Two Cowboys?

[rangerider7]

Let us start off the new year with an old photo to inspect.

[jnyork]

I think they may be cowboys, but I think the revolver belts and revolvers are studio props, probably the rifle also. Notice how small these guys are, compare them to the size of the revolvers.

[Griff]

I think they may be cowboys, but I think the revolver belts and revolvers are studio props, probably the rifle also. Notice how small these guys are, compare them to the size of the revolvers.

They weren't called "cowboys" for no reason!

But I agree, studio props. I ain't ever seen a real photo of a cowboy where he wore both a necktie and a 'kerchief!

[wecsoger]

Ditto.

Both don't seem to be wearing their guns well, especially the one on the left.

Lace up shoes?

Hats seem ill-fitting.

These old photos are fun. Please keep 'em coming.

[Don McDowell]

About as real as it gets. I'll bet it took a months check to get to town get cleaned up get ,new shirt and a wildrag, then have this picture took.

[kimwcook]

Boy, Don, I don't know. They don't set right with me. I'm with Griff, they're both wearing ties and wild rags. I've never seen any cowboy do that. Obviously it's a studio pic and real cowboys got their pictures taken too, but I lean more to the side of posers. RR7, got anymore information on them boys?

I looked at the picture again and the guy on the right looks familiar.

[Don McDowell]

Nope, what they're wearing is just the way they were in the later part of the 90's and early 1900's, and some later.
That's a 94 Marlin so it's got to be around 1900 sometime, maybe even as late as the 20's.

[20cows]

Dude shoes. And the Colt's SA on the right is not sittng in the holster right. It either doesn't fit or was just slapped on for the photo (or both).

[RIHMFIRE]

city slickers....
look at their hands....
look at their shoes...
They are too soft look'n

[Don McDowell]

Just to bad some have drawn their knowledge of cowboys from tvland and not the real deal.
Dude shoes my butt, today you wannabees stumble all over yourself to buy the modernday Chicom made version for Ariat. People that have more money than brains buy them from Whites for 500$ or more a pop...

[J Miller]

I'm voting with Don on this pic. For instance their faces. They look like young guys who've been out doors for long enough to make some money, but not for very long.
And the guy on the right, well his pistol isn't all the way down in the holster because it's brand new and he's showing it off. Look at the finish, you can clearly see the dark blued back strap and trigger guard as they contrast with the CCH cylinder frame. Look at the grips, there is no wear.

These two guys just got paid and have bought some new stuff, so they're showing off.

JMHO

Joe

[wecsoger]

Well, ain't we just like a lot of biddies down at the laundromat clucking away.

"Madge, did you see that Williams girl, she's dressed so bad every boy in the county's going to be staring at her!"

"Uh, why Emily, that's what she wants."

Still fun though. Anybody posting a count as to the wannabe's v. the real deal? (grin)

[Mac in Mo]

I think that they are posers, both dressed by the same person. I notice that their sleeves are rolled back the same and their kerchiefs are hung in the same position on their necks. Those shoes too, to clean and scuff free.



Kevin

[Hobie]

A Colt Bisley, the other fellow has his Colt half out of the holster (to show off?) and a Marlin. Those seem like expensive props but...

[Gobblerforge]

Wanabe here for the record. I say you can't count anything that some would wear for a picture. No doubt in my mind that a couple young fellas going to town and getting their picture are going to be positioned and preened and fussed right through the whoe deal. Makes them feel special and the photogragher knows how to prep them. If they showed up in thier work clothes, and I figure they would, prop clothes would be in order. Chances are that if it were a couple city boys, they'd have nice shiney cowboy boots on.
I'm not sayin, I'm just sayin.
Gobbler

[Ben_Rumson]

Notice the worn off leather on bottom edge of the left leg of the guy with the rope..That'd be the spot that would get worn off getting on and off a horse wouldn't it?

[Don McDowell]

In those times people got dressed up in the best they had or at least cleaned up as much as possible to have a picture taken in public, contrast that with today.
If a person turns to page 225 of the Time Life Cowboys book , there's two picture's taken in Miles City in 1882. One of them is two young men all dressed in white shirts and cleaned up, one of them is displaying his new Colt, and...... He's wearing a tie and a wild rag, the other picture shows 4 young fellas just off the range, their duds are worn but cleaned recently and one of them... gasp..... Is wearing hightopped lace ups....

Moral of the story they wore what they had.

[Griff]

Don,
Not being at the house, can't look at the pic you describe... Having the entire series, I just don't recall seein' that pic. But then, I don't have total recall! And I agree with everyone of your points... but...
I'll give you the time frame... could very well be post WWI, but not long after... And cowboy boots are certainly not any sort of real measure to go by. But, having shoes built on left & right lasts would also tend to date it toward the end of that era... as I recall, it was rarely seen except in the best of footwear prior to that time. And growin' up around cowboys, and some true to life vaqueros in SoCal is different, area often had a distinct influence on garb. Seen a few dressed up for Sunday "go-to-meeting" and ties were quite common, but then they'd be wearing a coat & vest... if they had the inclination for that. But, like I said, I've never seen one wear a tie and a kerchief. All my direct contact is certainly with post WWII drovers... and while several I've know hailed from TX, WY or MT, they certainly dressed differently than they might have back to home. And none were very "old-timey" in their choices; except the vaqueros, they seem to have a different standard for style and what they consider good horsemanship.
Bein' a lefty, I can't really comment on his right hand as it holds the rope, it looks awkward to me... but then, tryin' to throw a loop with my right hand would be about as graceful as a penguin trying to do it! I'd just say that I've never seen anyone bend their wrist that far back except when in actual motion... but then maybe that's just the result of having to hold the pose for so long? Or that's the one knack that causes me to miss every so often!
It ain't necessarily any ONE thing, but the totality for me is just "off". Another thing is that rolled up shirtsleeves; I've seen plenty in pics taken while working, but... I just don't KNOW. I call 'em like I see 'em... wouldn't expect anyone else to do otherwise. And hey, good healthy discussion leads to understanding and more knowledge... Lord knows I can stand more of that! Hey, I've been wrong before, and will be again, I'm certain... Expert ain't a title I can claim.

Hobie,
Both guns appear to me to have plowshare handles... neither has the deep arch of a Bisley.

RR7,
Any further info?

[Don McDowell]

Griff that looks to be a sisal rope, don't think it rawhide but it could be but it doesn't look stiff enough. Those sisal ropes are a pain and there's no good way to hold them. (You can buy em for half a nylon, but you don't see anybody with a sisal on a saddle anymore) Also don't forget that rifle it suggests the picture was post 1895.
Don't let the sleeves bother. If you look close at that picture you can see the tan lines.on their wrists. Most likely those new whites didn't fit. Clothes came in about two sizes fit and don't.
In 1910 my uncle Dale rode into the Tensleep ranch with another youngun and they got hired. They both needed clothes and boots badly. The foreman sent them down to town (Hyattville I think) to put some clothes on the ranch account and would be deducted from their first check. anyway the store had 2 pairs of levis on the shelve and 2 pair of size 10 boots and a couple of shirts, they had to roll and tuck the sleeves. The levis were to big, they put em on tightened the belts and jumped in the horse trough and wore them dry. They shrunk enough in the waists to be worn but they had to roll the cuffs. The boots were to narrow, so the blacksmith took em to the horse barn and filled the the foot with whole oats and water and set them out in the sun. In a couple of days those oats had taken the water swelled and stretched the leather enough they could wear them without pinching their feet.
Buying clothes back then away from the major towns and cities was something that most nowdays would be totally mortified by. Here in Wyoming the styles didn't change much from the late 90's untill well after WWll, and even those who were young at the turn of the century didn't change the clothes style. I grew up around and had the pleasure of knowing a fair number of those guys, and am proud to be the grandson of a couple of em..

[kimwcook]

This is getting interesting.

[M. M. Wright]

The chaps on the man holding the rifle look to be Shipley No. 17s. They look just like the ones hanging on the front of my R. T. Frasier, A fork saddle in the living room. I think the bottom of them has been cut off, that bottom concho doesn't look right being at the bottom of the leg. Course mine look the same. They could easily be real cowboys who had their picture made in a studio after buying new clothes and getting cleaned up. I'm guessing around 1900, give or take. I think both pistols are Colt SAA, not Bisley. The cartridge loops being randomly filled is interesting. Don't know if that means anything or not.

M. M.

[Griff]

Don,
Yep the rope is definitely grass. Still have one I bought in the mid-70s. And yep, they do handle differently than nylon. After 40 years of slingin' that thing, I still can't keep a figure 8 outta my loop! They certainly ain't CA cowboys... And yep, whether they were the real deal or poser, all the same would apply. Like I said, it ain't any one thing... just an overall impression.
However, I have to say, the young man on the right, has a shiney forehead as tho he wears a hat all the time when outdoors. Hats pushed back to allow their face to show when the flash went off. Otherwise how was Ma to recognize her repobate boy!!!!

[Griff]

Don,
Never heard that deal with the oats and tight boots. I was always told to grin and bear it!

[Don McDowell]

Uncle Dale used that trick for along time. Then his feet got bad and he'ld take a brand new pair of Naconas or Tony 's and cut out the part that bothered the side of his foot, head off for the boot shop and have Calvin sew a patch over the hole. Don't remember seeing him the last 20 years he was alive without a patched boot.

[kimwcook]

Then his feet got bad and he'ld take a brand new pair of Naconas or Tony 's and cut out the part that bothered the side of his foot, head off for the boot shop and have Calvin sew a patch over the hole.

I guess you have to do what you have to do, but I'd sure hate to cute a hole in my new Tony Lama's.

[Don McDowell]

Sort a makes a shiver run up your back thinking about it...

[rangerider7]

I used to put a good dose of lathered saddle soap on my new cowhide boots and then put a plastic bag over them tied at the top. Then I would walk around with the on until the saddle soap dried; then take them off and rub them down real good until they shined. They would be formed to your foot like a glove. Never did get any blisters. P.S. helped waterproof them too.

[grass range]

Shoes were as common as boots then. Rawhide ropes get limp with use.

[mouthpiece]

I looked at the picture again and the guy on the right looks familiar.

He should look familiar. He's a member of Congress & on TV every night.

Picture used very briefly in his primary campaign.

Forest for the trees, hiding in plain sight, etc.

[Don McDowell]

I looked at the picture again and the guy on the right looks familiar.

He should look familiar. He's a member of Congress & on TV every night.

Picture used very briefly in his primary campaign.

Forest for the trees, hiding in plain sight, etc.

I've known Cindy Lummis most of my life, and she hasn't ever looked like either one of those toads....
Maybe time for some enlightenment for the unwashed

[mouthpiece]

Imagine him wearing green tie & you'll recognize him immediately.

[Don McDowell]

Nope still don't look like any congressman I've ever voted for....