Customers
Forum rules
Welcome to the Leverguns.Com General Discussions Forum. This is a high-class place so act respectable. We discuss most anything here other than politics... politely.
Please post political post in the new Politics forum.
Welcome to the Leverguns.Com General Discussions Forum. This is a high-class place so act respectable. We discuss most anything here other than politics... politely.
Please post political post in the new Politics forum.
Customers
As some of you may or may not know I work out of another fellows gunsmith shop kinda doing my own thing and taking care of his internet sales .
We also have a couple other fellows we farm out some of our work to .
One gentleman thats a member of our gunclub and a long time friend does our stockwork . Anything from a refinish to a complete custom stock and he does top notch work .
He is also a person that will tell you if you're going to ruin a stock . But if you still want it he'll do the work for you .
Recently this gentleman did a Krieghoff K-80 stock for a fellow and before he did it he told the guy what he wanted would ruin the piece of wood .
The "customer" got the wood back already attached to his gun , took it home and after a couple weeks blasted my friend on some of the shotgun type forums .
People like this make one not want to help their customers at all . If my friend had not told him the changes would mess the stock up I can see him blasting my friend , but doing exactly what the customer asked and then getting blamed for it not working are a crock of you know what !
We also have a couple other fellows we farm out some of our work to .
One gentleman thats a member of our gunclub and a long time friend does our stockwork . Anything from a refinish to a complete custom stock and he does top notch work .
He is also a person that will tell you if you're going to ruin a stock . But if you still want it he'll do the work for you .
Recently this gentleman did a Krieghoff K-80 stock for a fellow and before he did it he told the guy what he wanted would ruin the piece of wood .
The "customer" got the wood back already attached to his gun , took it home and after a couple weeks blasted my friend on some of the shotgun type forums .
People like this make one not want to help their customers at all . If my friend had not told him the changes would mess the stock up I can see him blasting my friend , but doing exactly what the customer asked and then getting blamed for it not working are a crock of you know what !
Parkers , Mannlicher Schoenauer’s , 6.5mm's and my family in the Philippines !
-
- Advanced Levergunner
- Posts: 6972
- Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:52 pm
- Location: Ridgefield WA. USA
Re: Customers
BUT my uncle used to live next door to a guy who knew a gunsmith, and he said......
The customer is always right... NOT !!!
The customer is always right... NOT !!!
- AJMD429
- Posting leader...
- Posts: 32291
- Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2007 10:03 am
- Location: Hoosierland
- Contact:
Re: Customers
We get that in health-care all the time. Patient wants things done the 'natural' way, and won't take a "statin" or diabetes meds, then gripes when they still have a heart-attack. Next patient wants lots of statins and diabetes meds, but won't quit eating Cheerios for breakfast or stop smoking, then blames "all those drugs" for their stroke... I like the ones who will take "red yeast rice extract" but won't take a "statin", when the latter is a much more predictable, pure, and potent remedy.
Go figure...
Go figure...
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
Re: Customers
When you tell an idiot how wrong he is and he says do it anyway .
And the idiot says you F'd his whatever up even after you told him how it would turn out etc etc .
The idiot deserves getting his something or other kicked !
I truely wish they would get rid of the filter on this forum as it messes up my natural flow of deragatory comments
And the idiot says you F'd his whatever up even after you told him how it would turn out etc etc .
The idiot deserves getting his something or other kicked !
I truely wish they would get rid of the filter on this forum as it messes up my natural flow of deragatory comments
Parkers , Mannlicher Schoenauer’s , 6.5mm's and my family in the Philippines !
Re: Customers
I resist going to the doctor .AJMD429 wrote:We get that in health-care all the time. Patient wants things done the 'natural' way, and won't take a "statin" or diabetes meds, then gripes when they still have a heart-attack. Next patient wants lots of statins and diabetes meds, but won't quit eating Cheerios for breakfast or stop smoking, then blames "all those drugs" for their stroke... I like the ones who will take "red yeast rice extract" but won't take a "statin", when the latter is a much more predictable, pure, and potent remedy.
Go figure...
I don't go and then tell them what to do . Like a week or so ago I went for the first time in about 5 years . And I did exactly what the nurse practitioner told me NO PROBLEM . And strangely enough it worked !
IMAGINE THAT
Parkers , Mannlicher Schoenauer’s , 6.5mm's and my family in the Philippines !
Re: Customers
Chuck 100 yd wrote:BUT my uncle used to live next door to a guy who knew a gunsmith, and he said......
The customer is always right... NOT !!!
I would not stick up for this fellow if I hadn't know him and his work for a number of years . He does work for the shop and he's done work for me . He always told me how it was going to be and what the best way to go was and I always heeded his comments . He ALWAYS told me the truth .
The guy who blasted him is a skeet shooter that has a bit more money then brains .
He's one of those guys that thinks money can buy targets rather then ability or practice .
I remmember any number of these guys when I used to compete . They were typically professional white colar types who had a high grade Perazzi or Krieghoff with their trophy seceretary on their arm at the far away shoots they flew to in their private plane . And not a GD one of them was above low A or B classification .
Granted everyone shoots or competes for different reasons . But this type person has irked me for 40 years !
Parkers , Mannlicher Schoenauer’s , 6.5mm's and my family in the Philippines !
- Sixgun
- Posting leader...
- Posts: 18776
- Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 7:17 pm
- Location: S.E. Pa. Where The Finest Winchesters & Colts Reside
Re: Customers
Its because of customers like that is the reason we have so many lawyers and is the main reason for signed contracts. Society is breeding a nation full of sociopaths.
If I was your buddy who did the work I would get on the forums and bash the "customer" back going as far to say things like, "whats the big deal, you only shoot 10 X 25 anyway" or "it was probably your bad breath that ruined the finish"-------------Sixgun
If I was your buddy who did the work I would get on the forums and bash the "customer" back going as far to say things like, "whats the big deal, you only shoot 10 X 25 anyway" or "it was probably your bad breath that ruined the finish"-------------Sixgun
Re: Customers
"I remember any number of these guys when I used to compete . They were typically professional white colar types who had a high grade Perazzi or Krieghoff with their trophy secretary on their arm at the far away shoots they flew to in their private plane . And not a GD one of them was above low A or B classification."
My bro and I used to shoot sporting clays with a cat like that. He spent a couple thousand on custom stock fitting then when he still couldn't hit anything we each tried his gun and broke birds with it. The last we heard he was suing the stock guy. Not sure how that works.
My bro and I used to shoot sporting clays with a cat like that. He spent a couple thousand on custom stock fitting then when he still couldn't hit anything we each tried his gun and broke birds with it. The last we heard he was suing the stock guy. Not sure how that works.
___________________________________________________________________
I'm not paranoid because I carry a gun. Why should I be paranoid. I've got a gun.
I'm not paranoid because I carry a gun. Why should I be paranoid. I've got a gun.
- Panzercat
- Levergunner 3.0
- Posts: 965
- Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2010 1:25 pm
- Location: This thread is USELESS without pics!
Re: Customers
Frankly, there are some days you should just refuse business.
This was one of those.
This was one of those.
...Proud owner of the 11.43×23mm automatic using depleted Thorium rounds.
-
- Senior Levergunner
- Posts: 1263
- Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2007 7:57 pm
Re: Customers
Definition of stupidity--- taking a project to a professional and asking advice, then not taking it when they give it to you and having them 'do it your way' and not liking the result!
If I take anything to a professional for evaluation and/or repair I let them do the job as a professional, that is why I took it to a professional!
If I take anything to a professional for evaluation and/or repair I let them do the job as a professional, that is why I took it to a professional!
Re: Customers
Sixgun wrote:If I was your buddy who did the work I would get on the forums and bash the "customer" back going as far to say things like, "whats the big deal, you only shoot 10 X 25 anyway" or "it was probably your bad breath that ruined the finish"-------------Sixgun
This guy does not own or know hwo to use a PC .
The shotgun forums the guy bashed him on had plenty of his satisfied customers and they blazed the idiot a new one almost as soon as he posted his BS . Which was how he heard about it in the first place .
While I agree with what you say I think it looks a good deal more credible when 10 or 12 other guys spoke up on his behalf rather then him personally having a p...ing match with the twit !
Parkers , Mannlicher Schoenauer’s , 6.5mm's and my family in the Philippines !
Re: Customers
No shortage of horse's patoots in this world! Don't let 'em get to you.
Cheers,
Oly
I hope and pray someday the world will learn
That fires we don't put out will bigger burn
Johnny Wright
Oly
I hope and pray someday the world will learn
That fires we don't put out will bigger burn
Johnny Wright
Re: Customers
In today's society, the first thing after a disaster, unhappy event, or a screwed up idea, is to lay blame on someone. After a hurricane, the feds are blamed for not reacting like they "should" or the contractor's didn't build their homes tough enough, after shooting, the gun-nuts are blamed for our violent society, after a screwed up idea (even after a warning) the stockmaker is blamed. The inability to accept responsibility for one's actions is common (just watch the news...).
Mike
Vocatus atque non vocatus, Deus aderit...
I've learned how to stand on my own two knees...
Vocatus atque non vocatus, Deus aderit...
I've learned how to stand on my own two knees...
-
- Advanced Levergunner
- Posts: 5670
- Joined: Mon Apr 09, 2007 7:13 pm
- Location: DeeDee Snavely's Used Guns and Weapons
Re: Customers
Sometimes sales reps are just as bad.
Our national trainer was in last week training some customers. During some down time he told me about the email and phone conversations he was having with a sales rep. Since I deal primarily with our 1/2 drive tools, he thought I'd get a kick out of it.
Seems this sales rep had sold some of our 1/2 drive impacts to a customer and they were breaking the rotor inside (not something easily done but it can be done).
OK, what model?
The XXXX. You know, the one designed and sold for the occasional shade tree mechanic doing his own vehicle maintenance.
Ummm, OK. What's the application?
They're using them in a copper mine.
Seriously? (I just about hit the floor at that point)
Yeah and after I told him how stupid he was to sell that model to them he backtracked and said they were just using them in the maintenance shop.
Doesn't matter. You and I both know THAT tool isn't designed for THAT kind of use!
Yeah, and the sales rep is wanting to know what we can do to fix the problem.
Our national trainer was in last week training some customers. During some down time he told me about the email and phone conversations he was having with a sales rep. Since I deal primarily with our 1/2 drive tools, he thought I'd get a kick out of it.
Seems this sales rep had sold some of our 1/2 drive impacts to a customer and they were breaking the rotor inside (not something easily done but it can be done).
OK, what model?
The XXXX. You know, the one designed and sold for the occasional shade tree mechanic doing his own vehicle maintenance.
Ummm, OK. What's the application?
They're using them in a copper mine.
Seriously? (I just about hit the floor at that point)
Yeah and after I told him how stupid he was to sell that model to them he backtracked and said they were just using them in the maintenance shop.
Doesn't matter. You and I both know THAT tool isn't designed for THAT kind of use!
Yeah, and the sales rep is wanting to know what we can do to fix the problem.
Nothing so needs reforming as other people's habits.
-Mark Twain
Proverbs 3:5; Philippians 4:13
Got to have a Jones for this
Jones for that
This running with the Joneses boy
Just ain't where it's at
-Mark Twain
Proverbs 3:5; Philippians 4:13
Got to have a Jones for this
Jones for that
This running with the Joneses boy
Just ain't where it's at
Re: Customers
At the last actual company I worked , they did machining of master cylinders and valve blocks for anti lock brake systems .
The Tool Engineer then was responsible for ordering the tooling for all the CNC machines which was about 90% of what was in the shop . I used to have to work rather closely with this idiot .
Anyway after I left that company I ran across the Tool Engineer at the local gunclub as he;s a member there (I never liked this guy) . And he cried to me about getting fired from the company .
Later I talked with some folks I new who still worked there , come to find out he was buying substanderd tooling and getting a small kickback from the vendors .
Next time I saw him he was still crying about loosing his job and I casually asked him if the vendor kickback had been worth it . Since that time he's not said a word to me , that rude comment served a double purpose ! I stuck the knife in him and he won't speak to me anymore certainly a win win situaton !
The Tool Engineer then was responsible for ordering the tooling for all the CNC machines which was about 90% of what was in the shop . I used to have to work rather closely with this idiot .
Anyway after I left that company I ran across the Tool Engineer at the local gunclub as he;s a member there (I never liked this guy) . And he cried to me about getting fired from the company .
Later I talked with some folks I new who still worked there , come to find out he was buying substanderd tooling and getting a small kickback from the vendors .
Next time I saw him he was still crying about loosing his job and I casually asked him if the vendor kickback had been worth it . Since that time he's not said a word to me , that rude comment served a double purpose ! I stuck the knife in him and he won't speak to me anymore certainly a win win situaton !
Parkers , Mannlicher Schoenauer’s , 6.5mm's and my family in the Philippines !
Re: Customers
That's always a fun situation - NOT!
Let's do what the customer asks, even though we know it to
be wrong. The ONLY correct approach to that situation in my opinion
is to not take the job. If the customer loves it, he'll show
everybody he knows, and the craftsman will look like a fool to
those people who actually know what they are talking about.
If the customer hates it, he'll tell everyone he knows, and the
craftsman will look like a fool. Either way, the worker's reputation
suffers.
-Stretch
Let's do what the customer asks, even though we know it to
be wrong. The ONLY correct approach to that situation in my opinion
is to not take the job. If the customer loves it, he'll show
everybody he knows, and the craftsman will look like a fool to
those people who actually know what they are talking about.
If the customer hates it, he'll tell everyone he knows, and the
craftsman will look like a fool. Either way, the worker's reputation
suffers.
-Stretch
Re: Customers
I'm with panzercat and stretch, the thing to do is refuse work like this. Customer wants something stupid, they can find someone stupid enough to do it for them - no offense intended to your friend, but it is not always wise to do what the customer wants.
On the little bit of woodwork I still do for money, I have an absolute guarantee - repair, replace, or refund. But the choice is all mine, not the customer's.
On the little bit of woodwork I still do for money, I have an absolute guarantee - repair, replace, or refund. But the choice is all mine, not the customer's.
-
- Advanced Levergunner
- Posts: 4738
- Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2007 5:00 am
- Location: North Coast of America-Ohio
Re: Customers
30 years ago when I was shooting trap and skeet alot,One of the regular Guys at the club was Harry the Welder... He was a bachlor for many,many, years and a great Guy,Good shot and Fun to be with.
He did not tolerate any bull**** from people in general much less customers. If You were fair with Him thats all it took.He would get the problem fixed one way or another.
One Day an Amish Farmer brings a piece of cast iron machinery to Him,I need it real bad....Next day the Farmer comes back. The Farmer askes "whats the Bill". Harry says $50.00. The Farmer say's thats "alot of money". Harry says O.K. just a second....He get's a 12lb hammer from the corner and smashes it to pieces. There You Go,Now... Get it out of Here says Harry. Life should be so Easy. .
He did not tolerate any bull**** from people in general much less customers. If You were fair with Him thats all it took.He would get the problem fixed one way or another.
One Day an Amish Farmer brings a piece of cast iron machinery to Him,I need it real bad....Next day the Farmer comes back. The Farmer askes "whats the Bill". Harry says $50.00. The Farmer say's thats "alot of money". Harry says O.K. just a second....He get's a 12lb hammer from the corner and smashes it to pieces. There You Go,Now... Get it out of Here says Harry. Life should be so Easy. .
- 44-40 Willy
- Levergunner 2.0
- Posts: 232
- Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2008 1:16 am
- Location: West Tennessee
Re: Customers
When I was doing the mechanic thing, a couple of times I had customers want me to put an oversized Holley carb on their cars trying to make a muscle car out of it. I'd tell them it was too much carb for their engine being used on the street and when they insisted, I'd refuse the work.
The other side of the coin is taking something to a self proclaimed professional and then having him go off on a tangent all on his own and botch the job. I had a so called gunsmith cut a dovetail in a 22 barrel once clean down into the bore when all I wanted was a side scope mount because he thought it would be better and didn't bother to consult me about his change in plan before he started cutting. The sad thing is that I really liked that ol' 22 and have never been able to find another barrel for it.
The other side of the coin is taking something to a self proclaimed professional and then having him go off on a tangent all on his own and botch the job. I had a so called gunsmith cut a dovetail in a 22 barrel once clean down into the bore when all I wanted was a side scope mount because he thought it would be better and didn't bother to consult me about his change in plan before he started cutting. The sad thing is that I really liked that ol' 22 and have never been able to find another barrel for it.
44-40 Winchester. Whacking varmits and putting meat on the table since 1873.
- Old Ironsights
- Posting leader...
- Posts: 15084
- Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2007 9:27 am
- Location: Waiting for the Collapse
- Contact:
Re: Customers
Pfff.
About 1/5-1/3 of my "customers" are welfare sucks who buy the frozen food off my truck with MY money.
98% of those I can barely stand to set foot into their rat-pit "homes".
I don't care if people are "poor", heck, I have a couple of "customers" where they are so genuinely in trouble I cut them "extra special coupon" breaks...
But there's an awful lot of Plasma-screen watching, Escalade owning, Food Stamp Sucks I'd just as soon shoot & burn out of their rat-hole trailers as give another pint of Ice Cream....
About 1/5-1/3 of my "customers" are welfare sucks who buy the frozen food off my truck with MY money.
98% of those I can barely stand to set foot into their rat-pit "homes".
I don't care if people are "poor", heck, I have a couple of "customers" where they are so genuinely in trouble I cut them "extra special coupon" breaks...
But there's an awful lot of Plasma-screen watching, Escalade owning, Food Stamp Sucks I'd just as soon shoot & burn out of their rat-hole trailers as give another pint of Ice Cream....
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough.
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
-
- Advanced Levergunner
- Posts: 4145
- Joined: Fri Dec 21, 2007 11:34 am
- Location: north of Palacios about 1400 miles
Re: Customers
OI; what are you really trying to say Yep sad fact is I lived around a lot of people like that; they always had cigs and drinks tho, after you talk to them for awhile, you find out they really aren't as happy as they act and talk.
30/30 Winchester: Not accurate enough fer varmints, barely adequate for small deer; BUT In a 10" to 14" barrelled pistol; is good for moose/elk to 200 yards; ground squirrels to 300 metres
250 Savage... its what the 223 wishes it could be...!
250 Savage... its what the 223 wishes it could be...!
Re: Customers
Look Mr.Devil's Advocate , my friend did as the guy asked after he had told the guy what it was going to look like .44-40 Willy wrote:The other side of the coin is taking something to a self proclaimed professional and then having him go off on a tangent all on his own and botch the job.
Granted maybe he shouldn't have taken the job .
But since I first posted I have found out the idiot that bad mouthed my friend on the web said in his original post that my friend told him what he wanted wouldn't look good etc . And then Mr. Idiot said it was just as my friend told him blah blah blah .
Parkers , Mannlicher Schoenauer’s , 6.5mm's and my family in the Philippines !
- Old Ironsights
- Posting leader...
- Posts: 15084
- Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2007 9:27 am
- Location: Waiting for the Collapse
- Contact:
Re: Customers
Printed recommendations & concerns.
Signed contract.
Post the PDF.
End of issue.
Signed contract.
Post the PDF.
End of issue.
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough.
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
- 44-40 Willy
- Levergunner 2.0
- Posts: 232
- Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2008 1:16 am
- Location: West Tennessee
Re: Customers
Who peed in your Wheaties? I never said your friend did anything other than what the customer requested.6pt-sika wrote:Look Mr.Devil's Advocate , my friend did as the guy asked after he had told the guy what it was going to look like .44-40 Willy wrote:The other side of the coin is taking something to a self proclaimed professional and then having him go off on a tangent all on his own and botch the job.
Granted maybe he shouldn't have taken the job .
But since I first posted I have found out the idiot that bad mouthed my friend on the web said in his original post that my friend told him what he wanted wouldn't look good etc . And then Mr. Idiot said it was just as my friend told him blah blah blah .
44-40 Winchester. Whacking varmits and putting meat on the table since 1873.
Re: Customers
44-40 Willy wrote:Who peed in your Wheaties? I never said your friend did anything other than what the customer requested.6pt-sika wrote:Look Mr.Devil's Advocate , my friend did as the guy asked after he had told the guy what it was going to look like .44-40 Willy wrote:The other side of the coin is taking something to a self proclaimed professional and then having him go off on a tangent all on his own and botch the job.
Granted maybe he shouldn't have taken the job .
But since I first posted I have found out the idiot that bad mouthed my friend on the web said in his original post that my friend told him what he wanted wouldn't look good etc . And then Mr. Idiot said it was just as my friend told him blah blah blah .
You came across to me as saying perhaps my friend is a self proclaimed professional .
So I guesse YOU DID !
Parkers , Mannlicher Schoenauer’s , 6.5mm's and my family in the Philippines !
Re: Customers
I don't think anyone who has posted here would fault your friend's honesty, professionalism, or conduct. His customer was and is a jerk, idiot, and a whole bunch of other stuff I can't post here. We end up offering advice because your buddy sounds like a good guy who doesn't deserve customers like that one. Not a lot of point in commenting on the customer, he's a lost cause and probably makes a pest of himself where ever he turns up.
I didn't think Willy's comment was directed at your friend at all, more like expressing the frustration that an honest customer feels when they come across a bad gunsmith - sorta like Old Ironsights comments, just venting and not really directed anywhere. Let it drift.
I didn't think Willy's comment was directed at your friend at all, more like expressing the frustration that an honest customer feels when they come across a bad gunsmith - sorta like Old Ironsights comments, just venting and not really directed anywhere. Let it drift.