OT - what we have to put up with.

waz · Post by **waz** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 1:15 am

Well guys, I have my first weapons audit at 8:30am Thursday. Two LEOs come around inspect my safe, rifles and ammunition. They want to make sure my records, their records and what I actually have are all consistent.

This is a random thing and I have no idea what to expect. Will let you know how it goes.

Things used to be so much simpler.

W

JReed · Post by **JReed** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 1:22 am

Your welcome to come over to this side of the Pacific. Then you wouldnt have to deal with that none sence.

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 2:05 am

I'm sincerely sorry to hear that. I suspect that if Billary or 'Bama gets in, we will have the same poop to put up with shortly.

Hagler · Post by **Hagler** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 2:19 am

...and if they don't jibe?:

"Two men enter. One man leaves"

Seriously, let us know how it goes. For law-abiding citizens to live in fear of tyranny is not just.

Shawn

gamekeeper · Post by **gamekeeper** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 4:14 am

Big Brother alright! I had a firearms officer come to inspect my rifles but he insisted on checking my shotguns (separate licence in the UK) at the same time and he took out a tape measure and checked that all my shotguns had barrels over 24".

FWiedner · Post by **FWiedner** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 7:39 am

In my home, the first arm he inspects will be the last thing he ever sees.

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 7:45 am

FWiedner wrote:In my home, the first arm he inspects will be the last thing he ever sees.

+1

Better to die on my feet than live on my knees. I fear this reality may come to visit the US very soon...

Jeeps · Post by **Jeeps** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 8:42 am

Thanks for the heads up Waz.

Please let us know how everything works out for ya. It will be great to hear
it first hand from someone who thinks like we do. We wont have to hear it
second hand after a governmental functionary glazes it over.

I'm not sure if you can get them to talk friendly and find out how many folks
don't pass their inspection and how often they confiscate people arms? It certainly
would be nice to know.

crs · Post by **crs** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 8:54 am

Waz;
Good luck with the inspection.

rjohns94 · Post by **rjohns94** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 9:59 am

good luck WAZ. I too would be interested in hearing an after report. I remember a visit from BATF when I had an ffl. It went fine, but I didn't like it.

kimwcook · Post by **kimwcook** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:34 am

Can't be too random, you know they're coming. Sorry being a smart alec.

I can't tell you how concerned that would make me. The Brits are bad enough but when they're ideals spill over to the Australian's it's starting to hit too close to home. Lord forbid what would happen if some politician's attempted to impliment that here.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:40 am

Waz,

Come over to this side of the ocean.

Good luck with everything.

Johnny

RIHMFIRE · Post by **RIHMFIRE** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 5:01 pm

Move here....we can always use another levergunner here....

Post by **Paco** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 5:14 pm

GUN CONTROL BY THE LIBERALS IS NOT ABOUT GUNS.. IT'S ABOUT POWER OVER THE PEOPLE, IT'S ABOUT THERE AGENDA, GUN CONTROL, THE GREENIES, VIOLENT GAY RIGHTS PEOPLE, ALL THESE GROUPS BAND TOGETHER AT POLITICAL RALLIES SO IT SEEMS THE GROUP SPONSERING IT IS LARGE AND POWERFUL.....

TALKING TO THEM WITH LOGIC WON'T WORK THEY KNOW THE TRUTH... THEY KNOW 1 MILLION FELONY CRIMES IN THE U.S. WERE STOPED LAST YEAR BY FOLKS WITH CCWs... THEY KNOW THAT IF CCW HOLDERS ARE ALLOWED TO CARRY IN SCHOOLS IT WILL SHUT DOWN SCHOOL SHOOTINGS... LIKE IT STOPPED RAPES IN VENIUS FLA. AND STOPPED A MASS KILLING ATTEMPT IN A CHURCH IN So.AFRICA .... BUT THEY WANT THE POWER... PEOPLES RIGHTS ARE MEANINGLESS.... "NONE DARE CALL IT TREASON.... PACO

LeverBob · Post by **LeverBob** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 6:36 pm

Paco wrote: GUN CONTROL BY THE LIBERALS IS NOT ABOUT GUNS.. IT'S ABOUT POWER OVER THE PEOPLE, IT'S ABOUT THERE AGENDA, GUN CONTROL, THE GREENIES, VIOLENT GAY RIGHTS PEOPLE, ALL THESE GROUPS BAND TOGETHER AT POLITICAL RALLIES SO IT SEEMS THE GROUP SPONSERING IT IS LARGE AND POWERFUL.....

TALKING TO THEM WITH LOGIC WON'T WORK THEY KNOW THE TRUTH... THEY KNOW 1 MILLION FELONY CRIMES IN THE U.S. WERE STOPED LAST YEAR BY FOLKS WITH CCWs... THEY KNOW THAT IF CCW HOLDERS ARE ALLOWED TO CARRY IN SCHOOLS IT WILL SHUT DOWN SCHOOL SHOOTINGS... LIKE IT STOPPED RAPES IN VENIUS FLA. AND STOPPED A MASS KILLING ATTEMPT IN A CHURCH IN So.AFRICA .... BUT THEY WANT THE POWER... PEOPLES RIGHTS ARE MEANINGLESS.... "NONE DARE CALL IT TREASON.... PACO

Couldn't say it better myself...but, I will call it treason, because that is what it is.

Best to you & wife Paco.

LeverBob

jnyork · Post by **jnyork** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 8:58 pm

waz wrote:Well guys, I have my first weapons audit at 8:30am Thursday. Two LEOs come around inspect my safe, rifles and ammunition. They want to make sure my records, their records and what I actually have are all consistent.

This is a random thing and I have no idea what to expect. Will let you know how it goes.

Things used to be so much simpler.

W

Coming soon to an American home in your state!! Stay tuned. We are in for some very hard times that are just around the corner, I fear.

C. Cash · Post by **C. Cash** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 9:36 pm

Good luck Waz! That is crazy for sure.

Marlin .35 · Post by **Marlin .35** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:19 pm

As usual PACO, you hit the nail on the head!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We must all be more observent, and active!!!!!!! Art

Greg807 · Post by **Greg807** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:24 pm

After listening to Obama tonight I thought he was going to say I was born a Poor Black child like Steve Martin did in (The Jerk), McCain better work on his debating skills, this guy has a handout for everyone. I'm sure he loves Australia's gun laws.

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:30 pm

Waz, it would be great if you could video the whole thing, and u-tube it. We found it makes certain 'holes with clip boards strut a little less..,
Grizz

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:32 pm

Paco wrote: GUN CONTROL BY THE LIBERALS IS NOT ABOUT GUNS.. IT'S ABOUT POWER OVER THE PEOPLE, IT'S ABOUT THERE AGENDA, GUN CONTROL, THE GREENIES, VIOLENT GAY RIGHTS PEOPLE, ALL THESE GROUPS BAND TOGETHER AT POLITICAL RALLIES SO IT SEEMS THE GROUP SPONSERING IT IS LARGE AND POWERFUL.....

TALKING TO THEM WITH LOGIC WON'T WORK THEY KNOW THE TRUTH... THEY KNOW 1 MILLION FELONY CRIMES IN THE U.S. WERE STOPED LAST YEAR BY FOLKS WITH CCWs... THEY KNOW THAT IF CCW HOLDERS ARE ALLOWED TO CARRY IN SCHOOLS IT WILL SHUT DOWN SCHOOL SHOOTINGS... LIKE IT STOPPED RAPES IN VENIUS FLA. AND STOPPED A MASS KILLING ATTEMPT IN A CHURCH IN So.AFRICA .... BUT THEY WANT THE POWER... PEOPLES RIGHTS ARE MEANINGLESS.... "NONE DARE CALL IT TREASON.... PACO

The liberals know darn well that gun control won't stop crime, and they know that armed law-abiding citizens prevent 1 million+ crimes each year using their guns. Taking away this ability to defend ourselves and our loved ones not only permits the state to do as it pleases (after all, they strip us of our ability to resist the march from socialism to communism), but also increases violent crime - just as it did in Washington DC, and has in England, Australia, and everywhere else gun control has been established. The sheep among us bleet louder, and the state is only too happy to establish more draconian laws. Our freedoms slip one by one, and a majority of the people are only too happy to trade these for a perception of security...

ornery · Post by **ornery** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:37 am

Don't ya'll git tired of this horse stuff! Just makes ya' wanna' rope n' drag some danged liberal.

Aussies saw this one comin' and a lot of fellers did the compromise thing. (ala'NRA) They trusted their politicos just like a lot of us over here and look what they got.

I'm jest about thar'

Lock and load...charlie's everywhere.

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:30 am

Gun Control isn't about guns... it's about control.

Rusty <><

Sixgun · Post by **Sixgun** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 11:43 am

FWiedner wrote:In my home, the first arm he inspects will be the last thing he ever sees.

Copy that--I'm with 'ya-------------Sixgun

Jarhead · Post by **Jarhead** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:07 pm

Reading this really bothers me

As many of you have stated, "It's about controlling people and power." Liberals are not liberal! They want dictatorship! Makes a feller sick

I am going to buy more guns! And, more ammo too! Be certain to buy lots of brass, powder, bullets, and primers, for they will try to control that as well.

Mike

Retro · Post by **Retro** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:34 pm

FWiedner wrote:In my home, the first arm he inspects will be the last thing he ever sees.

You know, I've heard people say that a lot. I've read Unintended Consequences. Etc, etc. Yet, when it comes to the crunch, you know what happens?

Because we've seen many pictures here of what happens, and it involves bulldozers and Bessemer ovens...

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:44 pm

FWiedner wrote:In my home, the first arm he inspects will be the last thing he ever sees.

....

I've always thought that in this country, it was intended that the citizen grant the right to bear arms to the government, within any limits we set, and that the government simply has no right to dictate anything regarding the ownership of defensive small arms. In other words, that 'inspector' should be asking you if it is ok to carry the kind of gun he has, and with the kind of bullets he wants to use, and what capacity magazine, and how to carry it, and where it is ok to do so, because HE IS YOUR EMPLOYEE. You shouldn't have to answer to him unless you have actually harmed someone, in which case you are a criminal.

Jarhead · Post by **Jarhead** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:14 pm

This is my rifle. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
My rifle is my best friend. It is my life. I must master it as I must master my life.
Without me, my rifle is useless. Without my rifle, I am useless. I must fire my rifle true. I must shoot straighter than my enemy who is trying to kill me. I must shoot him before he shoots me. I will...
My rifle and myself know that what counts in this war is not the rounds we fire, the noise of our burst, nor the smoke we make. We know that it is the hits that count. We will hit...
My rifle is human, even as I, because it is my life. Thus, I will learn it as a brother. I will learn its weaknesses, its strengths, its parts, its accessories, its sights and its barrel. I will ever guard it against the ravages of weather and damage as I will ever guard my legs, my arms, my eyes and my heart against damage. I will keep my rifle clean and ready. We will become part of each other. We will...
Before God, I swear this creed. My rifle and myself are the defenders of my country. We are the masters of our enemy. We are the saviors of my life...
So be it, until victory is America's and there is no enemy, but peace!

FWiedner · Post by **FWiedner** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 6:34 pm

Retro wrote:
FWiedner wrote:In my home, the first arm he inspects will be the last thing he ever sees.
You know, I've heard people say that a lot. I've read Unintended Consequences. Etc, etc. Yet, when it comes to the crunch, you know what happens?

Because we've seen many pictures here of what happens, and it involves bulldozers and Bessemer ovens...

I'm not trying to insult anyone, or to question their personal choices, but my personal opinion, admittedly (and thankfully) not having been in the situation:

What kind of slinking coward would look his wife in the eye, or lay some claim to his children's respect after he would allow such thugs to enter his home at will, simply for demanding to do so?

If you'll let them in the front door of your home, you'll also let them beat your children, kill your pets, or have a go at your wife. And all you'll do is watch and hope that they don't hurt YOU.

If you won't defend your home, what will you defend?

Would you rather that your children have the image of you standing like a man or you crawling on your belly like a beaten dog burned into their brains?

Whether they wear a uniform, carry a badge, or have warrant in their pocket to represent the "law" or not, these inspectors are criminal thugs come to subjugate those who will bow.

My children are grown and gone, and I will not hide behind my wife or social obligations. I'm not claiming to have any lame excuses not to do what a man should do when the wolf is at the door.

I'll be darned if I'll ever lick the boots of some jack-booted government thug just to live another day, or in the pitiful hope that "they" will leave me alone in my cage for another little while.

I intend to stand and to fight back with whatever tools I possess.

Perhaps you will look upon such words as "false bravado".

To that, I will simply suggest that there is a real difference between false bravado and grim resolve.

Jarhead · Post by **Jarhead** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:38 pm

Well said

As we use to say in the Marines, " A brave man dies only once, a coward dies many times."

ornery · Post by **ornery** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 10:59 pm

FW...when the day comes, (and it WILL come) if it matters...drop me a line. You won't answer the door alone.

Like most of you guys, I've read the popular books and heard all of the bravado.

Ask yourself this....It's a warm weekend, the news comes down. The door to door collection teams are coming to your neighborhood. Minutes later, here come your friends...Come on pal! We're headed fer the hills...all SIX of us, all over fifty, all livin' too soft for too long. As you grab your gear and you prepare to do battle, your wife and two daughters/sons grab you and say, through tearful faces, "Don't go! Just leave the stupid guns on the porch! We love you......don't go Daddy..."

Having heard a few shots fired in anger, I can say that it ain't all that easy a choice fer most.

I can't speak fer no one but myself....I dun made my decision a long, long time ago.

So I can say again...FW, when they knock, you ain't gonna' hafta worry about yer '6'. It AIN"T about friendship. It's about RIGHT..NOTHING else matters.

Retro · Post by **Retro** » Thu Feb 21, 2008 1:24 am

FWiedner wrote: I intend to stand and to fight back with whatever tools I possess.

I agree with you 100%.

BUT, I just don't see people actually doing this. Every one englishman stood by while the government melted their handguns. If one of them resorted to violence, well, I didn't hear about it...

Here in South Africa we have many people saying the same thing "they'll never get my guns". But when the crunch comes, they get the guns.

I believe the time to fight is now, before it comes to what happened in .oz and .uk and yes, in .za. The problem is, not many people want to work. They'd rather sit around saying "they'll never get my guns"... meanwhile less than a hundred of us here in .za, out of 3 1/2 million licenced (yes, we have licences, with background checks and fingerprints) firearm owners, are trying to make a difference, trying to prevent the day when they say "we know where you live, give us your guns by the end of the month".

Because we already have the same type of inspections the guys in .oz have, and you know what? Nobody's shot a police type coming to do the inspection yet.

Now I'm not saying that you personally don't have the resolve to do what you feel necessary. But the message I'm trying to send out is, make sure that day never comes. Because in the end, you'll be dead, and they'll have your guns.

FWiedner · Post by **FWiedner** » Thu Feb 21, 2008 10:14 am

Retro wrote: Because in the end, you'll be dead, and they'll have your guns.

This is a possible outcome of the choice I have made. I'll trust the Lord's mercy that it's not the one that will finally play out. If it is, His will be done.

The decisions have been weighed and my eyes are wide open. I've made my peace.

So be it.

gamekeeper · Post by **gamekeeper** » Thu Feb 21, 2008 10:47 am

Gun control laws in the UK have been like a dripping tap. We have had changes to the licence and how its granted we have had changes in the security requirements we have had changes in the types of firearms we are allowed we have had changes to the use we can use certain firearms for. All these changes were over a long period of time, Drip Drip Drip. and now we are drowning in the flood of gun laws.

I'm sure if all these changes came at once many people would have taken a stance but how do you start shooting LEO's when they just want to make sure your gun safe is adequate? As it is in England at the moment if you even hang out with the wrong crowd your Firearm Certifcate would be revoked and you would kiss your guns good bye! I have more guns than I need and thats because I do not intend to ever be completely disarmed by the government or its gestapo police force. But I sure ain't taking on a SWAT team just because some jumped up official wants to measure the length of my shotgun barrels! Now if he said my Shotguns wern't pretty that's another matter!

gamekeeper · Post by **gamekeeper** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 10:13 am

Can anyone tell me how it works in the few Cities etc in the USA where you are not "supposed" to have hand guns or assault rifles how does anyone know whether the law is being complied with?

FWiedner · Post by **FWiedner** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 10:21 am

No one really knows whether their neighbors comply with the law or not, and the police have no authority to investigate without probable cause.

Leverdude · Post by **Leverdude** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 12:45 pm

FWiedner wrote:No one really knows whether their neighbors comply with the law or not, and the police have no authority to investigate without probable cause.

Thats about it. In CT we still have an assault weapons ban. But I see guys all the time at the range with illegal guns & they dont realize it. Most will argue with you because they didn't notice when the law hapenned & they already had their guns, or they move here already owning it.
Basically the law created alot of unknowing harmless felons.
People dont much seem to care & you only hear about it when they bust a drug dealer & find a couple AK's or AR's. They never seem to actually use them tho. They kill each other mostly with 9mm's.

gamekeeper · Post by **gamekeeper** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 12:59 pm

Leverdude wrote:
FWiedner wrote:No one really knows whether their neighbors comply with the law or not, and the police have no authority to investigate without probable cause.

Thats about it. In CT we still have an assault weapons ban. But I see guys all the time at the range with illegal guns & they dont realize it. Most will argue with you because they didn't notice when the law hapenned & they already had their guns, or they move here already owning it.
Basically the law created alot of unknowing harmless felons.
People dont much seem to care & you only hear about it when they bust a drug dealer & find a couple AK's or AR's. They never seem to actually use them tho. They kill each other mostly with 9mm's.

I wish that was the case over here but they nailed us good because every "legal" firearm was registered and you had to turn it in or start a single handed "action" with a well armed SWAT team that shoot at anything that moves!

Post by **Hobie** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 1:30 pm

Didn't some of your guys shoot a Brazilian in the head while he was prostrate on the ground under their guys because they thought he was an Arab terrorist? Not even SWAT and shooting things that weren't even moving!

gamekeeper · Post by **gamekeeper** » Sat Feb 23, 2008 4:12 am

Hobie,

Yes our wonderful police force targeted an innocent Brazilion because he lived near some muslim suicide bomber and followed him onto a train and shot him 7 times in the head at point blank range! The police over here are trigger happy and have shot dead quite few innocent people. I put it down to the fact most of them have NO knowledge of firearms until they join the police. I had one copper look down the muzzle of my shotgun to see if it was loaded!!

PaulB · Post by **PaulB** » Sat Feb 23, 2008 3:57 pm

I agree with you 100%.

BUT, I just don't see people actually doing this. Every one englishman stood by while the government melted their handguns.

I believe the problem here is the way it's phrased. Yes, I don't see "people" doing this either - if you define "people" as the majority of citizens, or everybody. But we don't expect the majority to do anything right. They are furniture. All it takes is some people, and I think there will be enough to stop any such move.

The other point here is, why worry about what anyone else does? Do you get your morals, your sense of what is right and wrong, from what others do? Worry about what YOU do. The rest is irrelevant.

We are all going to die. I just hope my death is useful, i.e. happens while killing tyrants, for example; rather than a waste, in bed. A useful life is best ended with a useful death.

And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand? . . .
-- Alexander Solzhenitsyn, "The Gulag Archipelago"

Anyway, the other problem here is that Americans aren't Englishmen. Just think, when they had that ban in New Jersey (not exactly a hotspot of gun-nuttery), the compliance rate was way under 20%. Compare that with virtually 100% all over England.

Personally I don't expect to see anything like confiscation or in-home inspections. That is really whacking the hornet's nest. I believe it is safer and more sure for our enemies to continue baloney-slicing.

OT - what we have to put up with.

OT - what we have to put up with.

Re: OT - what we have to put up with.