.45 Colt loads exceeding Max COAL

[JohndeFresno]

First off - I've been reloading for a while, and load 13 or more calibers. But I admit to being brand new to the .45 Colt. And I am a bit surprised.

In loading one of our sponsors' excellent products - Dave Jennings' Montana Bullet Works 255 gr. SWC Keith 452424, I saw that the Max COAL of 1.600" (as found in all of my books) was exceeded even by this medium sized bullet. It crimps at 1.646". I called Dave to make sure that I wasn't doing something wrong. In fact, I thought it was wrong, so I crimped in front of the driving band to keep it within the prescribed COAL. Don't worry - this will be in a Blackhawk and it's a mild load for that gun, even though it is seated more deeply than called for.

Now, I have read a bit about the original Colts and clones having a shorter cylinder length than the Rugers and more expensive custom SA offerings.

So:

1) Is 1.600" the absolute max for a genuine Colt or a Uberti or close clone? I would want to know for future mild loads that would otherwise be shareable between handguns.

2) How about leverguns? What is our limit with COAL there - say, with the new Rossi .45 Colt levergun?

[J Miller]

John,

No 1.600" is not the absolute max in Colts or copies. My Cattleman will take any Keith bullet up to the 270 gr versions crimped into the crimp groove. Keith designed this bullet this way for his Colt SAA so he could put more powder under it.
1.600" is the SAAMI spec for factory ammo. That's all. Most loading manuals quote this and most factory jacketed bullets take that into account. But for our own hand loads, the gun is the limiting rule.

My Win 94 AE will function with any cartridge that does not exceed 1.75".
My Marlin 1894 will work with cartridges not exceeding 1. 675".
The Rossi Puma I had was tuned to accept full length Keith rounds that run around 1.675" ±.
My OM BH will also chamber the 1.75" rounds, and my Cattleman will do the 1.675".
My S&W 25-5 will do rounds around 1.730".

Many of the older Colt and S&W double action .45 Colts had short cylinders and a properly seated Keith SWC was too long. So in those even Keith said to seat them deep and crimp them over the front driving band.

Joe

[JohndeFresno]

Thank you, Joe.

Your post is spot-on for everything I'll ever need (and most likely anybody else, for that matter)! Another saved for my reloading archives.

[J Miller]

Thank you, Joe.

Your post is spot-on for everything I'll ever need (and most likely anybody else, for that matter)! Another saved for my reloading archives.

John,
Glad to be of help. I guess all these years of loading the .45 Colt in various guns was worth it.

Joe

[Griff]

John,

The only levers that I know have a problem with over 1.600" ammo are the toggle links, (1860 & '73). I keep my .45 Colt stuff to 1.595" for that sole reason. I haven't tried anything longer in my Rossi... so I don't "know" how much wiggle-room there is.

[Lefty Dude]

Yep;

Griff is right about the Toggle Links. If I load my 73 Carbine 44-40's to 1.60" they will stick on the Lifter.

With the Rossi/92 44 and my B-92 44, I can seat out to 1.66".

With the Revolver's I can seat long as I want. As long as the cylinder turns & the bullet does not exceed the diameter of the cylinder throat, preventing full chambering.

[BAGTIC]

My M94 Trapper will take loads up to 2.00". I ground the shoulder on the follower back. It still feeds standard lenth rounds even interchangeably.

[JohndeFresno]

Waiting until all posts came in... Archiving all of this into a seachable document so that I know which guns work well with longer loads, and which to avoid (or that will require some smithing!).

Thank you again, folks.

[J Miller]

John,

Kinda looks like you got all the main .45 Colt lever guns accounted for.
About the only types I can think of that weren't mentioned is the Colt Burgess repo.
Oh, and the Colt Lightning pumps.
I have no idea on them, but I'd bet they are very OAL sensitive.

Joe

[JohndeFresno]

John,

Kinda looks like you got all the main .45 Colt lever guns accounted for.
About the only types I can think of that weren't mentioned is the Colt Burgess repo.
Oh, and the Colt Lightning pumps.
I have no idea on them, but I'd bet they are very OAL sensitive.

Joe

I'm glad you mentioned the Colt Lightning, Joe. It was in the running, if one came available and if I had some frogskins saved up. I'll stick with the levers, then.

[Rimfire McNutjob]

Wow, I'm glad I found this thread. I'm using a 280 grain Montana Bullet Works bullet that is 0.703" overall and 0.360" from the top of the crimp groove to the top of the bullet. My Starline cases are going 1.272". I'm going to seat 0.345" in and crimp with a Lee collet style FCD. Apparently my rounds will then be 1.630" which is a smidge beyond the SAAMI max of 1.6".

These should still fit my Cattleman according to @J Miller. I will do 5 and check them.

I was worried at first that I had to crimp well above the groove but apparently I will be fine in the top of the groove and a slightly longer than SAAMI OAL.

This old thread was exactly what I needed.

My case is measuring 43.78 grains of distilled water capacity and I'm setting my Uniflow to drop 5.3 grains of N320 over a Fed #150 primer.

[Scott Tschirhart]

I load 270 gr bullets in my SAA and it does exceed the 1.6 inch oal

[Walt]

My .45 Colt revolver with the shortest cylinder is a Freedom Arms model 97; the Lyman 454190 bullet is the only one that does not fit unless crimped on the ogive. The RCBS 45-270- SAA fits fine.

[Rimfire McNutjob]

I load 270 gr bullets in my SAA and it does exceed the 1.6 inch oal

Looks like you might have 20 - 30 thousandth's to spare.

[AJMD429]

.
Old threads often have good info you'd not find elsewhere ...

[Griff]

My 3rd Gen Colt SAA has cylinders that measure 1.609". The longest round I load is a 240 grain HP and measures 1.562" from nose to face of rim, or 1.619" overall. I could probably seat it deeper in the crimp groove by about .040". But, I kept it this long to keep it out of my toggle links. It's my "Ruger only" ammo for the Rossi.