Oregon Trail 45-70 405gr FP - Questions

[salvo]

Recently had a Sportsman's Warehouse open here and they carry the Oregon Trail Laser Cast bullets. I normally stick to jacketed bullets, never had much luck with casts before, any ways I bought a box of the 45-70 405 gr FP's and have a few questions.
Will they feed in my Browning 1886 SRC with a very short throat?
Is a roll crimp better or use a Lee Factory crimp?
How fast have you found you can load these without leading?

I want to try a medium load that was talked about recently using 42 gr of IMR3031
I would also like to try a bit hotter loads maybe with H4198. Have any recommendations? I have searched the site and the Internet and can not find much, I know you guys speak highly of these bullets and hopefully point me in the right direction.
Sorry about all the questions!

[Leverdude]

I like them but only ever pushed them slow.
They work good for me seated over 25 grains of 2400. I'v crimped both ways & not noticed much difference as long as its a firm crimp.
If you send them an e-mail with the calibre your interested in they will mail you data.

[salvo]

Thanks Leverdude I'll send them an e-mail. Looking at the crimp groove on these it looks like it was made for a roll crimp, I really have gotten spoiled with the LFC lately and bought one for all my rifle calibers I reload for, so I'll go ahead an use the LFC die.

[Wind]

Oregon Trail has a reloading manual of their own, covering their bullets for rifle/pistol loads used in several competitive shooting sports. I'm sure they'd be happy to send you one if you were to ask. There should be an 800 number on the box. I have been using their 350 grain bullet over 38.5 grains of 3031 for good accuracy and comfortable shooting in my Browning SRC. I don't push them very fast and leading has never been an issue. Watch yer top-knot... -W-

[jdad]

I've always used a roll crimp with their bullets and have only had a problem when I used a "tight" crimp.

Here is their load data. It's all low velocity, but it gives you something to start with.
http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm

You'll find that it's cheaper to order your bullets direct from www.laser-cast.com than buying them from SW.

[salvo]

Thanks guy's with the price of jacketed bullets these days, I hope I'm happy with the Laser Casts, if I am I will order from them. I followed that reloading sight from there website, looks like good loads for CAS, I was hoping for a bit stouter load, maybe I'm asking to much from these bullets.

[salvo]

Oregon Trail, has e-mailed me back and faxed the load data back to me. Very light loads are what they show, for instance, IMR3031 ranges 34g to 38.5g for the 405g FP in a modern levergun. Guess I'll start there and work up.

[O.S.O.K.]

I can't say about the feeding - I'd make a dummy round and give it a try...

And its been my experience with the Oregon Trail bullets that you can easily push them to 2000 fps with no leading. Best accuracy usually comes around 1800-1900 fps for the rifles. But with a 45-70 and that 400 grain bullet, well you're talkin some healthy recoil!

My own loads with that bullet use XPM-5744 - 28 Grains for about 1360 fps. That's from my Marlin 95 with 24" barrel.

For hunting loads, I've decided on factory duplication handloads using Rem 300 grain hollow points at around 1800 fps. Shoot flatter and are plenty for anything I'm hunting (wt deer and hogs).

[salvo]

I did just that with a dummy round, with a coal 2.530 it just touches the rifling in the 1886 and plenty of room in the 1895G.

[gary rice]

I did just that with a dummy round, with a coal 2.530 it just touches the rifling in the 1886 and plenty of room in the 1895G.

Hi Salvo, i use to order from oregon trail frequently and they are fine bullets for the 45-70. They just got a little expensive. i have driven them up to 1800 fps in my cowboy with no leading problem. i too asked them to fax me load data and they were all the light stuff like you recieved. i mostly just use the tables along side any other cast 405 grain bullet. i think you'll like them. I think they are more accurate than cast performance in my gun.

[salvo]

Thanks Gary, I hope they work out! I was Googling yesterday and found a web site that probably many here visit and searched up a mother-load of information, here is just one thread out of many. Looks like if I want a bit more power IMR3031 is a good powder as any for the job.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthr ... rain+Loads

[44LVR]

I'd sure be interested in you trying out the 42gr load and reporting back. I use and have used for YEARS, 42grs with the 405 gr RCBS which is a GS bullet and get 1512fps out of a 26" barrel. That has been a one-shot kill load on elk for at least a 1/2 dozen or so I can think of right off the top of my head. It also shoots 3 shot groups at 75 yards with open sights that you can literally cover with a nickel!

44

[salvo]

44LVR, I will let you know, I loaded 50 cartridges with 42 gr. Then 10 each with 43, 44, 45, 46 & 47 gr. I wish I had a chrono, but finding the most accurate load is all that really matters to me.

[jdad]

My accurate silhouette load was 47gr of 3031 under a Laser Cast 300gr bullet. I tried several other powders, but found that 3031, with that bullet, was the most accurate out of my 1895 Cowboy.

[Whit Spurzon]

My favorite powder for that bullet is SR4759. 5744 left too many "powder zombies" but did give me good accuracy. I've had the best results keeping the velocity under 1500 fps. I've even used a reduced load with Red Dot that got just over 1,000 fps. It was very accurate out to 100 yards which was as far as I tested it. The standard deviation was 6 which was the best I've even managed with any load.

A friend of mine took a cow Elk with one of these a few years back pushing it with black powder. Zipped right through and she took one step and folded up dead. I bought an 1895 in 45-70 soon there after.

[Buck Elliott]

My "working" load for the LaserCast 405 gr. .45-70 bullet is 55 gr. H-335, sparked with a CCI LRP (not magnum...) which shoots very accurately and gives approx. 1875 fps in my Win. '86 Extra Light rifle.

The LaserCast WILL feed & chamber in a Win. or Browning '86 with no problem. I reamed (lengthened) the throat in mine a bit to alllow chambering of the Cast Performance 440 gr. GC slug, which I load over 51 gr. of the same H-335.

[Paul Jenkins]

Gentlemen,
I use the O.T. 350 Gr. with a GC seated and sized .459", 38 gr Re7 , WLP. somewhat dirty, but very accurate. 3/4" /100yds1450 fps.
Jump to 44 grs Re7 at 1800 fps and clean, but slightly less accurate No leading at all.

[salvo]

Looks like some great loads, I'm writing them down

Buck Elliott that H-335 load looks real interesting, betcha it wakes up your 86 Extra Light!

[kimwcook]

Salvo wrote: Buck Elliott that H-335 load looks real interesting, betcha it wakes up your 86 Extra Light!

I wouldn't want to shoot too many over a bench that's fer sure and fer certain.

[Buck Elliott]

Salvo wrote: Buck Elliott that H-335 load looks real interesting, betcha it wakes up your 86 Extra Light!

I wouldn't want to shoot too many over a bench that's fer sure and fer certain.

It ain't fer bench-shootin'... It's fer elk; snarly, snaggletoothed grizzley bears and the occasional deer.

It will group into 1 1/2 inches at 100 yards, with iron sights & old eyes, but it ain't fer the weak of heart, and THAT's fer sure & fer certain...

[PaulB]

I'm pretty sure Oregon Trail laser-cast bullets like to be driven fast.

However I just got some 9mm OT bullets and was a little disappointed to get some leading with them. I think they were going too slow...