a stick shift and take out all the stinking computers. LOL AND have better torque at lower rpm. hard to explain bottom end stroker torque to people who never drove one!!

i'll know more soon with the plugs talk to me
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by 450 Fuller »

Grizz:

I have a 4WD 96 and a 2003 2WD version. The newer one has 163 K and the 96-137 K
A 2000 Tundra std 5-speed-anti-theft trans . The Tundra has roll-down windows...

The later 98-on 4-Rs have good engines but watch out for mice near the engine/harness.
A useless device is the knock sensors. Maybe good for Mexican gas, but otherwise
a headache as we know when the engine knocks or pings. It reduces timing .

At any rate, fox urine of all things keeps mice and all rodents away. Get it from Amazon.
In winter, park outside as rodents prefer inside cars & bikes. Ethanol is not the friend of
internal combustion engines. The more the %, worse the gas.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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Thanks for the tip Mr. 450. we've been using peppermint drops and it seems to keep the rats out of the engine bay. my daughter is persuaded that it is good rat/mouse repellent, we put 10 drops in a spray bottle of water and mist the various places they haunt. no more rat stuff . . . hey, there's an idea . . .

do you have a link to the urine source? is this part of your routine? any testing?

thanks for the input. my runner isn't. yet. but i might have fixed the engine miss. but i can't know until i fix the radiator overflow tube that i managed to break off of the filler neck. it's old plastic, i'm going straight to the jb weld in hopes of getting a bit of runtime before the next stage... grizz
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by 450 Fuller »

The way i "fixed" the knock sensor issue is by selling my 2003 4-Runner. Someone wanted it bad-as it looked nice. I told him about the issues, but he was more interested
in the low mileage. It sold this week. Will miss it and went to Yellowstone and Canada.
Luckily, PT Barnum was right.

Fox urine WORKS-just Google it in. It smells, but mice and other rodents leave in a hurry.
I will find another one, as they are around-just have to look and be patient. Low mileage and the right deal.

Toyotas are tough, so you will be able to fix yours.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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4runner's got good bones, good heart. Rocinante, my '95, has still a bit under 300K, so just about broke in. The roads (!) I rattle around in keep it flexible; I added a winch last year to satisfy Mama that I'll keep makin' it home, or at least to some place where there's cellphone coverage--yes, there's a story there, but I'll keep it to myself.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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HEY thanks windy. glad you're aboard. I AM still chasing a miss on mine. replaced the MAF sensor today, will put in new O2 sensors tomorrow. last code i got was lean on bank 1, so going after that. Grrr

this is after new plugs and coils and wires and injectors, which helped but runrun still has a miss which keeps him grounded.

I still hope this truck makes it, and doesn't become a hobby.

Regards,
grizz
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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well, I thought someone here might be interested in this item.

a one ton Chevy with a Detroit 3-53 and TWO transmissions. it's two videos

part 1 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g45hb4Sv4a8 the how

part 2 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C94vfDmp8Gw going for a ride

stumbled on this because i'm thinking of sticking this engine in the Toyota NoRunner
.
.
I love this kind of engenuity.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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Never had a Toyota V6 as my SR5 4x4 was the 22R 4 cylinder version. Owned mine for 25 years, and only had 135,000 miles when I sold it. Never a problem with the truck, except for alternators and regulators. Seemed to eat those pretty regularly, and never got more than a couple years from them. I bought the lifetime alternators from Schucks, and when they became OReilly's they were still giving me free replacements a couple decades later.
If I ever swapped a Chevy engine in a Toyota it wouldn't be the inline 6 cy. Just too long to fit in the engine bay with the extra two cylinders over a 4 cyl., and extra three over a V6. A small V8 would fit better, and give more power and torque. Plus they sell kits to do a V8 Chev conversion in Toyota trucks.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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Mine has the V6; the only time I got stranded from a malfunction (other than between the driver's ears) was when my computer's ground wire got loose--made for intermittent starting. It fooled a couple of pretty good mechanics before one of them accidently touched the wire itself and it abruptly roared to life. Tiny things, tiny things....
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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thanks guys. Marlinman, it would be easy to extend the frame a bit to get clearance for a 6. I think. the 292 has great torque at half of Toyota's rpm for torque. Plus all the "stuff" is on the outside of the engine in plain sight. Plus only one camshaft. And only 12 valve seats. And 7 main bearings. and the ability to do an in-frame overhaul. And the best part, no computer. I doubt it will happen, but I have done some engine swaps at that technology grade, so it's not too daunting.

windy, that's a good reminder to check the grounds spots. I'll freshen them up as I find them
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

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Grizz wrote: Sat May 28, 2022 12:59 am thanks guys. Marlinman, it would be easy to extend the frame a bit to get clearance for a 6. I think. the 292 has great torque at half of Toyota's rpm for torque. Plus all the "stuff" is on the outside of the engine in plain sight. Plus only one camshaft. And only 12 valve seats. And 7 main bearings. and the ability to do an in-frame overhaul. And the best part, no computer. I doubt it will happen, but I have done some engine swaps at that technology grade, so it's not too daunting.

windy, that's a good reminder to check the grounds spots. I'll freshen them up as I find them
Frame wouldn't need extending, but the radiator and grille would. It would end up looking pretty ugly with the radiator sitting where the grille is now, and some kind of make shift rock guard out ahead of the bumper to protect the relocated radiator.
the torque of the 292 Chev six is a bit of a myth in reality. Around 260 ft. lbs. at 2000 rpm's. A stock 350 SBC is around 325 ft. lbs., and with a few upgrades to cam, and heads it can easily be over 400 ft. lbs. and not be radical. My 350 in my '39 Chev coupe is around 430 hp, and 419 ft. lb. torque and just has upgraded heads, and a Howard's roller camshaft. It still drives great, and gets 17-18 mpg at 75 mph cruise speeds with 3.73 gears and an OD trans.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by Grizz »

marlinman93 wrote: Sun May 29, 2022 10:14 am
Grizz wrote: Sat May 28, 2022 12:59 am thanks guys. Marlinman, it would be easy to extend the frame a bit to get clearance for a 6. I think. the 292 has great torque at half of Toyota's rpm for torque. Plus all the "stuff" is on the outside of the engine in plain sight. Plus only one camshaft. And only 12 valve seats. And 7 main bearings. and the ability to do an in-frame overhaul. And the best part, no computer. I doubt it will happen, but I have done some engine swaps at that technology grade, so it's not too daunting.

windy, that's a good reminder to check the grounds spots. I'll freshen them up as I find them
Frame wouldn't need extending, but the radiator and grille would. It would end up looking pretty ugly with the radiator sitting where the grille is now, and some kind of make shift rock guard out ahead of the bumper to protect the relocated radiator.
the torque of the 292 Chev six is a bit of a myth in reality. Around 260 ft. lbs. at 2000 rpm's. A stock 350 SBC is around 325 ft. lbs., and with a few upgrades to cam, and heads it can easily be over 400 ft. lbs. and not be radical. My 350 in my '39 Chev coupe is around 430 hp, and 419 ft. lb. torque and just has upgraded heads, and a Howard's roller camshaft. It still drives great, and gets 17-18 mpg at 75 mph cruise speeds with 3.73 gears and an OD trans.
Thank you for the specific info. I know you know way more than I do about this stuff.

Yeah, pretty ugly I suppose. A lot of the rock crawler crew have ugly rides don't they? Not arguing with you about this because I know you know way more than I do about this kind of swap.
The cylinder bore is 93.5 mm (3.68 in) and the piston stroke is 82.0 mm (3.23 in). Compression ratio rating is 9.6:1. The Toyota 5VZ-FE engine produced 193 PS (142 kW; 190 HP) at 4,800 rpm of maximum power and 298 N·m (30.4 kg·m, 219.6 ft·lb) at 3,600 rpm of maximum torque.
From where I am sitting behind the steering wheel, the 4.125" stroke at 2000 seems better to me than what's in there now. To me.

Toyotas have to be supercharged to get the torque, and it's still at the higher rpm.

I am coming at this from the marine engine POV, which is essentially a stationary, long stroke, low rev torquer. I pushed an 85,000 pound boat around the GOA with a detuned 8V71 running below 1800, for more than 2500 days, and the engine ran like it didn't notice. I reckon engine wear to be how many feet the pistons travel over the life of the engine. On this basis the 5vzfe isn't even remotely reliable if worked like that.

To me, cruising overland at under 2000 seems fantastic. But I am interested in your experience. One question about the whole project is "how much ooomph do I actually need?" I don't know how much Torque the driveline can process and remain intact. And I don't like all the "extra" valves and camshafts that Toyota uses just because they can. I like valves that I can watch operating, and leave the camshaft where it belongs. :wink:

I think they did it to overcome the 4.3-ish diffs on the highway. Do you think that's correct? Do you think a brownie could work in that driveline? Maybe in 2L, IDK. Probably not.

I really like what you did with your car, it's fantastic, but I don't need or want 430Hp. I could go with a 22R I-4 engine, but I think it would have to be turbo'd to get the specs of the straight 6. I think your engine in my truck would leave all the heat treated hardware in a sand dune, and maybe twist the axles too...

Would a body lift accommodate the 292? The 6 would leave a lot of elbow room, where all the V6s seem to be around the same size. Another thing that attracts me to the 292 is that all the stuff that needs attention is bolted to the block. I don't have to take the engine apart, down to the bare naked crankshaft, to install a water pump or timing belt. I don't have to drop the gas tank to install the fuel pump. I don't have to pull the intake manifold to deal with fuel injectors. I'm thinking of a tractor I guess! ROFLOL With NO COMPUTER!!!

Thanks again for the input. If I can't make this toyota run right I'll have a big decision to make. The problem lots of Gen3 4Runners are having are electrical issues with sensors and relays. The wiring harness would bury my engine. And every one of those connectors is another failure point. And they do. Off to replace a couple of sensors and try try again. :)

P.S.
The 8v71 N engine enables a compression ratio of 18.7:1. The engine offers a power output of 318 horsepower, 237 kW at 2,100 RPM. It produces a maximum torque of 863 ft-lbs, 1170 Nm at 1,200 RPM.
I reckoned mine to be 240HP, but don't know the torque. I have looked at putting a Detroit 3-53 in the 4Runner, which has been done. But the 4-53 would be closer to the torque range I am looking for. The 3-53 is perfectly balanced and can be run sitting on the floor with no restraints, and no hopping around... :lol:
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by marlinman93 »

Grizz, the body lift wont do anything to accommodate more engine length. It's just not feasible to add two cylinders of length and fit into the Forerunner engine bay. And beyond length the 292 weighs 50 lbs. more than a SBC V8.
Power wise the stock Toyota drivetrain will handle lower HP V8's, but that depends on how you drive, where you drive, and tire size. For guys who are doing a lot of offroading, and serious climbing with huge tires, the stock transfer case, trans, and axles might not hold up well to the abuse. But for stock type offroad tires, and the occasional journey down rough or dirt roads it will hold up fine to a V8 of around 300-325 HP. These really are well built trucks, and certainly not lightweights for their size.
With an overdrive trans that is around .70:1 top gear the engine will run 65 at around 2000-2100 rpm's depending on tire size, and gear ratios. A lot better mileage than the stock 22R engines get. My 22R got around 14-15 mpg at freeway speeds, and was the one disappointment I had with my '84 Toyota SR5.
My engine is great for my '39 Chev coupe, but wouldn't be my choice for a Toyota swap. I'd consider a 305 or 350 V8 that was fairly stock. I'd lean towards the 350 myself because stock HP on a 305 is under 240 HP and it's not as torquey as the 350, or most straight sixes. 350's run as low as 170 hp, up to 370 hp, so I'd shoot for something around 250hp-275hp, as it will be plenty, plus decent torque, and mileage.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by Grizz »

Marlinman93 I appreciate this. Thank you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AyHhitauogM

I'll start looking for one now . . . . maybe just build one from scratch and set it up as carefully as I can.

time to start trolling the yards.

what are the stick shift options that you would look for?
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by marlinman93 »

Grizz wrote: Mon May 30, 2022 11:51 am Marlinman93 I appreciate this. Thank you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AyHhitauogM

I'll start looking for one now . . . . maybe just build one from scratch and set it up as carefully as I can.

time to start trolling the yards.

what are the stick shift options that you would look for?
If you decide to go with a small Chev V8, don't forget to check Craigslist for private sales. I started looking over a year before I needed an engine, and came across an ad on CL for a rebuilt 1990 Chev 350 short block. The price was $100 so I figured it was worth it as a builder if it turned out the seller was fibbing.
I got it home on my engine stand and disassembled all the mains, rods, and dropped the pistons out, while keeping everything in order. It was as advertised with all new bearings, and rings, and even an unknown camshaft. I got it so cheap I decided not to use the camshaft as no way to check lift, duration, and LSA. (lobe separation) So bought a new camshaft, and a nice pair of heads, and assembled it for the coupe. The heads cost many times what the engine cost, but I'm still under $1000 complete.
So since you're not in a hurry, just keep checking and something might turn up.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by Grizz »

Great input, thanks again. Got me in search mode now. Here's my shopping list so far . . . ,
.
Screenshot 2022-05-31 100843.png
.
:lol:
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by marlinman93 »

Grizz wrote: Tue May 31, 2022 2:13 pm Great input, thanks again. Got me in search mode now. Here's my shopping list so far . . . ,
.
Screenshot 2022-05-31 100843.png
.
:lol:
That ought to move the 4runner down the road!

I just put my 350 back together yesterday for my '39 Chev coupe. Had a few of my spendy roller lifters fail, and decided to remove the intake and replace the whole set. Shipping times drag on right now, and it's been apart waiting on the new lifters for two weeks. I'm putting the coolant in today, and firing it up.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by Grizz »

marlinman93 wrote: Wed Jun 01, 2022 10:53 am
Grizz wrote: Tue May 31, 2022 2:13 pm Great input, thanks again. Got me in search mode now. Here's my shopping list so far . . . ,
.
Screenshot 2022-05-31 100843.png
.
:lol:
That ought to move the 4runner down the road!

I just put my 350 back together yesterday for my '39 Chev coupe. Had a few of my spendy roller lifters fail, and decided to remove the intake and replace the whole set. Shipping times drag on right now, and it's been apart waiting on the new lifters for two weeks. I'm putting the coolant in today, and firing it up.
failed lifters? who ever heard of such a thing? :lol:

I was looking at a detroit 6V-53 diesel and found these specs. this little engine, 318 inches, tops out at 674 lb. ft. of torque at 1600, at which point my engine isn't even awake yet. The smallest injectors make 425 lb. ft. at 1600. It's an eye opener. :)

easiest engines to work on too. 2 pairs of vice grips. 1 small and 1 large SAE crescent wrenchs, a leatherman, and a prybar.
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Re: any 4Runners onboard?

Post by marlinman93 »

Grizz wrote: Thu Jun 02, 2022 3:31 pm failed lifters? who ever heard of such a thing? :lol:

I was looking at a detroit 6V-53 diesel and found these specs. this little engine, 318 inches, tops out at 674 lb. ft. of torque at 1600, at which point my engine isn't even awake yet. The smallest injectors make 425 lb. ft. at 1600. It's an eye opener. :)

easiest engines to work on too. 2 pairs of vice grips. 1 small and 1 large SAE crescent wrenchs, a leatherman, and a prybar.
Yes, I've never had a lifter failure ever, and I've always owned flat tappet engines, which have some history in recent years for lifter failures. But I've also been reading up lately that Chevrolet has had issues with roller lifters on their latest LS engines having lifter failures, and they use the same roller lifters the 1990's Chev 350's use. So not sure if I had a similar problem?
I know zip about diesels of any type, other than they're mostly low rpm high torque engines. Beyond that I know nothing about them.
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