Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
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- AJMD429
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Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
Sometimes you have to realize that the layperson or average observer might not grasp the 'subtleties of expertise' you exhibit when doing kitchen table gunsmithing.
When I appeared to break off the taper tap in the Puma I was installing a Williams sight on a couple weeks ago, what ACTUALLY was happening was that I was simply saving money by not buying engraving tools - I actually planned all along on using the broken tap to engrave the receiver with an old family symbol - sort of a wheat stalk on it's side. I did a VERY good job of that engraving, making SURE it would be visible even after sight installation, and that it was really really deep, too! I also took the opportunity to teach my son some new 'vocabulary' words. So, the true kitchen table gunsmith can multitask!
Yesterday I spied a .45-70-SS Guide gun on the 'used' rack, and although stainless is hard to tell wear and tear on, this one didn't have any other 'family symbols' on it, or any messed up screws, and there appeared to be minimal wear; the price was great, so without hesitation I bought it. (Actually I did have hesitation, because the wife was home, and I didn't have the usual 'old gun case' all scruffed up that comes in handy to take 'that old gun I've had for years' into the house inconspicuously. )
When I went to put a Williams on it, I decided to use the top-mount type, so I didn't need to drill, but I did need to exchange the front bead. No problem, right? I had a couple firesight beads that were taller.
That's when I found out why the gun was so cheap. One light tap on the sight, and the whole ramp fell off, complete with super-glue residue.
However, the screws appeared in good shape, although only protruding below the ramp for maybe 1/48" (one thread). No problem, I used a chain-saw sharpening stone to countersink the ramp holes so the screws protruded more appropriately. Now for the tapping/thread repair (holes were so buggered up I couldn't tell if they had really even been tapped). I picked out the remnants of glue from the holes (more vocabulary words), then prepared to tap to the bottom of the dead-end holes. Now, as an amateur gunsmith, of course I didn't have a bottom tap - or so it would seem to the casual observer.
Here's where you see the carefully hidden genius of it all. Back when I broke that tap on the Puma, and it appeared to be a simple accident - THAT was me, 'making' my bottom tap. A few minutes with the diamond stone chainsaw sharpener, and it was ground flat on the end. (I'll admit, I didn't break it off perfectly flat as planned when 'engraving' the Puma with it, but it DID do a better job of DEEPLY engraving the receiver since it broke off with a nice pointy tip.)
Anyway, bottom tap freshly made, threads repaired, and I figure that 2 hours of work, extra vocabulary word practice, and one scratch on the Puma (I'll tell my grandkids that it was from a bear claw), and it saved me about $200 over what I'd have had to pay for a new Guide Gun.
Besides, I'll bet the ramp was that way from the factory, and the first guy who owned the gun probably shot it and it fell off, so he quickly glued it on and sold the gun.
So, in a way, it worked out that I broke the tap on the Puma!
When I appeared to break off the taper tap in the Puma I was installing a Williams sight on a couple weeks ago, what ACTUALLY was happening was that I was simply saving money by not buying engraving tools - I actually planned all along on using the broken tap to engrave the receiver with an old family symbol - sort of a wheat stalk on it's side. I did a VERY good job of that engraving, making SURE it would be visible even after sight installation, and that it was really really deep, too! I also took the opportunity to teach my son some new 'vocabulary' words. So, the true kitchen table gunsmith can multitask!
Yesterday I spied a .45-70-SS Guide gun on the 'used' rack, and although stainless is hard to tell wear and tear on, this one didn't have any other 'family symbols' on it, or any messed up screws, and there appeared to be minimal wear; the price was great, so without hesitation I bought it. (Actually I did have hesitation, because the wife was home, and I didn't have the usual 'old gun case' all scruffed up that comes in handy to take 'that old gun I've had for years' into the house inconspicuously. )
When I went to put a Williams on it, I decided to use the top-mount type, so I didn't need to drill, but I did need to exchange the front bead. No problem, right? I had a couple firesight beads that were taller.
That's when I found out why the gun was so cheap. One light tap on the sight, and the whole ramp fell off, complete with super-glue residue.
However, the screws appeared in good shape, although only protruding below the ramp for maybe 1/48" (one thread). No problem, I used a chain-saw sharpening stone to countersink the ramp holes so the screws protruded more appropriately. Now for the tapping/thread repair (holes were so buggered up I couldn't tell if they had really even been tapped). I picked out the remnants of glue from the holes (more vocabulary words), then prepared to tap to the bottom of the dead-end holes. Now, as an amateur gunsmith, of course I didn't have a bottom tap - or so it would seem to the casual observer.
Here's where you see the carefully hidden genius of it all. Back when I broke that tap on the Puma, and it appeared to be a simple accident - THAT was me, 'making' my bottom tap. A few minutes with the diamond stone chainsaw sharpener, and it was ground flat on the end. (I'll admit, I didn't break it off perfectly flat as planned when 'engraving' the Puma with it, but it DID do a better job of DEEPLY engraving the receiver since it broke off with a nice pointy tip.)
Anyway, bottom tap freshly made, threads repaired, and I figure that 2 hours of work, extra vocabulary word practice, and one scratch on the Puma (I'll tell my grandkids that it was from a bear claw), and it saved me about $200 over what I'd have had to pay for a new Guide Gun.
Besides, I'll bet the ramp was that way from the factory, and the first guy who owned the gun probably shot it and it fell off, so he quickly glued it on and sold the gun.
So, in a way, it worked out that I broke the tap on the Puma!
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
Although I've never taken up engraving I have found that some so-called errors are blessings in disguise.
Ok, so now where are the pics of the guide gun? (please, we'd prefer not to hear audio of the vocabularly lesson).
Ok, so now where are the pics of the guide gun? (please, we'd prefer not to hear audio of the vocabularly lesson).
Sincerely,
Hobie
"We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best that we find in our travels is an honest friend." Robert Louis Stevenson
Hobie
"We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best that we find in our travels is an honest friend." Robert Louis Stevenson
- AJMD429
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Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
I'll try to post pics this weekend. I'll even post the Puma engraving...
Whenever I use that Puma, I will see that scratch, and it will remind me to be humble.
Whenever I use the Guide Gun, I will see the front sight (hopefully not flying off up in the air), and it will remind me that once in awhile, I can actually fix something.
So, like many of the guns we own during our lives, there's always a story, or a lesson they can tell us.
Whenever I use that Puma, I will see that scratch, and it will remind me to be humble.
Whenever I use the Guide Gun, I will see the front sight (hopefully not flying off up in the air), and it will remind me that once in awhile, I can actually fix something.
So, like many of the guns we own during our lives, there's always a story, or a lesson they can tell us.
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
That is so true. I've learned a LOT of lessons...AJMD429 wrote:So, like many of the guns we own during our lives, there's always a story, or a lesson they can tell us.
Sincerely,
Hobie
"We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best that we find in our travels is an honest friend." Robert Louis Stevenson
Hobie
"We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best that we find in our travels is an honest friend." Robert Louis Stevenson
Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
nicely written but why is it in the classifieds?
Mike Johnson,
"Only those who will risk going too far, can possibly find out how far one can go." T.S. Eliot
"Only those who will risk going too far, can possibly find out how far one can go." T.S. Eliot
Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
Whatcha talkin' about? Yeah, it is moved now...rjohns94 wrote:nicely written but why is it in the classifieds?
Sincerely,
Hobie
"We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best that we find in our travels is an honest friend." Robert Louis Stevenson
Hobie
"We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best that we find in our travels is an honest friend." Robert Louis Stevenson
Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
Sounds like something I would do.
NRA Life Member
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Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
Pop used to tell me the difference between a Master and Apprentice, was the Master knew how to hide the mistakes and even make them look innovative.
Enjoyed the telling of that story of yours..Thanks
Enjoyed the telling of that story of yours..Thanks
"IT IS MY OPINION, AND I AM CORRECT SO DON'T ARGUE, THE 99 SAVAGE IS THE FINEST RIFLE EVER MADE IN AMERICA."
WIL TERRY
WIL TERRY
- 2ndovc
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Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
That was good for a laugh.
I'm still to chicken to mount the tang sight on my 1895 that I've had for six months.
jb
I'm still to chicken to mount the tang sight on my 1895 that I've had for six months.
jb
jasonB " Another Dirty Yankee"
" Tomorrow the sun will rise. Who knows what the tide could bring?"
" Tomorrow the sun will rise. Who knows what the tide could bring?"
- AJMD429
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Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
Even if you mess it up a little bit, the satisfaction and learning from doing it yourself is worthwhile. Of course, sometimes I've had to loosen my definition of "a little bit" to keep from being depressed!
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
- Paladin
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Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
Great story and read, Wish I could say I haven’t made some of the same mistakes.
It is not the critic who counts
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Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
AJMD429, Thanks for the laugh, I too can relate.
Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
[I also took the opportunity to teach my son some new 'vocabulary' words.]
AHA ! ! So.....THAT'S how you had the $$$$$ for the Guide Gun ! Yore $0.25 cuss jar was plum full !
.
AHA ! ! So.....THAT'S how you had the $$$$$ for the Guide Gun ! Yore $0.25 cuss jar was plum full !
.
Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
Put a bit of Red loctitie on the front ramp (not in the screw holes!!) and you shouldn't have to worry about the ramp coming off
The meek shall inherit the earth, but I reserve the mineral rights!
All the knowledge in the world, is of no use to fools! (Eagles-long road out of Eden)
All the knowledge in the world, is of no use to fools! (Eagles-long road out of Eden)
- Modoc ED
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Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
Thanks for the story.
- AJMD429
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Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
OK, I finally got around to the pictures...
The Marlin .45-70 Guide Gun and the Puma 454 Casull...
The rear sight I installed on the Guide Gun - a Williams WGRS - http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... mid=945296
The view through the Williams WGRS (aperture removed for 'ghost ring' mode)
I put the Firesight (came with the Williams WGRS as an option) on the ported Guide Gun
(I don't really mind the ports since I wear hearing protectors anyway - I'm not sure they're all that necessary for recoil though).
The Williams FP 'side-mount' I put on the Puma - http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... mid=712881
(Note you can put the Williams FP 'top-mount' type on Marlins without drilling & tapping - http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... mid=799753)
The view through the Williams FP is great (aperture also out for 'ghost ring' mode). I didn't try to put a Firesight on the Puma due to the type front sight it has.
The view from the left side shows my impromptu engraving...
Anyway, I just thought some might like the pics and they do kind of show the 'ghost ring' view for those folks who may not have actually tried a ghost ring setup.
The Marlin .45-70 Guide Gun and the Puma 454 Casull...
The rear sight I installed on the Guide Gun - a Williams WGRS - http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... mid=945296
The view through the Williams WGRS (aperture removed for 'ghost ring' mode)
I put the Firesight (came with the Williams WGRS as an option) on the ported Guide Gun
(I don't really mind the ports since I wear hearing protectors anyway - I'm not sure they're all that necessary for recoil though).
The Williams FP 'side-mount' I put on the Puma - http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... mid=712881
(Note you can put the Williams FP 'top-mount' type on Marlins without drilling & tapping - http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... mid=799753)
The view through the Williams FP is great (aperture also out for 'ghost ring' mode). I didn't try to put a Firesight on the Puma due to the type front sight it has.
The view from the left side shows my impromptu engraving...
Anyway, I just thought some might like the pics and they do kind of show the 'ghost ring' view for those folks who may not have actually tried a ghost ring setup.
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
I bet if you really wanted to you could buff those bear claw marks off the side.
Always remember, experience is what you get when you don't get what you were after in the first place.
Always remember, experience is what you get when you don't get what you were after in the first place.
If you're gonna be stupid ya gotta be tough-
Isiah 55:8&9
It's easier to fool people than it is to convince them they have been fooled.
Isiah 55:8&9
It's easier to fool people than it is to convince them they have been fooled.
Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
Your front ramp experience is exactly why I bought a Williams sight pusher tool, twenty-five years ago.
I don't even wanna think about the agita it's saved me, over those years !
.
I don't even wanna think about the agita it's saved me, over those years !
.
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Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
Great story and end result!
Oh yeah, they can buff that right out!
I can't tell you the number of time our family has used that line...
As John Candy said in Planes, Trains and Automobiles:Rusty wrote:I bet if you really wanted to you could buff those bear claw marks off the side.
Oh yeah, they can buff that right out!
I can't tell you the number of time our family has used that line...
Nothing so needs reforming as other people's habits.
-Mark Twain
Proverbs 3:5; Philippians 4:13
Got to have a Jones for this
Jones for that
This running with the Joneses boy
Just ain't where it's at
-Mark Twain
Proverbs 3:5; Philippians 4:13
Got to have a Jones for this
Jones for that
This running with the Joneses boy
Just ain't where it's at
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Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
Yes..........
As the beer commercial on TV states.
Real Men Of Genius!
Excellent story.
Regards,
Troy
As the beer commercial on TV states.
Real Men Of Genius!
Excellent story.
Regards,
Troy
I didn't fail the test, I just found 100 ways to do it wrong.
Benjamin Franklin
Benjamin Franklin
- AJMD429
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Re: Guide gun ramp fell off, but luckily I had a broken tap
...'bear claw' marks...hmmm...Rusty wrote:I bet if you really wanted to you could buff those bear claw marks off the side.
Maybe I'll just leave them there, and tell the grandkids about the big bears what used to live in Indiana when I was growin' up...!
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "