My own scoping question...

Welcome to the Leverguns.Com Forum. This is a high-class place so act respectable. We discuss most anything here ... politely.

Moderators: AmBraCol, Hobie

Forum rules
Welcome to the Leverguns.Com General Discussions Forum. This is a high-class place so act respectable. We discuss most anything here other than politics... politely.

Please post political post in the new Politics forum.
Post Reply
User avatar
Old Ironsights
Posting leader...
Posts: 15084
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2007 9:27 am
Location: Waiting for the Collapse
Contact:

My own scoping question...

Post by Old Ironsights »

OK, so I put a Burris Timberline 3x9 on my Savage 99 using weaver mounts. Looks good, mounts firm, should be dandy.

BUT

Since I haven't had time to sight it in yet, I got hold of a Bushnell Magnetic Bore Sighter
(model 740001C) and tried it out.

I had to run the dial all the way to the right before the reticle was on the boresight crosshair. Elevation was good (just a couple of clicks), but to need to run the windage all the way to the right?

Anybody have any info on these boresighters & what might be gong on?
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough.
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
User avatar
Hobie
Moderator
Posts: 13902
Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2007 1:54 pm
Location: Staunton, VA, USA
Contact:

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by Hobie »

It is magnetic, attaches to the muzzle, right? So, it isn't aligned with the bore but with the face of the muzzle. I think that explains it.
Sincerely,

Hobie

"We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best that we find in our travels is an honest friend." Robert Louis Stevenson
Nath
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 8660
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2007 1:41 pm
Location: England

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by Nath »

Hmmmm, I would wait untill I could squirt one down range me.

Nath.
Psalm ch8.

Because I wish I could!
jnyork
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 4412
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 12:33 pm
Location: Wyoming and Arizona

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by jnyork »

What Nath said. My experience with boresighters is not too positive, waste of time and money IMHO.

How's the hand, OI?
User avatar
Malamute
Member Emeritus
Posts: 3766
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:56 am
Location: Rocky Mts

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by Malamute »

Starting at 25 yards often saves a lot of ammo. Bore sighters can work alright, but I still like to start at 25 just to be sure.

Could also be that the base mounting holes or mounts are off center somehow. Was it factory drilled and tapped? Leupold type base/rigs can do a lot to mitigate windage issues, as they have windage in the base/ring interaction.
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs even though checkered by failure, than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much because they live in the gray twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat." -Theodore Roosevelt-

Isnt it amazing how many people post without reading the thread?
User avatar
Old Savage
Posting leader...
Posts: 16688
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2007 3:43 pm
Location: Southern California

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by Old Savage »

I would't trust the bore sighter for a number of reasons.
In the High Desert of Southern Calif. ..."on the cutting edge of going back in time"...

Image
User avatar
Old Ironsights
Posting leader...
Posts: 15084
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2007 9:27 am
Location: Waiting for the Collapse
Contact:

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by Old Ironsights »

Hand's healing fine, thanks. Hardest bit is keeping the palm wound covered. No bandaid made will stick.

I tried the boresight thingy more out of curiosity than anything. I never shoot to mechanical zero on anything anyway... but it's a good starting point - usually.

I'm just supprised HOW far off it is and wonder if it is indicative of a mount issue more than a POI/POA issue...
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough.
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
jnyork
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 4412
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 12:33 pm
Location: Wyoming and Arizona

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by jnyork »

Old Ironsights wrote: I'm just supprised HOW far off it is and wonder if it is indicative of a mount issue more than a POI/POA issue...
Might be, a couple of shots at 25 yards will tell the story. If it IS way off, might try swapping the mounts around and see if the problem follows the mounts.
User avatar
Hobie
Moderator
Posts: 13902
Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2007 1:54 pm
Location: Staunton, VA, USA
Contact:

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by Hobie »

It seems to me that IF the mounts are on the gun plumb and square AND the scope reticule adjustments were at mechanical zero (i.e. centered) then if you have a discrepancy it is because the muzzle isn't crowned perpendicular to the bore center line. Any error in the face of the bore sighter is could be accentuated if it just so happens that angle isn't negated by the contact surface of the bore sighter.

I would give that thing zero confidence for vertical adjustment, there's no way to index the thing with any sort of repetitive accuracy.
Sincerely,

Hobie

"We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best that we find in our travels is an honest friend." Robert Louis Stevenson
Ben_Rumson
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 2569
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2007 12:51 pm

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by Ben_Rumson »

I was sad to discover my 1961 vintage Savage 99E with factory D&T'd holes has the rear hole on the front set of holes drilled off center... I discovered this after having to adjust my 1.5-5x Leup way to one side to get the cross hairs centered. I pulled the scope to have a look see at things and saw it. I'm may change out the weaver mounts and use a windage adjustable Luep mount ....
"IT IS MY OPINION, AND I AM CORRECT SO DON'T ARGUE, THE 99 SAVAGE IS THE FINEST RIFLE EVER MADE IN AMERICA."
WIL TERRY
Pete44ru
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 11242
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 7:26 am

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by Pete44ru »

I like boresighting by eye much better.

If a rifle can't be directly boresighted by eye from the rear via pulling the bolt, I clamp the rifle in my wood cleaning vise and use a small dental mirror to peep through the barrel (with the breech/bolt open) for a boresight.

.
BigSky56
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 2356
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2007 6:49 pm
Location: NW Montana

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by BigSky56 »

OI & Ben if you run out of adjustment with your scope get millet angle-loc adjustable rings they will work on your weaver mounts, Ive seen D&T from the factory be off more than once. danny
Ben_Rumson
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 2569
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2007 12:51 pm

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by Ben_Rumson »

Thanks for the heads up danny.. My scope has some adjustment left so I'm OK in that respect but I'd rather have the dang thing pointed in the direction it's 'sposed to be.. Hopefully using the millets with the weaver bases will keep things as low as possble...
"IT IS MY OPINION, AND I AM CORRECT SO DON'T ARGUE, THE 99 SAVAGE IS THE FINEST RIFLE EVER MADE IN AMERICA."
WIL TERRY
User avatar
jeepnik
Advanced Levergunner
Posts: 6831
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2007 1:39 pm
Location: On the Beach

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by jeepnik »

I usually use an old Laserlyte laser bore sighter. I has a rod that extends into the barrel and locks in to place with a plastice doo hicky that expands as the rod is turned. It gets me on paper at 100 yds without firing a shot.

Interestingly, I had one that wouldn't bore sight for elevation. So, I took it to the range, and sure enough, there wasn't enough elevation adjustment. Shimmed the front and all was fine. Should have trusted the bore sighter on this one.

Could be your scope needs to be shimmed.
Jeepnik AKA "Old Eyes"
"Go low, go slow and preferably in the dark" The old Sarge (he was maybe 24.
"Freedom is never more that a generation from extinction" Ronald Reagan
"Every man should have at least one good rifle and know how to use it" Dad
User avatar
Old Ironsights
Posting leader...
Posts: 15084
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2007 9:27 am
Location: Waiting for the Collapse
Contact:

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by Old Ironsights »

The problem I have with using different mounts is that I have to useExtension Ringsto get a compact long-eye-relief scope like the Timberline to work right.

A bigger scope just doesn't look/feel right on a 99.
C2N14... because life is not energetic enough.
מנא, מנא, תקל, ופרסין Daniel 5:25-28... Got 7.62?
Not Depressed enough yet? Go read National Geographic, July 1976
Gott und Gewehr mit uns!
User avatar
AJMD429
Posting leader...
Posts: 31933
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2007 10:03 am
Location: Hoosierland
Contact:

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by AJMD429 »

The use of a little keychain or other small laser shined down the bore against a wall 15 or so feet away can help you align the scope; you will see a 'halo' of light that moves until you get the laser centered, then the dot will appear in the center of the halo vs. off to the side. The method works halfway well even if you can't get the laser exactly aligned, because it reflects off the barrel and you still get the 'halo' even if not the dot.
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.


Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
Washita
Levergunner 2.0
Posts: 222
Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2010 11:54 am

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by Washita »

All these solutions sound like a lot of trouble to me. My bolt actions are bore sighted thru the bore with the bolt removed; all others get one shot fired up close (about 10 yards) to make sure it's on the paper, then adjusted from there. I tried a bore sight once & didn't like it, especially the part where I had to stick the spud down the muzzle. Just wasn't comfortable with it.
JDL
Levergunner 2.0
Posts: 176
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2007 5:55 pm
Location: La.

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by JDL »

Old Ironsights, I really like Weaver scope mounts and have used them for years on various rifles, including several 99s. All my bases are 20 to 30 years old.
Last year I purchased 2 sets of Weaver mounts for a couple of my 99s, made in 1953 and 1961 respectfully. Both sets had the scope looking way left IIRC. Anyway it was so far off I couldn't zero either scope. I thought perhaps the rings were faulty and swapped rings, even using a different brand with no help. I e-mailed Weaver looking for soultions and they replied that nothing had changed in the process. I was forced to use the Redfield type with adjustable windage which was easier for me than cobbling up some windage adjustable rings to fit Weaver mounts.
JDL
new pig hunter
Senior Levergunner
Posts: 1362
Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2007 5:11 pm
Location: SoCal

Re: My own scoping question...

Post by new pig hunter »

had a mounting problem with my bolt action Howa Model 1500, had to use shims. I discovered the "best" solution: Burris Zee Signature rings, using the posi-align plastic inserts. The inserts are essentially shims and allow for scope movement during boresight.
http://burrisoptics.com/sigrings.html
I was able to near-perfectly boresight the Howa using those rings, and was very nicely on-target with the first test shot at the range.

Also used a set on my Marlin 375. Worked great, boresighted "perfectly." First test shot at the range at 50 yards was in the 10-ring.

Cheers,

Carl
Post Reply