FYI - it takes about 5-10 minutes to make yourself a 300 Blk

[AJMD429]

...if you already have a 223 AR.

I know this isn't "levergunny", and I'm sure if you go over to AR-15.com you can find tons of guys who know all this stuff (and will tell you how much they know and how they used to be Captain America ).

I just figure on this forum, there are more 'normal' types who like leverguns, but have a passing interest in the newer stuff too, and anyone considering the AR 'platform' might want to see just how easy and FAST it is to change over stuff vs. leverguns.

I actually went the OTHER direction (300 Blk to 223 Rem) because I found that the 300 Blk is really best suited to either handgun or SBR setups, and I wanted to make my little shorty back into a 223 from the 300 Blk I'd experimented with.

Takes just a few minutes for such a swap, in either direction:

The two cartridges in question...


Here's the AR before the swap...


First knock out the gas-tube pin (really not needed but I'd hoped the gas-tube would stay to the rear - this handguard is tricky to get a gas tube under...


Then Remove the flash suppressor...


Then slip off the front sight assembly (and in this case the gas tube came with it)...


Now remove the handguard...


Slip the old barrel off...


Slip on the new barrel...


Replace the handguard...


Now replace the front sight assembly (and gas tube)...


And finally, the flash hider (different size in this case)...


Now you're ready to go SHOOTING...!!!

[JOHNNY WACKO]

I was thinking a 10" pistol.

nice post i love pictures,THANKS for taking the time to post them

[Sixgun]

Doc,
You and my son would make perfect buddies. A couple of months ago, him and I got into a terrible 2,000 mile apart heavy discussion (on the phone....but on a quiet night we might have been able to hear each other. ) on the 300 Blackout.

Here he goes and spends a couple of million dollars on some kind of a Noveski AR in 300 BO.........he has the money as an engineer....while I'm a peon........... and I tell him I have a vault full of 300 Blackouts....as long as they are chambered in some kind of a 30 caliber.

ANY 30 caliber rifle with a 1-10 twist will shoot the same dang thing with the proper hand loads. So..........to prove a point, I cruised on down to Targetmaster and bought a very nice WW1 Winchester 1917 Enfield. These will usually bring 8 hundred but I got it for $99 because there were a few extra holes on the receiver. An absolute perfect 100% bore condition.

Howda like my home grown scope mount? Made it myself and stuck an old 2x9 Redfield on it.

So.........I take it home and load up some 30-06's with a 220 grain cast bullet with 6 grains of Unique and "ppppppoooooooooofffhhhh" ......I have a 300 Blackout. The barrel is the standard 26" but I'm gonna wack it down to 16.5", thread it, and put on some kind of a can......pppppoooooooooppppphhhhh.........same thing, but bolt action!----6



Maybe I'm a little too old fashioned....never could see the reason for a blackout.

[AJMD429]

Sixgun, You are right on about "anything in a given caliber with the same twist can shoot the same bullet the same way...". The only limitation is at the high-velocity end - you need enough case (and action and barrel thickness) to push the bigger bullets to the high-end velocities. However the 300 Blk's "niche" is in the low-end velocities.

Seeking a 30-caliber subsonic in the 200 grain range, I'd pick:

• a 32-20 if I were using a breakopen like a Contender or Encore,
  a 30-30 if I were using a levergun,
  a 30-06 if I were using a bolt-action,
  a 308 if I were using a M1A or AR-10 semiauto action (would have to modify gun to cycle...?),
  a 7.62x39 if I were using a Mini-14 semiauto action, or
  a 300 Blk if using an AR-15 semiauto action.

Mostly those are just preferences based on what's "out there" or what I already have.

I think the real 'niche' of the 300 Blk is when you want to shoot reliable subsonics from an AR-15 and have as much punch as possible. Since it can be done from a pistol-length barrel that is where it shines.

In a pistol or SBR, I think the blast from non-subsonic 223's would make me not like it at all...!

When I don't mind the noise and flash and full-length barrel, I'll stick with the 223, because it is flatter-shooting and so very accurate, as well as being 'standard'.

[Sixgun]

Doc,
That was exactly my son's argument. He wants to be able to have that in a semi auto platform....here we go with this "platform bs".

I'm too "old school". thrifty? Cheap?

What the heck...life is short......play while we can! This is America...get what you want!-----6

[sore shoulder]

The reason for a BLK is the ability to have a short barreled, semi auto, low flash, high capacity, easily controlled, easily scoped pistol/carbine with 1000ft lbs of energy in a compact package that is compatible with current military issue weapon and magazines. Theres lots better cartridges. It's the package the cartridge is in.

[vancelw]

That's way to much work, Doc

Takes 15 seconds to swap complete uppers.

Worst things about ARs is all the room they take up in the safe. Crowding out my leverguns

[BenT]

I will stick with my 1907 Winchester in 351. I make the cases by cutting a 223 case off at the shoulder and sizing in a 351 die. Trim a little add a 180 grain bullet and there you go 300 Black Out velocities using a 223 case and it is even semi auto. What more do you need.

[Grizz]

Maybe I'm a little too old fashioned....never could see the reason for a blackout.

well, you built one. so let's try this. put it in your car on the console. park in a safe spot. start the stopwatch. and tell us how long it takes to get 90 rounds on target out the right rear window. then we can talk.

Grizz

[Jay Bird]

Said gun....the little one.


Sorry guys!! I cannot discriminate, I love all rifles.

[Grizz]

Nice pair. But Dude, you have a lot of 'stuff' bolted to that pistol. Still, the 90 round test is no problem.

Grizz

[cas]

300/221 will give you about 400fps more than the .32-20 with similar bullets in a Contender.
When you're trying to get bullets to expand in game at the bottom of their "operational envelope" that's a lot.
The 30-30's burns a lot more powder and a little more velocity. The 300/221 works well in short single shots.


As for swapping AR calibers, you need to spend a little more money and make the swap take 20 seconds.

[firefuzz]

He wants to be able to have that in a semi auto platform....here we go with this "platform bs". ......6

Sixgun, believe it or not, I'm pretty much old school too. Probably my most hated word in firearms and gear is "tactical". Back in '81 I saw an ole workin' boy, who stopped off at the local watering hole to have a cold one on the way home, separate 3 young thugs from their desire to beat the snot out of him and relieve him of his hard earned money....the tool he used was a hook-bladed carpet knife he still had on his belt from work....the method he used was if they stuck it out, cut it off. Worked pretty well. If that happened today we'd see matte black "tactical" carpet knives flood the market next week. Ever head of a "tactical" tire iron? I've seen a few of those used to good effect too.

Not all semi-autos are "platform" guns, but the AR15/AR10 series pretty much are just that...if you want them to be. Doc kinda took the long way around the barn, but his method is certainly the cheapest, to make a switch, but it worked. Heck, you can change uppers on an AR faster than you can change barrels on a Contender. With the push of two pins, and sometimes a change of magazines, you can go from a .22 LR plinker, to a .223/5.56 varmint (two or four legged) gun, to a 6.5 caliber that will stay supersonic out of a 20" barrel for longer ranges than a .308 Winchester, to a .30 super or subsonic cartridge, to a 458 or 50 cal cartridge that's almost par with a .45-70, and still be using one stock (unless you want to change it too) and one high dollar trigger. And that's just on the "small" frame.

As far as the 300 Blackout is concerned, I agree with Doc that a pistol length barrel is where it shines, that's why I sold my 16" carbine and just put together a 9.5" 300 Blackout pistol...until the SBR paperwork makes it thru.

I'm thinking that as a short, less than 16", barrel chambered in .223/5/56....unless you're going to suppress it you can keep it. The muzzle blast/crack is MUCH worse than an .30 Carbine out of a Contender or Super Black Hawk.

About your reduced '06 loads I'm thinking in a different direction....how about a cartridge adaptor from '06, 30-30, or 308 to shoot a 300 Blackout?

Rob

[sore shoulder]

I will stick with my 1907 Winchester in 351. I make the cases by cutting a 223 case off at the shoulder and sizing in a 351 die. Trim a little add a 180 grain bullet and there you go 300 Black Out velocities using a 223 case and it is even semi auto. What more do you need.

That is really interesting info on the parent case.

The auto loading Wins are really cool old guns and cartridges that were ahead of their time. I recall being very fascinated with the 1910 in .401 Win self loading. A 250gr .40 bullet doing 1800 fps from an auto loading carbine was amazing to me. It's a shame those cartridges and rifles didn't survive.


I think the main advantage of BLK is the ability to find it at Walmart.

Of course now you have brought up the possibility of using that .351 in an AR.

[AJMD429]

300/221 will give you about 400fps more than the .32-20 with similar bullets in a Contender.
When you're trying to get bullets to expand in game at the bottom of their "operational envelope" that's a lot.
The 30-30's burns a lot more powder and a little more velocity. The 300/221 works well in short single shots.

I almost did get a threaded Contender barrel in 32-20 (or theirs is really 30-20 as it is 0.308"), with a long throat, because I thought later if I liked the setup I'd get my Marlin 1894 threaded so I could have a politically-incorrect suppressed-levergun, and my 'silent sniping cartridge' could be one that is 130 or so years old...

As for swapping AR calibers, you need to spend a little more money and make the swap take 20 seconds.

True, but in my case I'd pretty much decided I didn't have much use for the 300 Blk in a 'rifle' anyhow. It seems to lose nothing from the 8" shorter barrel, and having all my rifles be 223 and my only pistol be 300 Blk, will (I hope) keep me from accidentally putting a 300 Blk in a 223 gun - which sounds like it can be dangerous.

[cas]

True, but in my case I'd pretty much decided I didn't have much use for the 300 Blk in a 'rifle' anyhow.

I figured that out in two range trips, then sold the upper.
Yet still built another one a few years later only to sell it again without even shooting it.

I love the little round though and have had 6-7(?) contender barrels in it since the late 90's.