Win 94 25-35

[pwl44m]

Ah but yet another one.This one is 25-35 long round barrel, short Mag. This is at the same store as the 92 in 25-20 and the other guns I just posted. I went in to see if there were any red tags and the Mgr said He just dropped the price on this 94. I said that isn't the one I want I said I want a red tag on the 92. He said well U can buy the 94 while Ur waiting for the 92. That makes sense huh. The 94 is a little rough but can be cleaned up pretty nice. This too is a consignment gun. There is a screw missing in the forend cap and the other one is cross threaded-easy fix.
So what do U think of the 25-35 ? This rifle is in the 700 k ser # range. Price was reduced to $599

[John in MS]

Sounds like a HORRIBLE deal!!

People who would try to take advantage of you like this must be severely chastised!

If you will please PM me their phone number, I will be on the phone 1 minute after they
open to take them to task for it.

(Don't bother to thank me, I'm just that type of guy...)

But seriously, folks, if it is shootable, that should be a very nice rifle. The 1910 Winchester
I shot in .25-35 with badly pitted bore shot sub-MOA at 100 yards with iron sights and Winchester factory ammo!

I would be all over that!!

John

[BenT]

Make sure the bore is good . Smaller calibers don't shoot well if the bore is dark. Bigger calibers seem to be more forgiving with dark bores than small ones. If the bore is good that sounds likea good price.

[pwl44m]

They put it in a stand and shined a bore lite in it. It is a little dark but can't tell if it just needs cleaned.The rifling stands out good. It sure looks like it has a really fast twist.
I can't understand why They don't clean these Guns up and make them look a little nicer. But then they might want more Money.I might go back in and have another look see. Sometimes I have to really think about these things. I don't have a Son to tell Me to Buy it and I'm not going to ask My Wife.
BTW the bore isn't as nasty looking as My 92s in 25-20

[John in MS]

The twist, IIRC, is 1:8", to stabilize the long 117 gr. RN bullets at relatively slow speed. While
a pitted bore will ruin cast bullet accuracy quickly, the relatively heavy jacket and long bearing
surface of the .25-35 bullet appears to be pretty forgiving of a bad bore. (This is based on my limited experience with one that was severely pitted, but shot like a house afire...) The one thing I WOULD recommend you look out for is cleaning rod wear to the rifling at the muzzle. However, at the price you'd be paying, you could actually counter-bore it or shorten it and not hurt any collector value, and I'm betting you will have a superior shooter.

If I were in the same town as you, I'd have already jumped on it... someone else might be thinking the exact same thing right this minute... you might wanna call and get them to hold it for you first thing tomorrow!!

There, does that help move you toward acquisition? Trust me, you will kick yourself if you don't get it, if the bore is shootable and the rest isn't too rough! That price is outstanding for a .25-35, in particular.

John

[pwl44m]

Boy when U get Old U really need to take a pencil and pad to the Gunstore. This Rifle has a 1/2 Oct 1/2 round barrel,Ser # is in the low 300k range, and the price is $699. I went back in yesterday to see if it would talk to Me. It didn't

[Sixgun]

Make sure the bore is good . Smaller calibers don't shoot well if the bore is dark. Bigger calibers seem to be more forgiving with dark bores than small ones. If the bore is good that sounds likea good price.

Bens right---I've been there and done that---several times. While a 25-35 with a pitted bore will shoot jacketed OK, (about 3-4 inches @100) a nice bore will be under 2"--all day long, plus, it will shoot cast. In my experience the 25-35 is the most accurate cartridge in a lever gun .-----------Sixgun

[pwl44m]

It is not out of My head yet, and that Brass for sale didn't help. I just can't seem to pass up these old Winchesters. I've already got Boolits, Primers and Powder. All I need is Brass and dies to load. HMMMMM

[RIHMFIRE]

VERY DISIREABLE ROUND.....GET IT IF IS NOT TO ROUGH

[southfork]

Make sure the bore is good . Smaller calibers don't shoot well if the bore is dark. Bigger calibers seem to be more forgiving with dark bores than small ones. If the bore is good that sounds likea good price.

A 'dark' bore isn't necessarily pitted. What is it about a dark bore that degrades accuracy? I am looking at possibly buying a Model 94 Winchester 30 WCF rifle made in 1900 that has a dark bore, but the rifling is decent. What makes the bore dark anyway? Even after running the cleaning rod and wire brush through it for a while, the bore remains dark.

[Kansas Ed]

A 'dark' bore isn't necessarily pitted. What is it about a dark bore that degrades accuracy? I am looking at possibly buying a Model 94 Winchester 30 WCF rifle made in 1900 that has a dark bore, but the rifling is decent. What makes the bore dark anyway? Even after running the cleaning rod and wire brush through it for a while, the bore remains dark.

While I never sectioned a "dark bore" to verify, I always assumed that a dark bore was a bore which had surface rust at one time or another and was microscopically pitted. Much like if you get light surface rust on an exterior of a gun...it doesn't have deep pits, but stains and is slightly rough to the touch thereafter. I used to have a 25-35 carbine barrel laying around here..If I run across it again, I'll see if I could section it just to answer the question.

Ed

[southfork]

You are probably right, Kansas Ed. If the pits are small enough, maybe they won't effect the accuracy of jacketed bullets. With lead bullets, any kind of pitting would likely hurt accuracy, though.

[pwl44m]

Thx for the comments and Prompting. There is a little glare in the Barrel so it may clean up.The riflng is really strong. I have some 25 cal jacketed boollits and 500 cast. I could plink for quite som time.

[John in MS]

If the rifling is strong and the crown is good, I would expect it to shoot well with jacketed bullets. The 1910 rifle I mentioned earlier belonged to a friend. I examined the bore for him
with a Hawkeye borescope, and was horrified. He'd been jammed by a Gunbroker seller who
said the bore was "grate." To the naked eye, it was dark, but pretty strong with visible pitting and a good, undamaged crown. After a thorough scrubbing and under magnification with the bore scope, it was easy to see where pitting had eaten across/through some of the lands in a few places, leaving small breaks in them. Still, it looked like it should shoot jacketed bullets well. He opted to keep it because .25-35's don't grow on trees and the condition otherwise was very nice. He also by now totally distrusted the seller to be fair or honest during the return of the rifle.

We took it to the range and I set up a bullseye target at 100 yards. He wanted me to help
him accuracy test it. We put in 3 rounds of factory Winchester 117 gr. RN. I was not expecting to do too well as it had a wide "V" express rear sight and a thin blade front sight. I figured we'd need a peep sight to get the best accuracy possible.

I took a 6 o-clock hold, and fired the first shot. Then, the next 2 were touching each other, 1.36" away from the 1st hole! I was rather stunned. We pasted the holes, and I went back and fired another group. This one was 3 shots in 0.7", right on top of the paster for the other group! After measuring it, we peeled back the paster, and saw it had grouped 5 shots from the fouled barrel into 0.7", and the one cold/clean shot opened the 6 rounds to 1.36". (I was so impressed, I wrote the info down for my own records.)

I have a pre-war Win 70 in .30-06 which has an eroded throat and the bore is finely pitted for its whole length. With decent ammo, it routinely groups about 0.7-0.8" at 100 yards for 3 shots -- day in, and day out. It doesn't get over 1 MOA. But, as has been noted, it's a .30 caliber, and the larger calibers DO seem more tolerant of pitting w/jacketed bullets. (Btw, it also shoots cast, gas-checked bullets under 2" at 100 for TEN shot groups, so never say "never" when it comes to firearms. )

From your description, it sounds like the bore in the rifle you are looking at is probably better
than the one in my friend's rifle. If the other aspects necessary for accuracy are there, I'd say there is every chance it should shoot jacketed bullets well enough to be pleased with.

Hope this helps!

John

[pwl44m]

@ John, it helps enough to know that I should at least go put some money down on it. Ur statement that 25-35s dont grow on trees, I don't really recall seeing one on a rack before.

[AmBraCol]

So, what did you do? I've had a soft spot for the 25-35 for quite a while now. My dad's family's first deer rifle was a Winchester 64 in 25-35. My brother took his first deer with that rifle too. It shoots very accurately indeed. A pet project in the back of my mind is to pick up a Marlin, rebarrel it to 25-35 AI and scope it for varmint use. The 25-35 is said to be the caliber best served by the Ackley Improved treatment, by the way.

[pwl44m]

I committed to it today. Will go in tommorow and pay for it and the 92/32-20.
I am replying here cause I don't know how to post a link to this thread. This will do btt

[AmBraCol]

I committed to it today. Will go in tommorow and pay for it and the 92/32-20.
I am replying here cause I don't know how to post a link to this thread. This will do btt

Don't forget your camera - if you get my drift...