38-55 ammo scarcity

[Familyguy]

Greetings,

First time poster here. I've owned a Winchester Legendary Frontiersman model 94 for 30+ years (my dad bought it for me when I was old enough to hunt way back...way back...). After last hunting season, I noticed my stash of ammo had gotten down to the last box. As fate would have it, all the saved brass I'd accumulated seems to have gone missing. Anyways...

So I set out to find some new ammo. Nobody seems to have any in stock. It's spooky when you consider how many lever action rifles are out there in this caliber. Where are you guys going for ammo? Reloading supplies appear to be scarce as well. I'm sure we've got some avid reloaders here. What's a decent bullet/powder combination out there that's actually available to be purchased? I'm not opposed to rolling my own if that's what I've got to do to supply myself with a reliable source of ammo. I'm assuming if I've got the skills needed to rebuild engines that I ought to be able to figure out how a reloading press works.

This is purely for white tailed deer and occasional black bear hunting at 100-ish yard ranges.

Any pearls of wisdom would be very much appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

Familyguy

[Old Savage]

Welcome - my guess is that you will probably have to reload it.

[Catshooter]

Famliguy,

Evidently you didn't get the memo. Guns, ammo, reloading components they're all in short to non existent supply. Some here and there report that it seems to be coming back but it's very hit and miss and of course prices haven't come back down.

I shoot a 38-55 and love it. I not only reload but I also cast for mine.

I'd say if you have the mechanical knowledge to rebuild engines you certainly can reload. People that have no mechanical skills or are determined to not follow directions have trouble reloading.

I'd also say to dig around and find that missing brass!

Get what you need while can you can. Most haven't thought about it, but there is another election coming up, thus another shortage on the horizon.

Good luck.


Cat

[Griff]

and Welcome to THE Forum!

Yep. Hunt around for that brass! Learn to use "AmmoSeek.com", (link to .38-55 search). What you do find will be pricey, and may not be to your tastes.

Reloading is a fun hobby all of it's own. Some folks reload to shoot, others shoot to reload! But, finding components can be challenging also. On the plus side, reloading provides you much greater flexibility in what loads you have on hand... if you choose to.

As a hunter I have a few, select loads for specific cartridges... however, in support of my cowboy action shooting hobby, I have a much more diverse stock of reloaded ammo on hand. In both calibers and loads within some of those calibers. Some of which can double for certain types of target shooting, while for others I have even more selections to fill those specific requirements.

For instance, for my .30-30s I have 3 basic loads, a 125gr JHP coyote load, a 150gr JSP deer load and an 150gr FPGC load that matches my deer load for target shooting.

[AJMD429]

WELCOME to LevergunsCommunity forum...!!!

I would just get yourself a Lee four-hole turret press, a set of Lee dies (no, I'm not a Lee salesman - their stuff is just good, reasonably priced, and that particular press I the bees-knees for not only starting to reload, but experienced reloaders doing higher volumes, because it allows the processing of your reloading as 'single stage' OR 'progressive' so is useful for running a few test-loads OR several hundred). http://www.MidwayUSA.com/ has the best prices and good availability. Get a basic reloading scale, cheap plastic reloading tray to hold cartridges, and whatever powder measure you like (or just use 'dippers' - a set costs ten bucks or so and they really DO work well and are pretty non-controversial). You'll be reloading in no time.

As far as right NOW, you may have to look on http://AmmoSeek.com/ or even http://www.GunBroker.com/ or http://www.GunsAmerica.com/ for ammunition or even brass. Get it while you can. AmmoSeek shows Cabela's does have Buffalo Bore loads in stock (dunno if you'd want 255 JFN @1950fps in that gun or for your purposes) at the moment, but listings change frequently.

I think you may be able to use 375 Winchester brass in a pinch, though the headstamp would be wrong. However, MidwayUSA shows Starline 38-55 brass as "in stock" at the moment in both 2.082" and 2.125" lengths:

• 38-55 Brass at MidwayUSA - http://www.midwayusa.com/find?sortby=1& ... onid=20209

Lots of powders available for that type large straight-wall case - http://AmmoGuide.com/is a good and affordable 'reloading guide' that compliments a written manual like the Lee or Lyman with up-to-date load data from both consumer and manufacturer in a VERY easy-to-search site with lots of tools for load comparison, "what-if's" about powder and cartridge combinations, etc...

Stock up on components - you can never have too many. Powder and Primers are fairly 'generic' anyway, so 'overstock' can be used on another cartridge. (AmmoGuide has great tools for helping decide the most strategic powder to stock extra of, for whatever cartridges you want to reload for).

[Mohillbilly]

Get some 30-30 brass and make some . The brass will be a little short but useable . find a mold about .380 dia . 150 t0 200 gr . buy a lee starter kit with dies and a hand press . find some primers and AA 5744 . Easy huh

[JerryB]

Welcome to the best gun site on the web, you should enjoy this place. I have a 94 Winchester 30-30 rebored to 38-55 by Jes out in Oregon. It is an easy round to load for. I fire formed some 30-30 brass and loaded up my first batch with 18 grains of 5744 with a 255 grain cast bullet from Montana Bullet. The load runs about 1400 fps,close to the old black powder load, plenty good for deer or bear.

[Hobie]

I could have bought 10 boxes at the gun show. It is out there. Just have to pay the piper. Me? I've got mine and I reload. Hoarding, a LIFE style.

[Sixgun]

Read my post titled "Whats Old......by Sixgun. Factory ammo from the late fifties, early sixties..------------6

[Model 52B]

During the height of the shortage, I could find plenty of .30-30 brass but not .375 Win brass (scarce as hen's teeth even in good times) or .38-55 brass.

You can however take .30-30 brass and blow it out to .375/.38-55 (ish) dimensions using 8.0 grains of Unique under a case full of cream of wheat. I charge the case, then fill it the to just past the start of the neck and then hold it in place with a pea sized piece of toilet paper or a small polyester wad (cut from 1/4" thick quilt batting and pressed in place with a pencil.

If you hold the rifle or carbine vertically when you fire form it, you get nice even necks - otherwise they grow a little longer on the bottom edge due to the uneven flow of of the cream of wheat.

You'll end up with cases that are at or very close to the .375 Win length of 2.02", and .06" short the normal 2.08" length for .38-55. They will have a .30-30 web however and be good to a similar 43,000 psi pressure. The only real impact of the shorter length is very slightly less capacity and a different OAL if you crimp.

Load wise, it really depends. For casual plinking in my .375 Win Big Bore 94 or in a .38-55, I'm partial to 9.6 grains of Unique under a 249 gr Lyman #375248 cast bullet. It gives me about 1,250 fps in a nice easy recoiling, but still capable load.

For a bit more poke in a .375 or .38-55, you can use between 25 and 27.5 grains of RL-7 under the same bullet, which should get you velocities between 1,500 and 1,750 fps in a 20" barrel.

Another favorite of mine for a .38-55 or a long throated .375 is the 335 gr #378674 cast bullet with between 24 and 26.5 grs of RL-7 which will get you between 1,450 and 1,650 fps in a 20" barrel. There's just no substitute for bullet weight when hunting with a .38-55.

[Familyguy]

Thanks to everyone for all the suggestions. It's been a very long while since I needed to buy any ammo (lived for a number of years in the People's Republic of New Jersey so there was a long hunting hiatus) so this is a real wake-up call. The last box of factory Winchester ammo I have still has the $17.50 price tag on it. Probably bought that back in the 80's. The Buffalo Bore ammo looks interesting, but I'm not too excited about spending $3+ per round.

There's a big gun show here (Chantilly, VA) in a few weeks so I'll hunt for all the fixin's to reload and start getting busy.

Best,

[Old Savage]

Where in the PRoNJ?

[Familyguy]

Where in the PRoNJ?

Cliffside Park and Jersey City. Not a whole lot of hunting going on there.

Best,

[BigSky56]

Buffalo Bore has some 64$ for 20 its a hard hitting load 255 JFN, Conley Precision has a 255 barnes check with them too . danny
https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l ... _list&c=50
http://koleconley.com/cpcart/index.php? ... ts_id=1441

[Chuck 100 yd]

For the price of a couple of boxes of high end factory loads you can have a loading setup and enough components to keep you shooting for some time.
Go with a set of Lee dies and a simple single stage press to keep cost down. Brass can be found on line.
Cast bullets shoot great in the .38-55. Slug your barrel first and load bullets a couple thousandths larger if your chamber will permit. I have best results using Star-Line brass and bullets sized .381 in my Marlin. She will shoot tiny little groups that make you wander why the .38-55 is still not the most popular cartridge in the country.

[Streetstar]

I don't like to reload but do it out of necessity for some calibers

I usually try to evaluate how much I am going to use the rifle and whether any factory rounds are suitable for the uses I have intended for it

In the case of my handful of .45 Colt carbines -- there is absolutely nothing on the shelves that fits what the gun is capable of doing (except maybe the Buff Bore stuff and a few others) --- so I handload .45 Colt.

.44 MAg for my 1894 MArlin? -- there are plenty of suitable factory loads - plus it thumps my shoulder hard enough that I don't plink with it - so I don't reload for it

I don't reload for my 45-70 Guide Gun because the Hornady FTX load works well in the gun, is reasonably priced, and does everything I want that rifle to do -- plus, being strictly a hunting rifle , I might only shoot it 5 times a year, and at the most, 10

30-30 I don't reload for either -- factory ammo is relatively cheap and does everything I want a 30-30 to do -- I also regard a 30-30 as a hunting cartridge and don't plink with them much, so a couple of boxes is easily a years supply

On the flip side, I reload for my .300 Weatherby --- factory rounds are wildly expensive , plus my rifle is more accurate with cases that are fire-formed to its action. I also reload 10mm pistol and 357 Magnum as I shoot them so much, I couldn't afford to keep up if I was buying factory stuff


So in a nutshell ---- if I was going to go through more than 2 or 3 boxes a year, id probably reload for 38-55 , but if I was just using it for hunting and used a box a year, i'd go factory myself

[JerryB]

After reading this post I started checking my 38-55 loaded ammo and what I need to order to load some more. I was looking at some old boxes of Winchester Western 255 grain soft point that my grandson bought at a yard sale in northeast Texas where he lives. They are all Winchester Western with the big red X on the box.One box is the small box with the brown cardboard cartridge holder. The box is white and the lot number on the inside flap is 52SG20 50. Any of you have any way of dating this box of ammo???

[Sixgun]

After reading this post I started checking my 38-55 loaded ammo and what I need to order to load some more. I was looking at some old boxes of Winchester Western 255 grain soft point that my grandson bought at a yard sale in northeast Texas where he lives. They are all Winchester Western with the big red X on the box.One box is the small box with the brown cardboard cartridge holder. The box is white and the lot number on the inside flap is 52SG20 50. Any of you have any way of dating this box of ammo???

Jerry,
Post a pic of the box or describe exactly what it looks like. I can give you an approximate.----6

[3leggedturtle]

Another favorite of mine for a .38-55 or a long throated .375 is the 335 gr #378674 cast bullet with between 24 and 26.5 grs of RL-7 which will get you between 1,450 and 1,650 fps in a 20" barrel. There's just no substitute for bullet weight when hunting with a .38-55.

Welcome aboard. Your not the 1st to space off something so obvious. I put away some NIB 38/55 brass 3 years ago just in case I found one I could afford. Found a 375 Marlin instead. Didn't buy dies so am waitng find some.

52B; cant imagine how that boolit would penetrate. Would probably rival a 500gr 45/70

[JerryB]

Thanks Sixgun I was hoping you would see this. The box measures five by three inches, white with red lettering and a big red x on the left end of the front. Can't do photobucket anymore but I can email you a picture. The other four boxes have the red plastic foam lined cartridge box inside, white box with the orange and red bands on the edge of the box. They also have a store gold label with red lettering on them. Lebanon Sports Centre, Inc. Old Route 2 Lebanon, CT. 06248-9744 (203) 886-2477 price tag says $15.00

[Sixgun]

Jerry,
Late seventies to early eighties---- going from memory here but if I'm off, it's not much. -6

[Old Savage]

3leg - you can check but I think you will find that 38-55 brass will work in your 375 Marlin

[Familyguy]

Hmmm...just turned things upside down looking for my old brass (including a number of boxes of Legendary Frontiersman nickel plated) to no avail. Looks like Starline for me.

Are the different brands of dies interchangeable in other manufacturer's presses? For example RCBS dies in Lee press or vice versa.

I'm going to buy a book to read before I buy so I can make heads or tails of all the various components to order. So far, I'm assuming I need:

a press
a scale
dies for my caliber(s) (sizer/expander/seater/crimper???)
bullets (liking the Barnes 255gr if I can find any)
primers
powder
case lube
chamfer/taper tool
case trimmer

Starting to look somewhat expensive. If anyone has manufacturer/model numbers they can recommend, I'd appreciate it. Midway seems to list all the stuff, but a few things are out of stock. I figure I'll buy enough supplies for 500-1000 rounds and then make a couple of boxes a weekend until I've got a comfy supply of ammo.

Best,

[Familyguy]

I sent a polite WTF to Winchester about having significant difficulty finding ammo for a rifle/chambering they still produce. Specifically, I asked about their standard 255gr X3855 ammo. I got this as a reply:

This is a seasonal item that is manufactured every 18-24 months. It should be available in 2014.

In case anyone was curious...

[Model 52B]

Different brands of dies are interchangeable in other manufacturer's presses. They all use the same 3/4" thread, and they are all designed to use the same shell holder dimensions.

The differences in dies come down to:
1) Carbide versus non carbide dies. Most straight wall pistol calibers can be done with carbide dies that require no lubrication, while nearly all rifle calibers will require lubrication.
2) Shell holder included versus separate. Lee includes the shell holder, RCBS and Lyman do not.
3) Two die sets are used for bottle necked rifle calibers (sizing die and seating die), while 3 die sets are used for straight wall rifle and pistol cases (sizing die, belling die, seating die) as you need to bell the case mouth slightly before seating the bullet to avoid crushing the case.
4) most dies use a combined seating and crimping die, although you can buy a separate crimping die to do seating and crimping separately - and get them in both roll crimp and "factory crimp" styles.

Generally speaking on a straight wall case you want to work the mouth as little as possible, belling the bare minimum required and crimping the bare minimum, if you need to crimp at all. The more you work the brass at the mouth of the case, the shorter the case life will be. I'm not a big fan of the factory crimp dies with cast bullets as you can actually end up re-sizing the bullet in the process.

-----

I'd add the following to your list:

A set of digital calipers to your list. You can get an inexpensive set at Harbor Freight for $9.99 - my father the millwright would cringe but they are good enough for the precision needed in reloading.)

A loading block. They come in universal configurations that accommodate many calibers, or you can get specific wooden blocks for specific case head sizes. I actually prefer to use a nicely made wooden block as they are more compact and just feel better.

A hand priming system. The Lee hand Prime is superb, You can get one for under $20 and a set of universal shell holders that will let you prime almost anything for under $10.

A lube pad - depending on the lube you get. I'm old school so I prefer traditional lubes you apply on a pad. A bottle of that will last you for a decade or two, unlike the newer spray lubes. They make special lube pads and they work fine, but so does a standard not yet inked stamp pad from the local office supply store - at about 1/3 the price.

----

You may need a case trimmer initially to get all the cases uniform but once trimmed, straight wall cases don't grow all that much compared to bottle neck cases so it will be an infrequent activity. And don't go over board on chamfering the case mouth on a .38-55. Deburring is all that is needed and excessively thinning it just invites neck splits. You can go inexpensive and simple with a Lee trimmer that is hand or drill operated and has a fixed trim length based on a cartridge specific pilot mounted on the cutter.

Alternatively you can get an adjustable universal trimmer from Lyman, RCBS and other companies. I've used a Lyman universal trimmer for about 30 years now and have never worn it out, although I've changed the cutting head on it. They use very short caliber specific pilots to center the neck on the cutter.

For a .38-55 with a couple major choices in brass length (2.080" and 2.125"), I recommend a universal trimmer if you've got the money in the budget. Brass selection is another choice driven mostly by your rifle and it's chamber and throat dimensions. The Starline brass has a thinner wall at the mouth so it's often a better choice for a large throated .38-55 where you may want to run a larger diameter bullet. Length wise 2.125 works in most .38-55s and is the original length, while the standard length now is 2.080 which will work in any .38-55.

In terms of a press, I've had an RCBS junior for 36 years and it was at least 10 years old when I bought it. It's still going strong. I figure it's got at least another 50 years left in it.

They no longer make the Jr. but the Rock Chucker is still around and the Reloader Special press is roughly comparable to the old Jr. A used press at a gun show is almost always a great buy and a sound investment as they are really hard to abuse or wear out. Lots of rust is about the only way to kill a steel press. If it looks to be in functioning condition, it probably is and you could take home a great single stage press for $40-$50.

There are also some less expensive presses like the RCBS Partner for around $100 and Lee makes a bench mounted press for $29 and a hand press for $36. Lyman used to make a hand press that could be clamped to a table and that was actually pretty handy for working up loads at the range. The $29 Lee press would actually be plenty for what you need to do with the .38-55 and will cut your initial costs. You can always get a bigger press later.

You can spend a lot of money on either a beam scale or an electronic scale. I've had both and there are pros and cons. Beam scales are slow, even if oil or magnetically dampened, and they can become inaccurate for a couple reason, so you still need to calibrate them now and then. They start around $50 and got o a $100. Electronic scales are easy to use, but need to be more frequently calibrated with the included weights and they can be temperature sensitive. They start around $150.

The exception here is the MTM electronic scale. Optics Planet sells them for $22 and they run $30 to $40 on line and in gun shops. they run on 2 AAA batteries so there is some on-going expense, but I've found it to be just as accurate and fast as my RCBS Range master electronic scale. That is another serious money saver for a new reloader.

[JerryB]

Thanks Sixgun, really appreciate the help.

[Chuck 100 yd]

Model 52B , Most use 7/8" x 14 TPI threads, not 3/4". The small sizes were used for the Lyman nutcracker hand tool. I am sure that you know that and it was just a slip.

[Model 52B]

Model 52B , Most use 7/8" x 14 TPI threads, not 3/4". The small sizes were used for the Lyman nutcracker hand tool. I am sure that you know that and it was just a slip.

Sorry, I do a lot of work with scuba tank valves, which are 3/4-14 threads, and it's a natural thing to pop out - apparently even when thinking about reloading press threads.

[3leggedturtle]

3leg - you can check but I think you will find that 38-55 brass will work in your 375 Marlin

OS; Ya I know , but if I had bought 375 brass then I would have found a 38/55. Also found 375 brass last year too.. I almost bought 32/40 brass last year also just because you never know what you find.

[Familyguy]

I could have bought 10 boxes at the gun show. It is out there. Just have to pay the piper. Me? I've got mine and I reload. Hoarding, a LIFE style.

There appears to be a gun show in Richmond this weekend so I'm hoping to make it down there and get in on some of this hoarding action.

Best,

[winchester1886]

Familyguy if you give me an address to post them to I will send you 40 new unfired Winchester cases free of charge, to help you get started reloading.
I had a rifle like yours but had to trade it to buy a 1886, so don't really need all the cases.
Let me know if you want them.
Only hick-up will be if our Post Office says you can't post them they will blow the world up, anything could happen with the B's that run this country. winchester1886.

[vancelw]

Familyguy if you give me an address to post them to I will send you 40 new unfired Winchester cases free of charge, to help you get started reloading.

Let me know if you want them.

You just can't beat fellowship like that...

Best forum in the 'verse.

[Familyguy]

Familyguy if you give me an address to post them to I will send you 40 new unfired Winchester cases free of charge, to help you get started reloading.

Let me know if you want them.

You just can't beat fellowship like that...

Best forum in the 'verse.

Indeed! Got most of my fixin's ordered. For a case trimmer, I'm assuming I just use a .38 cal pilot? Also, what would be a good (easily found on Midway) primer to use with the Starline brass? I'm assuming my choice of powder will be determined by my planned velocity goals and bullet choice. I plan to load only slightly hotter than factory for about 1600fps at the end of my 24" muzzle and am hoping to find a stash of barnes 255gr bullets.

Sorry for all the rookie questions. Hunting season is only a few weeks away and I'm hoping to get some ammo loaded up before hand and get sighted in with the new lever fodder.

Best,

[vancelw]

A .38 pilot would be where you start. I just use whichever one fits best. I think for my .348 I used a 9mm pilot and filed it down a hair.

Only primer I've ever used has been CCI200. Don't know why any others wouldn't work. Some people avoid Federal because I think they're thinner metal?? You probably can't be picky and will have to use whatever you can find in stock.
The barnes .377 bullets are the way to go. They are usually easier to find than other brands because they're more expensive.

[Familyguy]

The barnes .377 bullets are the way to go. They are usually easier to find than other brands because they're more expensive.

Thanks for the recommendations. Any reason to prefer the .377 over the .375? (38/5520 vs 38/5510) I'm able to find the latter for about $20 less for a box of 50. At this stage of the game, I guess beggars can't be choosers.

Best,

[vancelw]

The barnes .377 bullets are the way to go. They are usually easier to find than other brands because they're more expensive.

Thanks for the recommendations. Any reason to prefer the .377 over the .375? (38/5520 vs 38/5510) I'm able to find the latter for about $20 less for a box of 50. At this stage of the game, I guess beggars can't be choosers.

Best,

Can't know for sure without slugging the bore, but most likely your bore is .375 or larger so a .375 might not grip the lands enough. Accuracy would most likely be poor or at least worse.

If I shoot .375 lead bullets from my Chief Crazy Horse, the keyhole into the target. .377 do very well (can't remember my sight groups) but I took a nice Montana mule deer at 154 yards with tang sight. Went through one shoulder and out the other. I had it loaded a little hotter than what you're planning. I was running 1880 fps with the barnes 255 gr

[Familyguy]

Just an update...

I've ordered a press, the dies, and brass. Primers, the Barnes .377 38/5520 bullets, and EVERY powder that's listed with published loads that are interesting to me appear to be unavailable. So I found someone on gunbroker.com that had a few boxes of NOS Winchester ammo (at a price I'm not prepared to admit to) so I would have something for hunting season. I'll hoard powder/primer/bullets as soon as any appears on the marketplace. Really disconcerting....

On a positive note, my wife commented that maybe we ought to have a rifle for "just in case" situations with more easily sourced ammo. I wasn't arguing. So...I picked up an AR-15 along with a case of ammo at a gun show over the weekend. I think next time around I'll also pick up a Marlin 336 chambered in 30-30. I kinda like the carbine with the oversized loop. There wasn't a single round of .38-55 to be had though.

Looking forward to eventually getting started with reloading.

Best,

p.s. I contacted Barnes and they gave me a list of dealers for the bullets. Every single one was out of stock. I made about 20 phone calls.

[BrentD]

.38-55s really ought to be shot with cast bullets. Or at least, they are well dimensioned to do so.

Casting turns out to be a whole lot easier than you might think and, though there is an initial start up cost. You will be dollars ahead in no time - and independent of bullet suppliers forever.

You could shoot cast bullets with smokeless of course, but the .38-55 is also a fine blackpowder round and, in a Marlin in particular, it is very effective. You could have 25# of black powder delivered to your door in 5 days or less. That would free you from powder concerns for at least a little while (25# is roughly 3800 rounds of loaded ammo).

Sure, cast bullets and blackpowder may sound like a big change of direction from what you initially were considering, but you will be shooting, and shooting well at that.

Just a thought you might consider.

[Familyguy]

You could shoot cast bullets with smokeless of course, but the .38-55 is also a fine blackpowder round and, in a Marlin in particular, it is very effective. You could have 25# of black powder delivered to your door in 5 days or less. That would free you from powder concerns for at least a little while (25# is roughly 3800 rounds of loaded ammo).

Sure, cast bullets and blackpowder may sound like a big change of direction from what you initially were considering, but you will be shooting, and shooting well at that.

Just a thought you might consider.

When I get the itch to make lots of noise, smoke, and stink up my clothes, I break out the .58 cal zoave replica. I haven't had the urge in quite a long time. It's probably been a good 10 years since I fired it.

Best,

[BrentD]

BP in cartridge guns is a lot more fun than in front-stuffers. At least it is for me, and I do plenty of both.

[Streetstar]

BP in cartridge guns is a lot more fun than in front-stuffers. At least it is for me, and I do plenty of both.

Are the cleaning requirements the same? I have to clean my BP Encore every 2 shots or the accuracy starts going to heck

[BrentD]

Doesn't have to be. But it's not smokeless either. I generally shoot 5-10 shots before running a single damp patch from breech to muzzle.

[3leggedturtle]

BP in cartridge guns is a lot more fun than in front-stuffers. At least it is for me, and I do plenty of both.

Are the cleaning requirements the same? I have to clean my BP Encore every 2 shots or the accuracy starts going to heck

Its been '03 since shot my last BP out of a T/C Hawken 45. I used Bore Butter by T/C and shot upwards of 50 times in a weekend and never had to wipe bore because of decreasing accuracy. Even went a wees between cleanings and never had rust in the bore. YMMV but it worked exactly as they (TC) claimed. Just don't use petroleum based lubes with BP or you will be cleaning out a lot of crud.

[BrentD]

3 legs -

Your muzzleloader is a bit different than a cartridge rifle if only for the reason that you deal at least partially with the fouling everytime you load - by pushing a patched roundball or bullet from muzzle to bore, you are "cleaning" the rifling of fouling to some extent. As the Americans found out in Wimbledon in the 1870-'90s, when cartridge guys are not allowed to wipe between shots, they will suffer greater accuracy declines due to fouling than the muzzleloading guys.

Also, the petroleum thing is, for the most part, internet legend. Actually Bore Butter has mineral oil in it anyway. But it is far from the best bullet lube for cartridge guns. That said, bullet lube is a bit of a black art thing.

One of the very best Cowboy Lever Action shooters, record holder, etc, Chipe Mate of Arizona, shoots black in his .44-40 Uberti Henry. He has run 40/40 with black. You, literally (literally!) can't do better than that.

[Familyguy]

Hunting season is almost upon us. I put bids on lots of boxes of 38-55 NOS ammo on gunbroker.com and am waiting for all the bits of reloading gear I ordered recently to arrive. It's amazing how hard this stuff is to find through traditional channels and how expensive things have gotten. In order of hassle to find:

1. barnes 255gr .377 bullets
2. CCI large rifle primers
3. ANY smokeless powder

The reloading dies, press, brass, and generic reloading accessories were fairly painless to find.

Getting closer....

[Familyguy]

I've stumbled on this load online:

http://www.reloadersnest.com/detail.asp ... oadID=5349

Barnes 255gr JFP
28gr H4198
CCI #200
velocity: 1788 fps
energy: 1806 ft/lb

That seems a little hot for my tastes and overkill for white tailed deer at the ranges I'm expecting. Does the above combination with say...26gr of H4198 sound like it ought to be safe for a 30 year old model 94? It's above the max load listed in the Hodgdon guide, but that's with a 250gr cast bullet.

Best,

[vancelw]

I've stumbled on this load online:

http://www.reloadersnest.com/detail.asp ... oadID=5349

Barnes 255gr JFP
28gr H4198
CCI #200
velocity: 1788 fps
energy: 1806 ft/lb

That seems a little hot for my tastes and overkill for white tailed deer at the ranges I'm expecting. Does the above combination with say...26gr of H4198 sound like it ought to be safe for a 30 year old model 94? It's above the max load listed in the Hodgdon guide, but that's with a 250gr cast bullet.

Best,

I use that exact load out of my .38-55 Chief Crazy Horse and get 1880 fps out of it. That is published data on Hogdon's site and it is not too much for whitetail. It's certainly adequate, but it's not like it blows the deer to smithereens. The CCH rifle is 30 years old, too.

http://data.hodgdon.com/main_menu.asp

[Familyguy]

I use that exact load out of my .38-55 Chief Crazy Horse and get 1880 fps out of it. That is published data on Hogdon's site and it is not too much for whitetail. It's certainly adequate, but it's not like it blows the deer to smithereens. The CCH rifle is 30 years old, too.

http://data.hodgdon.com/main_menu.asp

That's good to know. On that basis, I just secured what's probably a lifetime supply of H4198 (5 x 1lb). Including shipping costs, I paid a little more than I would have paid at Midway so I'm not complaining. If it works for Crazy Horse, it's bound to work for the Legendary Frontiersman.

Best,

[vancelw]

Pictures of your results are expected.....

[Familyguy]

Pictures of your results are expected.....

Will do my best.

My dad is getting on in years so these days I'm afraid we spend a lot more time visiting than hunting.

Best,