Woods walking Kick around gun

[Dusty Texian]

For a walk around in the woods gun its hard to beat this little 1873 Winchester 38wcf . With the button Mag. and Half Round barrel its on the light side and its hard not to like the 38 wcf , good for small game / varmints and wild hogs .

[gamekeeper]

That's a dandy looking old timer.......

[ollogger]

That is a dandy to go kicking around the woods with


ollogger

[2ndovc]

Very nice. I've always like the looks of the short magazines.

jb

[Dusty Texian]

It was needing some TLC when I got it , the outside was ok about like it is now , No finish left , but the bore needed a good lead mining . After many strokes with a scrubbing rod and penetrating oil , I finally got it clean . Its good for about four shots with Cast bullets and Bp. before it starts to foul out . I got Qty. 250 Hornady 180 gr. jacketed HP bullets and tried them with 8 gr. Unique . It will shoot that load all day in a tight group . Fun little gun for knocking around .

[Nath]

Very nice. Boiling water lifts lead quite well. Does in my muzzleloaders any way.

[Scott Tschirhart]

That sounds like a really useful load in a useful gun.

[Pat C]

Good looking rifle , its got class and good caliber too!

[piller]

Looks like a fun gun to shoot.

[Kenworth71]

Very nice!

[CraigC]

For a walk around in the woods gun.....

That's my favorite kind! Also love the .38-40, two thumbs up!

[Dusty Texian]

For a walk around in the woods gun.....

That's my favorite kind! Also love the .38-40, two thumbs up!

38 wcf is a great cartridge , so easy to load for and usually shoots very accurate , one of my favorites also .,,,DT

[OldWin]

The 38-40 is my favorite of the "pistol cartridges". Think I have 7 of them, from a 73 SRC, 92 rifles and carbines, to an 1889 Marlin.
If out woods loafing, I usually will pick an old 92 SRC that has not a lick of finish left. It is mechanically excellent, however, and a great shooter. While I love the 73, and it is a better feeder than the 92, the 92 carbine is probably the best carrying Winchester ever made.
Every one of my 38s shoot great with the old Lyman 401043 over 8-9gr of Unique. I like the 38 for its consistency when compared to 44. I have to do something different for every 44-40 I have.

[Dusty Texian]

The 38-40 is my favorite of the "pistol cartridges". Think I have 7 of them, from a 73 SRC, 92 rifles and carbines, to an 1889 Marlin.
If out woods loafing, I usually will pick an old 92 SRC that has not a lick of finish left. It is mechanically excellent, however, and a great shooter. While I love the 73, and it is a better feeder than the 92, the 92 carbine is probably the best carrying Winchester ever made.
Every one of my 38s shoot great with the old Lyman 401043 over 8-9gr of Unique. I like the 38 for its consistency when compared to 44. I have to do something different for every 44-40 I have.

OldWin that SRC 1892 38wcf has to be a handy kick around gun . The 92 and 94's fit the hand just perfect . My favorite old guns are the ones that have been palmed so much they are literally hand polished and still mechanically sound . Cant argue with you about the 44wcf being each to its own , at least the old ones I have are finicky about bullet size . Never met a 38wcf that didn't like a .401 cast bullet .,,,,DT

[OldWin]

The 38-40 is my favorite of the "pistol cartridges". Think I have 7 of them, from a 73 SRC, 92 rifles and carbines, to an 1889 Marlin.
If out woods loafing, I usually will pick an old 92 SRC that has not a lick of finish left. It is mechanically excellent, however, and a great shooter. While I love the 73, and it is a better feeder than the 92, the 92 carbine is probably the best carrying Winchester ever made.
Every one of my 38s shoot great with the old Lyman 401043 over 8-9gr of Unique. I like the 38 for its consistency when compared to 44. I have to do something different for every 44-40 I have.

OldWin that SRC 1892 38wcf has to be a handy kick around gun . The 92 and 94's fit the hand just perfect . My favorite old guns are the ones that have been palmed so much they are literally hand polished and still mechanically sound . Cant argue with you about the 44wcf being each to its own , at least the old ones I have are finicky about bullet size . Never met a 38wcf that didn't like a .401 cast bullet .,,,,DT

Having been a machinist/ tool grinder for 34 years, I have a theory for this phenomenon.
The 44 numbered roughly 10:1 over the 38 through most of production across all models. I believe the wildly difference in bore diameter of the 44 is just due to tooling wear. Tooling was difficult to produce in those days, and they used their tooling until they couldn't. If you happen to get a barrel soon after a tool change, you got a bore on the bigger side. If you got a barrel just before a tool change, you got a tight one. Of course, with black powder, this was less of a concern due to obturation.
With the 38, they could change tools with fewer pieces on them and it still appeared as if they used less tooling.
Of course, I don't know how or if they tracked such things in those days. Today, these things are closely monitored.

Whatever the reason, the 38WCF is a fantastic cartridge. Probably one of the best in regards to its performance after making the transition to smokeless powder.

P.S.
I too, have never had a 38 that wouldn't shoot a .401 diameter bullet. Probably the most consistent of the old cartridges I have played with.

[2ndovc]

The 38-40 is my favorite of the "pistol cartridges". Think I have 7 of them, from a 73 SRC, 92 rifles and carbines, to an 1889 Marlin.
If out woods loafing, I usually will pick an old 92 SRC that has not a lick of finish left. It is mechanically excellent, however, and a great shooter. While I love the 73, and it is a better feeder than the 92, the 92 carbine is probably the best carrying Winchester ever made.
Every one of my 38s shoot great with the old Lyman 401043 over 8-9gr of Unique. I like the 38 for its consistency when compared to 44. I have to do something different for every 44-40 I have.

OldWin that SRC 1892 38wcf has to be a handy kick around gun . The 92 and 94's fit the hand just perfect . My favorite old guns are the ones that have been palmed so much they are literally hand polished and still mechanically sound . Cant argue with you about the 44wcf being each to its own , at least the old ones I have are finicky about bullet size . Never met a 38wcf that didn't like a .401 cast bullet .,,,,DT

Having been a machinist/ tool grinder for 34 years, I have a theory for this phenomenon.
The 44 numbered roughly 10:1 over the 38 through most of production across all models. I believe the wildly difference in bore diameter of the 44 is just due to tooling wear. Tooling was difficult to produce in those days, and they used their tooling until they couldn't. If you happen to get a barrel soon after a tool change, you got a bore on the bigger side. If you got a barrel just before a tool change, you got a tight one. Of course, with black powder, this was less of a concern due to obturation.
With the 38, they could change tools with fewer pieces on them and it still appeared as if they used less tooling.
Of course, I don't know how or if they tracked such things in those days. Today, these things are closely monitored.

Whatever the reason, the 38WCF is a fantastic cartridge. Probably one of the best in regards to its performance after making the transition to smokeless powder.

P.S.
I too, have never had a 38 that wouldn't shoot a .401 diameter bullet. Probably the most consistent of the old cartridges I have played with.

You're probably right with your worn tooling theory.
During WWII the Soviets, turning out massive numbers of armaments towards the end of the war experienced this issue.
One specific model of their fighter aircraft, I don't remember which one, were crashing after steep dives. One or both wings would come off during a high speed maneuver, and they couldn't figure out why.
They then turned to the designer, Yakovlev I believe, to inspect the plant and planes to find the answer. During the assembly process he witnessed a worker driving the bolts that held the wings to the mounts with a large hammer. After investigating this, he found that the drill bits used to make the holes in the mounts were so worn, the holes were undersized. The stress from the bolts being forced into the mount with the hammers, produced enough damage that the wings would come off the plane!

Moral of the story is; check your bits, boys!

jb

[Old Savage]

Regarding the original title I would have to pick the Rossi 92 .357 Trapper.

[OldWin]

This is the only picture I have of that beater 92 carbine in 38.
Probably cause it's so ugly.
As you can see, it has NO finish and scattered pits. The barrel and magazine look the same. It does, however, have a nice bore and is mechanically perfect.

I almost didn't get this carbine. I went to buy 2 guns from a buddy (also both 38-40's). An 1892 half mag takedown rifle, and an 1873 SRC. He pulled this old carbine out and asked if I wanted it too. At first I declined. Then I looked it over and it just seemed to speak to me. By my estimate of the deal, I got it for free. Twenty years later, I stole all 3!
If it seems strange to see 3 38-40s in a pile like that, it is not in my area. While considered scarce in many places, the 38 (along with 38-55) was wildly popular in Maine. It is the 44 you seldom see here for some strange reason.

[Dusty Texian]

OldWin that is a great looking carbine surely not ugly . The 38wcf 73 in the pic. I posted of my walkaround 73 came from Maine and you can tell it was used plenty . It may just be me but I think the short magazine guns were popular in the North East . Here is a picture I ran across of a Maine hunting camp . Look at the Half Mag on the right . It may be the one I have , maybe not but could be ?

[OldWin]

Absolutely!
I have 2 half mag 94 SRC's in 38-55, a 2/3 mag Eastern carbine 94 in 30wcf, and a 2/3 mag Eastern carbine 92 in 38-40. I have owned several others over the years, also.
Short mags are not scarce here haha.

[Dusty Texian]

I need another gun about as much as I need a kick in the head by a mule , but would like to run across a 1892 SRC Half Mag in 38wcf that would be a handy little thing . I have a 1873 SRC 44wcf circa 1889 ,it is a great little rig , have thumped a few wild hogs with it . ,,DT

[OldWin]

Strangely enough, my 2/3 mag 92 in 38 is the one I use the least haha. Don't know why......
Been using 94s a lot the last few years. Kinda been back on 30-30. Hadn't used them in quite awhile.

[TraderVic]

I've been keeping an eye out for a Glenfield (JM Marlin) Model 30, short magazine, 30-30 for some time......for a woods & farm walking rifle. The stocks are rather bland, but they are really neat little rifles, very light and handy.
We use one for teaching in hunter Ed. The kids and women (and myself) all gravitate to this rifle first, all of the time.

[CraigC]

I think the .38-40 deserves to be far more popular than it is. My .38-40 long gun is a Uberti 1873 Deluxe Sporting Rifle but I'd love to have a nice 1892 in the chambering.



I pair with this 3rd generation Colt but I've got a Cimarron Bisley .357 that's just begging to become a .38-40.



I bought it for the factory Persinger ivory and it was like paying for the grips and getting the gun for free but it desperately needs to be something other than a .357.

[OldWin]

Very nice!
It's strange, as much as I love the 38, and always have room for more, I have never owned a SAA or any other handgun in that chambering.
I probably should have looked for one years ago. A friend had a beautiful 1st gen 5.5" Colt about 25 years ago. I should have snagged it.

[CowboyTutt]

This is not my own rifle but same model. Mine is in 358 Winchester so I can use pistol bullets at lower velocities or max it out to almost Magnum levels with a custom handload. According to Browning it weighs 6 1/2 lbs. Mine has an aluminum Williams receiver sight and is not scoped, so it weighs the same. Super light gun to carry around but can also be very powerful. -Tutt

[CraigC]

Very nice!
It's strange, as much as I love the 38, and always have room for more, I have never owned a SAA or any other handgun in that chambering.
I probably should have looked for one years ago. A friend had a beautiful 1st gen 5.5" Colt about 25 years ago. I should have snagged it.

It's an interesting sixgun cartridge as well. Not as blasty as the .357 but even standard pressure loads get a 180gr to 1200fps. I've used 10gr Unique for everything from 135's to 180's. The Sierra 135gr goes over 1600fps out of the rifle and is a great little varmint bomb.

[Woodsloafer2]

I love the old guns that show plenty of wear but still are mechanically sound. I really have no interest in finding collectable quality guns. I like them even more if they have been customized as long as the change makes them more useful. I have several enjoy them more than some others I have with more condition. I have been selling off my more collectable quality guns and keeping the rough and ready ones. Just enjoy them more....

[CraigC]

I love the old guns that show plenty of wear but still are mechanically sound. I really have no interest in finding collectable quality guns. I like them even more if they have been customized as long as the change makes them more useful. I have several enjoy them more than some others I have with more condition. I have been selling off my more collectable quality guns and keeping the rough and ready ones. Just enjoy them more....

That's why I kinda made out like a bandit on my Colt. It was tuned and restocked by Tom Sargis and included several hundred rounds of brass but was only $1200. At a time when NIB examples were more than that. Not only do I not worry about holster wear but I've even considered getting it engraved and refinished.

[Dusty Texian]

Sure are some nice looking guns on here .

[OldWin]

Very nice!
It's strange, as much as I love the 38, and always have room for more, I have never owned a SAA or any other handgun in that chambering.
I probably should have looked for one years ago. A friend had a beautiful 1st gen 5.5" Colt about 25 years ago. I should have snagged it.

It's an interesting sixgun cartridge as well. Not as blasty as the .357 but even standard pressure loads get a 180gr to 1200fps. I've used 10gr Unique for everything from 135's to 180's. The Sierra 135gr goes over 1600fps out of the rifle and is a great little varmint bomb.

I've no doubt it's a great performer. Someone would have a hard time convincing me otherwise. I'm quite enamored with the old 38WCF.
I agree with you regarding the .357s noise. I banished the cartridge for almost 20 years. Now it seems I have a metric ton of them. I have a nice 5.5" 2nd gen SAA chambered for it. It is a great shooter. However, I wouldn't be sorry if it morphed into a 38wcf or 44 special.

[Dusty Texian]

I love the old guns that show plenty of wear but still are mechanically sound. I really have no interest in finding collectable quality guns. I like them even more if they have been customized as long as the change makes them more useful. I have several enjoy them more than some others I have with more condition. I have been selling off my more collectable quality guns and keeping the rough and ready ones. Just enjoy them more....

I'm with you , have never been a shiny finish collector . Much rather a working gun that shows its use and still functions like it should . And I never have to worry if there was a fingerprint left on my gun Ha ,,,,DT

[Dusty Texian]

Very nice!
It's strange, as much as I love the 38, and always have room for more, I have never owned a SAA or any other handgun in that chambering.
I probably should have looked for one years ago. A friend had a beautiful 1st gen 5.5" Colt about 25 years ago. I should have snagged it.

It's an interesting sixgun cartridge as well. Not as blasty as the .357 but even standard pressure loads get a 180gr to 1200fps. I've used 10gr Unique for everything from 135's to 180's. The Sierra 135gr goes over 1600fps out of the rifle and is a great little varmint bomb.

I've no doubt it's a great performer. Someone would have a hard time convincing me otherwise. I'm quite enamored with the old 38WCF.
I agree with you regarding the .357s noise. I banished the cartridge for almost 20 years. Now it seems I have a metric ton of them. I have a nice 5.5" 2nd gen SAA chambered for it. It is a great shooter. However, I wouldn't be sorry if it morphed into a 38wcf or 44 special.

Never cared for the .357 MAGNUM , had a Dan Wesson target pistol and a Ruger Blackhawk both in .357 . The Dan Wesson was a super accurate shooter with 38spl. traded it for a SAA 45 Colt . The Ruger I gave to a friend that liked it more than I did . 357 Magnum = Too much noise for the amount of delivery . 44 and 45's are the ticket , they get it done without all the big fuss ,,,,,DT

[OldWin]

Very nice!
It's strange, as much as I love the 38, and always have room for more, I have never owned a SAA or any other handgun in that chambering.
I probably should have looked for one years ago. A friend had a beautiful 1st gen 5.5" Colt about 25 years ago. I should have snagged it.

It's an interesting sixgun cartridge as well. Not as blasty as the .357 but even standard pressure loads get a 180gr to 1200fps. I've used 10gr Unique for everything from 135's to 180's. The Sierra 135gr goes over 1600fps out of the rifle and is a great little varmint bomb.

I've no doubt it's a great performer. Someone would have a hard time convincing me otherwise. I'm quite enamored with the old 38WCF.
I agree with you regarding the .357s noise. I banished the cartridge for almost 20 years. Now it seems I have a metric ton of them. I have a nice 5.5" 2nd gen SAA chambered for it. It is a great shooter. However, I wouldn't be sorry if it morphed into a 38wcf or 44 special.

Never cared for the .357 MAGNUM , had a Dan Wesson target pistol and a Ruger Blackhawk both in .357 . The Dan Wesson was a super accurate shooter with 38spl. traded it for a SAA 45 Colt . The Ruger I gave to a friend that liked it more than I did . 357 Magnum = Too much noise for the amount of delivery . 44 and 45's are the ticket , they get it done without all the big fuss ,,,,,DT

Yup. I have everything from the above Colt, to an early 4.625 Ruger Flat top, a 4" P&R model 66 Smith, a 4" Python, and a 4" GP100 I gave my dad.
I also have an old Rossi 20" 92 src. That is quite the opposite. Don't even need hearing protection.

Oh, I like 44s and 45s too.
Have a 3 screw SB, a 6" 629-1, a 3" round butt full lug unfluted 629-2, a 1st gen .45 5.5" SAA, and a late 3rd gen .45 4.75 SAA.

[CraigC]

Agree 100% on the .357 comments. I have some wonderful sixguns that chamber the cartridge but it will never be a favorite. The very best of .357 sixguns get converted to something more interesting, like the two projects I've got going now. There will always be something special about the ole .38WCF.

[piller]

Seems to me that higher chamber pressure equates to a louder noise upon firing. The . 357 has its place, but it is not usually a quiet round.

[Catshooter]

Seems to me that higher chamber pressure equates to a louder noise upon firing. The . 357 has its place, but it is not usually a quiet round.

Yep. The higher the pressure, and the smaller the bore the loudenboomer they get.

The new .30 Super Carry should be excellent at blowing out ear drums. Thirty caliber, FIFTY thousand PSI should do the trick.