Winchester question?

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:27 pm

Looking through Cowboy Tutt's pictures of the SHOT show I see the Winchester semi auto shotgun. what's with that?

I thought Winchester was gone... out of business?

Rusty <><

TedH · Post by **TedH** » Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:37 pm

I believe they only dropped the Mod. 70, 94, and Mod. 1300 shotgun. They are still making the Super X2 among others.

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Sun Feb 10, 2008 3:23 am

The Olin Corporation owns the Winchester name and logo. They manufacture or have manufactured for them, powder, cases, primers and ammo. They are the iteration of the Winchester Repeating Arms Co. of old and Western Cartridge (if I recall correctly). In 1981 they sold the firearms manufacturing business to U.S. Repeating Arms Co. USRA built all their guns under license from the Olin Corp. Then in the early '90s (around 1994 I believe), USRA sold out to FN (Fabrique National). FN closed the New Haven plant in March of 2006 and discontinued the Mdls 70, 94 and 1300. Other guns were still be produced, as they were made in other plants, both here in the US and around the Globe. IIRC, Mdl 21s are a piece made gun, here in the US, and still are. Last month, FN announced the re-introduction of the Mdl 70 in a form more closely resembling the pre-64 version. It is anticipated that they will also re-introduce a Mdl 94. IIRC, in Aug of 2006 Olin announced that FN/Browning would receive the license to produce guns bearing the name Winchester.

Hope that answers your question. Might be a little off on some things, but someone will sure to be along and correct my errors. You can look up some of the info at USRA Timeline.

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Sun Feb 10, 2008 10:07 pm

Thanks guys that splains it all.

Rusty <><

OD* · Post by OD* » Mon Feb 11, 2008 11:06 am

Winchesters time line;

Volcanic Arms Company
1855
(An investor at that time was Oliver F. Winchester, by 1857 he owned the majority of stock in Volcanic Arms.)

New Haven Arms Company
April 25th, 1857

Henry Repeating Arms
1865

Winchester Repeating Arms Company
1866

Winchester Repeating Arms Co./Division Of Western Cartridge Co. 1931. (Franklin W. Olin founded the Equitable Powder Company in East Alton, Illinois, predecessor of Olin Industries in 1892, and the Western Cartridge Company was formed in 1898. Olin Corp still owns the Winchester name and rights).

Then to Winchester Repeating Arms Co./Division Of Olin Industries Inc.
December 1944.

To Winchester - Western Division - Olin Industries Inc.
January 1952

To Winchester - Western Division - Olin Mathieson Chemical Corp.
September 1954

To Winchester Western - Olin
September 1969

To U.S. Repeating Arms Co.
July 1, 1981

To FN HERSTAL Corporation
December 1990

Driftwood Johnson · Post by **Driftwood Johnson** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 1:36 pm

Howdy

Regarding the 'Henry Repeating Arms' company of the 19th Century: Oliver Winchester and B. F. Henry had a falling out around 1865 or so, mostly over money. There seems to be some evidence that while Winchester was taking a grand tour of Europe during a well earned vacation, Henry went to the Connecticut legislature and petitioned to have the company renamed after himself, with him in charge. Winchester got wind of this plot and cut his vaction short, hurrying home to prevent the hostile takeover. Shortly afterwards, Winchester managed to get the company renamed after himself and firmly held onto control. Henry became persona non grata and Nelson King became the designer who did most of the work developing the Model 1866 Winchester. Most authorities agree the name went from New Haven Arms Company directly to Winchester Repeating Arms Company, without an interim company named after Henry.

Slick13 · Post by **Slick13** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 1:40 pm

TedH wrote:I believe they only dropped the Mod. 70, 94, and Mod. 1300 shotgun. They are still making the Super X2 among others.

They're making the Super X3, the SX2 is discontinued. The Model 70 is on it's way back, and it looks like the 1300 is back as the "Speed Pump" on Winchester's website.

~Michael

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 1:43 pm

Welcome Drifty,
I'm assuming that you're the same person as over on the SASS Wire. Good to have someone with your detailed knowledge of things Winch.

Driftwood Johnson · Post by **Driftwood Johnson** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 2:36 pm

Howdy Griff

Yup, it's me. Thanks for the welcome. Hope ol' Blabby doesn't P.O. too many of the members here.

OD* · Post by OD* » Tue Feb 12, 2008 4:42 pm

Driftwood Johnson wrote:Howdy

Regarding the 'Henry Repeating Arms' company of the 19th Century: Oliver Winchester and B. F. Henry had a falling out around 1865 or so, mostly over money. There seems to be some evidence that while Winchester was taking a grand tour of Europe during a well earned vacation, Henry went to the Connecticut legislature and petitioned to have the company renamed after himself, with him in charge. Winchester got wind of this plot and cut his vaction short, hurrying home to prevent the hostile takeover. Shortly afterwards, Winchester managed to get the company renamed after himself and firmly held onto control. Henry became persona non grata and Nelson King became the designer who did most of the work developing the Model 1866 Winchester. Most authorities agree the name went from New Haven Arms Company directly to Winchester Repeating Arms Company, without an interim company named after Henry.

I think you mean B.T. Henry (Benjamin Tyler Henry) right?

You very well could be correct about Henry Repeating Arms, the Henry rifles & carbines are marked;
HERNY'S PATENT OCT. 16. 1860
MANUFACT'D BY THE NEW HAVEN ARMS. CO. NEW HAVEN. CT.

Driftwood Johnson · Post by **Driftwood Johnson** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 5:13 pm

Yes, you are correct, Benjamin Tyler Henry. B. T. Henry, not B. F. Henry. Sorry for the error, I must have been thinking about Ben Franklin.

Henry was originally the shop superintendant for the Volcanic company. Winchester wisely decided to keep him on. When the patents were issued for the rifles, they were issued in Henry's name, because Winchester wished to honor Henry for his hard work. Of course the patent rights were probably retained by the company. In those days manufacturing roles were a little bit different than today. The Shop Superintendant was more than a Foreman. He was tasked with hiring the workers and paying them. His contract was supposed to pay him enough to do so. Henry and Winchester got in a dispute over money, I believe Winchester wanted to expand and hire more workers, I believe Henry was resistant. I could be wrong on that count. In any case, they did not part amicably.