92 TD rifle opinion

[OldWin]

Hey guys. I've had this old 92 half magazine TD in 38wcf for years. There is some carry wear on the reciever and a few light marks on the stock but the barrel finish is almost perfect. The bore is shiny and just like new and the action tight and crisp.
I've got a Cody letter with it that puts in the warehouse April 19, 1905. Shipped the next day. It says it was returned and repaired August 8, 1905 and again September 23, 1913.
There is a small silver stock plackard on the bottom of the stock behind the lever. I've often wondered if its factory and one of the returns. It reads like it was from a father to a son. I figure "a true first saves a second" is referring to a well placed shot as this rifles accuracy is uncanny. I bought it from a good friend but its origins are unknown. I doubt it was local.
What say you guys?

[Les Staley]

I like it..wish old guns could talk, but one that old would take some time to hear out...

[KirkD]

Beautiful rifle. I love the wood and the condition. I can't venture a guess as to whether the inlay is by Winchester or not but it sure adds to the rifle in my opinion.

[BrentD]

That is extremely cool for an old rifle. I would try very hard to track down the likely owner and gift recipient. It would go hunting were it mine. But it would remain otherwise unaltered. I bet the owner was a well to do person. I bet you can find him or at least narrow down the possibilities. It would be a lot of work though.

[cshold]

Wow that's neat

[OldWin]

Thanks guys. Maybe you've lit a fire under me to dig into it a bit this winter. I have one local guy I can ask to start a trail. I suspect it has traveled some. Most local Winchesters are pretty standard and pretty beat. I've always wondered about it though.

[BrentD]

If you track back through the ownership, everyone that had it pass through their hands will remember that medallion for sure. So, that helps a lot.

If you know where it was shipped too, even a big city, and when then searching for men with those initials with sons with the correct initials might narrow the list much faster.

Are there any other records other than the date that it left the warehouse?

[OldWin]

No, sadly the letter only gave the date it left the warehouse not the destination. That would have been a big help.

[earlmck]

That is extremely nice! And verrry interesting!

[ollogger]

Thats a fine old Winchester

thanks a lot


ollogger

[rangerider7]

I like Winchesters like that. It has just enough wear to have some good stories. How you would research it, and I do a research often, I wouldn't know where to start. Maybe google the information. RR7

[Sixgun]

Interesting. Most special order guns were usually bought by people who were a little above average in the financial dept. That's why we tend to see these guns in better condition than the standard variety as well, the more money you have, the less you depend on wildlife to survive.

It's rare to find a deluxe gun in beat up condition. How many Model 21 Winchesters do you see all banged up?

I've seen many guns with inscriptions and 99 times out of a hundred, the smaller inscriptions were done at the local jeweler. Factory engraved guns with inscriptions were almost always done at the time of engraving, at the factory.

I would not waste my time trying to find out who the initials belonged to. They were most likely regular people leading regular lives and are long dead. This is a big country and as guns were and are excellent trading material, it could have passed through 10 hands in 10 states.

Nice gun, enjoy it for what it is.-----6

[AJMD429]

Beautiful rifle. I love the wood and the condition. I can't venture a guess as to whether the inlay is by Winchester or not but it sure adds to the rifle in my opinion.

It's funny though, how if one of us today would put such an inlay on a vintage classic, we'd be accused by many of a crime against nature...

[Sixgun]

It's funny though, how if one of us today would put such an inlay on a vintage classic, we'd be accused by many of a crime against nature...

I hear ya Doc! But in all reality, if someone wants to put an inlay on an old gun, well, it is their gun.
I personally see no reason to anyone to get upset on doing alternations to a gun that has had a fair amount of production in the numbers dept and if that gun is in shooter grade condition, say, up to 85% condition.

I was and am still hoping you make that Remington 25 into a real backpacking piece. ---6

[OldWin]

Actually, we see a lot of local "alterations" around here. Unfortunately, they run more along the lines of notches, initials, or animals carved in stocks........classy. And the usual cut barrels and the local favorite, cut magazines. Most have a "sittin' round the wood stove with a bottle of whisky quality.
That said, I've never seen a picture or description of this sort of application in the Madis book or anywhere else. The quality of work was extremely well done and gives the impression that it was done not long after the date on it. The only thing that makes me wonder is the two factory returns. Of course, being a takedown, it could have been a broken extractor or other issue. The takedown feature is in perfect condition and super tight. It appears to never have been "taken up".
In the end I don't give one whit if it's factory or not. I think it's cool and as Kirk said, it adds to the rifle.(Thanks Kirk, that means a lot coming from you.). Most importantly, out of all the .38's I have and have had, it's the most accurate one I have ever fired.
Thanks again guys for all the comments and interest.

[twobit]

Hello Old Win,

I am conducting a research survey of the Model 1892 rifles and would like to add every one of them I can into my work. You can read more about it at these forum links. If you are interested could you please send me some photos of the rifle and all of the stamped writing on the gun and the full serial number. Or you can use the Gunbroker link and characterize your rifle by looking at the reference material there. All info is held confidential and I will be glad to answer any questions you might have. Some day I will eventually make a statistical analysis of it available to the public. My email is 2bitrifles@gmail.com There are lots of photos in the links.

If you need a reference ask Kirk D about me.

Sincerely
Michael

http://www.levergunscommunity.com/vi...survey#p343093
http://www.winchestercollector.org/f...pic.php?t=3460
http://forums.gunbroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=606355

[Dusty Texian]

Doing a little backtracking,and found this,and had to say THAT IS ONE FINE LITTLE 92. ,,,,DT

[OldWin]

Thanks DT,

Wow you're reaching back into the archives. Funny, I was just talking about this rifle with my son the other day. We are going to drag it out the next time he is home.

[1894c]

Beautiful rifle. I love the wood and the condition. I can't venture a guess as to whether the inlay is by Winchester or not but it sure adds to the rifle in my opinion.

It's funny though, how if one of us today would put such an inlay on a vintage classic, we'd be accused by many of a crime against HUMANITY...

really nice levergun... :)

[Streetstar]

I missed this one the first time around -- glad the thread re-surfaced! I am enamored with takedowns now - and curiously enough, my new little 10/22TD is what got me interested - talk about apples to oranges

-- Yours is a beaut ! I hope to give one a home sometime in the future as well

[Griff]

I missed this one the first time around -- glad the thread re-surfaced!

+1.

Dandy lil' rifle, and I agree w/Kirk! Without knowin' the original or subsequent return destinations, it'd truly searching for a needle in a haystack. Knowing would whittle that down to a bale! And it'd still be one of those really big bales.

[Sixgun]

Another thing I noticed is that 1892 takedowns are rare. I see lots of 1894's and even 86's with the takedown feature but seldom 1892's. That thought inspired me to look in my Madis book and low and behold, out of 1 million 1892's, only 1,403 were takedowns.

Later Model 53's (based on the same action) are very common with the takedown feature.

This one is in 44-40 and was made in 1897. Since I've had it (about 20 years) I have logged 4166 rounds out of it and is still an 85-90% gun.

Old Win, I guess this means that I will need your 38-40 so that I can have two of these rifles. I'll PM my address. Try to get it to me on Tuesday as Monday is a holiday. Or....if your not busy the rest of the weekend, why not drive it down. I'll pay half of the gas and tolls. -----6

[Old Ironsights]

The only thing I wish my R92 was is TD. It just makes keeping it handy so much easier...

[OldWin]

I missed this one the first time around -- glad the thread re-surfaced!

+1.

Dandy lil' rifle, and I agree w/Kirk! Without knowin' the original or subsequent return destinations, it'd truly searching for a needle in a haystack. Knowing would whittle that down to a bale! And it'd still be one of those really big bales.

Yeah, I dug around a little locally but couldn't really turn anything up. I've had it for quite a while and the guy I got it from didn't know anything.
I know who the guy is that lettered it but I'm not sure how to get in touch with him. I run into him from time to time and the next time I do I'm going to ask him. That, however, will be about all I can do.
Its not a big worry though. Bottom line is its a nice rifle really and its chambered in my favorite of the pistol cartridges.
Its an incredible shooter and I'm sure that has something to do with the inscription.

[OldWin]

Haha hey thanks Six!
You know, as much as I paw through the Madis book, I never noticed the low production figure.


By the way, I used your patented Shop Vac Hornet Removal System yesterday.
I was chuckling all day thinking how proud you'd be.
Thanks bud.

[Sixgun]

Old Winny,
Yep, that shop vac sucks those babies out better than a low rent girl on Saturday night!

By the way, that info came from the smaller "Madis Handbook".----6

[OldWin]

Haha.......low rent.........now that's funny right there.

And in these parts, low rent is pretty bad. Low tooth count you know......

I got a better idea, instead of me sending the 38, why don't you send ME your 44. I have more 92 carbines than rifles so I could use another. Well.......I suppose I could come down and get it........I'm such a pushover.

That is a good one though. Is yours a full mag?

I don't think I have the Madis handbook. I will have to get one of those as I like to read the "stats" on that stuff.

[Sixgun]

Old Mr. Winchester,
NO! You cannot have my 92 takedown. I use it frequently.

You can have this junker. A special order 1892 SRC with half mag and some scratches on the receiver, made in '05......1905.------6

Hey, when yo up boys coming down this way again? We need to get in some trigger time together.

[OldWin]

Man Six, Why must you torture me like that?

That is one sweet 92. Not many engraved carbines around.

But seein as how it was made the same year as my 38 TD, I'd say you picked a good one to give me.

You bet bud! The Princess is sittin here with we now, she said it probably won't be too long. Fall is pretty busy for us though.
Don't worry, I wont go down there without looking you up.

My wife wants to know where you got the 1911 Language Barrier shirt you had in another post. Cool!

[Sixgun]

The shirt came from a good ole boy gunshow. Same show where I got "be honest with me, is it because I'm black?" shirt with a pic of an AR on it. You want some next time I go? I believe they were 15...state size----6

[OldWin]

Thanks Six I appreciate it. Don't go out of your way. If your there and think of it grab me one and I will get the funds to you fast bud.
And I hope you know if there is anything I can do for up here you have only to ask.

[twobit]

Sixgun wrote:

That thought inspired me to look in my Madis book and low and behold, out of 1 million 1892's, only 1,403 were takedowns.

I am afraid that the Madis book is far from correct on the supposed rarity of Model 1892 configurations. I have been conducting a research survey of the Model 1892 rifle for 4 years now. In that effort I have cataloged over 6600 rifles. Out of that total I already have noted 473 take down frame guns. That makes up 33% of the supposed total take down rifles that Madis quotes but I have only captured .6% of the total built!!! There is no way his number is correct.

Michael

[twobit]

OldWin wrote:

I have more 92 carbines than rifles so I could use another.

I would love to add your rifles into my research effort. The more data I can collect then eventually a more realistic understanding of these fine rifles will emerge. I currently own 37 Model 1892 of my own. You can read some about the research in these links:
http://forums.gunbroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=606355
1892 Survey
http://forum.winchestercollector.org/vi ... rch+survey
http://www.levergunscommunity.com/viewt ... ey#p343093

And here is one very special 1892:
Bent Rifle
http://www.winchestercollector.org/foru ... sc&start=0

These 4 rifles are within a 10 digit SN spread (6418 to 6428 range) and I have added a fifth one since the photo was taken.


Thanks,
Michael

[OldWin]

Wow! Well I certainly don't have anything close to 37 92's.
That's really cool having all those so close in number.
I think the 92 is probably my favorite model of Winchester. They're sure the most fun to shoot.