Townsend Whelen summarized
Forum rules
Welcome to the Leverguns.Com General Discussions Forum. This is a high-class place so act respectable. We discuss most anything here other than politics... politely.
Please post political post in the new Politics forum.
Welcome to the Leverguns.Com General Discussions Forum. This is a high-class place so act respectable. We discuss most anything here other than politics... politely.
Please post political post in the new Politics forum.
-
- Advanced Levergunner
- Posts: 9117
- Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2008 10:05 am
- Location: Sweetwater, TX
- earlmck
- Advanced Levergunner
- Posts: 3447
- Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2010 12:10 am
- Location: pert-neer middle of Oregon
Re: Townsend Whelen summarized
Good find Bill. He's a historical giant of our shooting game.
I often think of his comment that "only accurate rifles are interesting" when I am struggling with one of my babies that is balking at giving an acceptable level of accuracy. Inaccurate rifles seem to have held my "interest" more than I can comfortably admit to.
I often think of his comment that "only accurate rifles are interesting" when I am struggling with one of my babies that is balking at giving an acceptable level of accuracy. Inaccurate rifles seem to have held my "interest" more than I can comfortably admit to.
The greatest patriot...
is he who heals the most gullies. Patrick Henry
is he who heals the most gullies. Patrick Henry
-
- Advanced Levergunner
- Posts: 9117
- Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2008 10:05 am
- Location: Sweetwater, TX
Re: Townsend Whelen summarized
Agree, Earl. I have never read any of his books, but read many of his articles in back issues of American Rifleman. A man worth listening to. A great deal of wisdom and field experience is distilled in his terse comment, "A .30-06 is never a mistake."
There's an Alaskan guide feller named Phil Shoemaker who says the same thing, and those men are a pair to draw to!
There's an Alaskan guide feller named Phil Shoemaker who says the same thing, and those men are a pair to draw to!
Re: Townsend Whelen summarized
I am thinking he is quite fond of a 9mm handgun as well after Killing an attacking bear with one not too long ago !Bill in Oregon wrote: ↑Sun Jul 09, 2023 11:58 am Agree, Earl. I have never read any of his books, but read many of his articles in back issues of American Rifleman. A man worth listening to. A great deal of wisdom and field experience is distilled in his terse comment, "A .30-06 is never a mistake."
There's an Alaskan guide feller named Phil Shoemaker who says the same thing, and those men are a pair to draw to!
- Bryan Austin
- Levergunner 2.0
- Posts: 323
- Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2011 6:05 pm
- Contact:
Re: Townsend Whelen summarized
1920
The Outdoorsman's Handbook
The Accuracy of Hunting Rifles
…again from our favorite Mr. Townsand Whelen.
Townsand Whelen mentioned the use of a scope for some...but I have no idea which ones.
"In a number of cases a telescope sight was used to make certain of the aim and in the others an English orthoptic was used with open sights."
If I recall correctly, he used 5 or 10 shot groups, not 3
CLASS A
2 INCHES AT 100 YARDS
4 INCHES AT 200 YARDS
280 Ross
30 cal Model 1906
30-40 Krag and Winchester
30 cal Model 1903
256 Mannlicher Schoenauer
25-35 WCF (in single shot)
CLASS B
2 1/2 INCHES AT 100 YARDS
6 INCHES AT 200 YARDS
7 mm Mauser
8 mm Mauser
32 Ideal
303 British
303 Savage
25-35 Rem Auto (*)
25-35 Marlin
25-30 WCF Low pressure smokeless
25-20 Single Shot
25-21 Stevens
25-25 Stevens
28-30 Stevens
22 Long Rifle (in target rifle)
CLASS C
3 INCHES AT 100 YARDS
8 INCHES AT 200 YARDS
30-30 WCF
35 Rem Auto
35 WCF 405 WCF
45-70 Black and Smokeless
32-40 Low pressure smokeless
33 WCF
32 Winchester Self Loading
32-20
25 Rimfire
38-55
22-15 Stevens
CLASS D
3 1/2 INCHES AT 100 YARDS
12 INCHES AT 200 YARDS
32 Win Special
351 Win Self Loading
351 Self Loading
32 Rem Auto (*)
45-70
45 90 HV (1)
25-20 HV and Black powder
32-20 HV (1)
38 WCF (1)
44 WCF (1)
401 Win Self Loading (2)
(1) Over 200 yards grouping is irregular
(2) Over 150 yards grouping is irregular Many black powder rifles listed in
(*) Rem Auto cartridges will show equal accuracy in Remington or Stevens rifles. Classes B and C will rank in Class A when used with hand loaded ammunition loaded by an expert
By 1918, Townsand Whelen noted some nomenclatures.
Small Bore - .35 cal. and smaller
Large Bore - larger than .35 cal.
Low Power - up to 1,750fps
High Power - greater than 1,750fps - special steel barrels needed
High Intensity - Velocity greater than 2,400fps, special steel barrels needed
The Outdoorsman's Handbook
The Accuracy of Hunting Rifles
…again from our favorite Mr. Townsand Whelen.
Townsand Whelen mentioned the use of a scope for some...but I have no idea which ones.
"In a number of cases a telescope sight was used to make certain of the aim and in the others an English orthoptic was used with open sights."
If I recall correctly, he used 5 or 10 shot groups, not 3
CLASS A
2 INCHES AT 100 YARDS
4 INCHES AT 200 YARDS
280 Ross
30 cal Model 1906
30-40 Krag and Winchester
30 cal Model 1903
256 Mannlicher Schoenauer
25-35 WCF (in single shot)
CLASS B
2 1/2 INCHES AT 100 YARDS
6 INCHES AT 200 YARDS
7 mm Mauser
8 mm Mauser
32 Ideal
303 British
303 Savage
25-35 Rem Auto (*)
25-35 Marlin
25-30 WCF Low pressure smokeless
25-20 Single Shot
25-21 Stevens
25-25 Stevens
28-30 Stevens
22 Long Rifle (in target rifle)
CLASS C
3 INCHES AT 100 YARDS
8 INCHES AT 200 YARDS
30-30 WCF
35 Rem Auto
35 WCF 405 WCF
45-70 Black and Smokeless
32-40 Low pressure smokeless
33 WCF
32 Winchester Self Loading
32-20
25 Rimfire
38-55
22-15 Stevens
CLASS D
3 1/2 INCHES AT 100 YARDS
12 INCHES AT 200 YARDS
32 Win Special
351 Win Self Loading
351 Self Loading
32 Rem Auto (*)
45-70
45 90 HV (1)
25-20 HV and Black powder
32-20 HV (1)
38 WCF (1)
44 WCF (1)
401 Win Self Loading (2)
(1) Over 200 yards grouping is irregular
(2) Over 150 yards grouping is irregular Many black powder rifles listed in
(*) Rem Auto cartridges will show equal accuracy in Remington or Stevens rifles. Classes B and C will rank in Class A when used with hand loaded ammunition loaded by an expert
By 1918, Townsand Whelen noted some nomenclatures.
Small Bore - .35 cal. and smaller
Large Bore - larger than .35 cal.
Low Power - up to 1,750fps
High Power - greater than 1,750fps - special steel barrels needed
High Intensity - Velocity greater than 2,400fps, special steel barrels needed
44-40 website - https://sites.google.com/view/44winchester/
44-40 Forum - https://44-40.forumotion.com/?fbclid=Iw ... XqHFnpPtgI
aka Savvy Jack
44-40 Forum - https://44-40.forumotion.com/?fbclid=Iw ... XqHFnpPtgI
aka Savvy Jack
-
- Advanced Levergunner
- Posts: 9117
- Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2008 10:05 am
- Location: Sweetwater, TX
Re: Townsend Whelen summarized
That's a very interesting compilation. Surprised that .32-40 and .38-55 are in Class C.
Also note he mentions the .25, .32 and .35 Remington Model 8 calibers, but not the .30 Remington.
Also note he mentions the .25, .32 and .35 Remington Model 8 calibers, but not the .30 Remington.
- Bryan Austin
- Levergunner 2.0
- Posts: 323
- Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2011 6:05 pm
- Contact:
Re: Townsend Whelen summarized
The 38-55 and 32-40 could be loaded with hot, high pressures loads which required the special steel barrels. I wonder why he listed the "32-40 low pressures smokeless"...and I assume the 38-55 would be the high pressures loads, and not a comparison of all four options. Or note otherwise!Bill in Oregon wrote: ↑Wed Jul 12, 2023 5:12 pm That's a very interesting compilation. Surprised that .32-40 and .38-55 are in Class C.
Also note he mentions the .25, .32 and .35 Remington Model 8 calibers, but not the .30 Remington.
32-40 high pressure
32-40 low pressure
38-55 high pressure
38-55 low pressure
44-40 website - https://sites.google.com/view/44winchester/
44-40 Forum - https://44-40.forumotion.com/?fbclid=Iw ... XqHFnpPtgI
aka Savvy Jack
44-40 Forum - https://44-40.forumotion.com/?fbclid=Iw ... XqHFnpPtgI
aka Savvy Jack
-
- Levergunner 2.0
- Posts: 136
- Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2022 11:40 pm
Re: Townsend Whelen summarized
Mr Whelan passed before I started shooting, but my brother and I , actually started shooting about the time he passed, as I was 10 and my brother was 8. that was in 1960, and our grandpa bought us a 22 single shot Winchester rifle.
Been reading about and reloading from that time on. We read two guys more than any other, C0L WHELAN and JACK O"CONNOR.
When I got stationed in Kodiak, AK in 1975, went to the Library on base, and in town and dug out all the articles and books I could find on these two men.
Been reading about and reloading from that time on. We read two guys more than any other, C0L WHELAN and JACK O"CONNOR.
When I got stationed in Kodiak, AK in 1975, went to the Library on base, and in town and dug out all the articles and books I could find on these two men.
-
- Advanced Levergunner
- Posts: 9117
- Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2008 10:05 am
- Location: Sweetwater, TX
Re: Townsend Whelen summarized
My 10th or 11th birthday, '63 or '64, my grandmother gave me a subscription to Outdoor Life. Once started on O'Connor I never wanted to stop - and didn't until college.