Tragic accident or stupidity?

[ByronG]

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/10/ ... 8015.shtml

[Sixgun]

Stupidity---he should take himself out to even things up and to help cleanse the gene pool.-----------------Sixgun

[Gun Smith]

Very sad. It would be interesting to know if there had been any neighborhood concerns that might have made him nervous. Of course shooting without knowing your target, and what's behind it costs many lives every year.

[Ysabel Kid]

Caught this briefly when I passed by the TV earlier today. The anti-gun vultures were already all over it as another example of why guns should be banned. Stupid, stupid, stupid. I don't care how scared you may be - and how good the reason is for your fear - you NEVER shoot unless you know what your target is, especially when sharing a residence with anyone.

[TedH]

How very sad. But the fact remains he broke rule #1, identify your target!

[AJMD429]

Maybe we should outlaw doctors!

Coming up next with B-HO's health care plan!

Funny, but true. I've heard of physicians in Canada who basically practice 'off the record' health care - you go to them if you want quality care, but it is basically 'black market'.

[KirkD]

That shooting underscores one of the factors in defending your home and family at night ...... certain identification of family members in the middle of the night. It is something every man needs to know how to do long before he's actually faced with the situation, so that in the situation, he does not end up shooting a loved one. Where is your cover? Where are the light switches? What is your plan if there is no time for cover and you are not near a switch? Behind which walls are the beds? Which walls will your bullet go through and who is sleeping behind that wall? Different things to think about and plan for in advance. The man with a plan is usually in a better situation than a man trying to figure things out on the fly. One thing for certain is that I'd far rather take a bullet than shoot and kill a loved one. You also need a plan if you do take a bullet. Have you decided ahead of time (barring a head shot or shot to the spine) what you will do the instant you see a muzzle flash or feel the hit? It is helpful if you have already decided that, no matter how much lead you may have soaked up, your focus is on the threat and your solution is to neutralize the threat, no matter how badly you are shot up. Lots of things to think about, run through in your head, practice runs in your home, etc. That man in the news is a lesson to everyone else.

[FWiedner]

Tragedy as a result of panic and carelessness.

I'll vote stupidity.

[TedH]

Kirk raises some valid points. The man that plans for such events is infinitely better off should something happen. You can't count on having the time to find a light switch, or even want to light up a room that way, making yourself a target in the process. If you keep a weapon at arms reach at night, you better have a good, bright flashlight right next to it. Not only will it let you quickly identify a target, but it will stun or blind a bad guy long enough for you to take appropriate action.

[L_Kilkenny]

IMO, the difference between accident and stupidity is so slight as to not even matter. When it comes to mistakes, the words are interchangable 99% of the time. After all, aren't most car accidents caused by stupidity?

LK

[Rusty]

Good points Kirk, maybe we all need to do some soul searching.

[JimT]

Thank you Kirk.

We often judge others by their actions while we judge ourselves by our intentions.

[Doc Hudson]

Good points Kirk!

Especially the part about planning for action after a wound. it helps to know that only about 25% of gunshot wounds are fatal, so don't let yourself be scared to death by what might be a minor wound.

i vote for tragically foolish accident. The man failed to identify his target. Perhaps he'd heard too many folks talk about shooting first and asking questions later, a sure fire recipe for disaster IMO.

FWIW, I've come close to getting shot by frightened people twice. Fear can make even smart people do foolish things. And speaking personally, I've made way too many mistakes in my life to point fingers at other people who've made tragic errors in judgment. According to some of the judgments made by folks in this thread, I should have eaten a bullet more than 20 years ago.

Consider well Kirk's advise. make plans and practice them. After all, a man fights like he trains.

[Dave]

That is a rough situation. Years ago I stopped having a gun where I can reach it without getting out of bed. There is too much chance of grogginess/dreamstate thinking when you are suddenly awakened out of deep sleep. If your gun is nearby but you have to stand up and get it that gives you time to wake up for just a second. I am not sure exactly how this scenario played out, but the man's statement he thought his fiance was lying next to him shows he misassessed the situation. I would be willing to wager he "saw" her in bed even though she wasn't there. Very sad.

[AJMD429]

Thank you Kirk.

We often judge others by their actions while we judge ourselves by our intentions.

THAT is an excellent quote. So true on so many levels.

[Ysabel Kid]

Thank you Kirk.

We often judge others by their actions while we judge ourselves by our intentions.

THAT is an excellent quote. So true on so many levels.

+1

This all underscores that firearms ownership is a right... and a RESPONSIBILITY. Like some many other "rights" the people enjoy, seldom do they care about the personal, individual responsibilities attached to those rights.

I have found that very few things in life are truly accidents - random occurences that could not be prevented. Most events have a source or cause that can be traced - and could have been avoided. We are, after all, human.

[Rimfire McNutjob]

Some around here feel that this shooting is highly coincidental given his wedding date the next day. I assume the police are in the best position to figure it all out. Either way it's a tragedy.

EDIT: When I said "some around here" in the above statement, I meant on the news and radio in the Central Florida area where I live. I didn't mean to imply "on the Leverguns forum". Poor choice of words on my part.

[J Miller]

I read the article linked above and thought that was way too little information to even really discuss it. But some of the comments on the story page and here make me think I should insert my two bits worth.

Stupidity? Yes, as been said he failed to follow all the safety rules.
Accident? No, it was a deliberate act to shoot the gun.

Perhaps he thought there was an intruder in the house, we'll never know what was in his mind.

From being married for over a quarter century I can say that I know how my wife walks. I know how she moves at night. When she's up and about and I wake up, I know it's her. Doesn't matter if it's ODark30 or bright daylight. If I'm working in the basement, and she comes home from work, I know it's her opening the door and coming in.
If my wife was approaching me in a hallway back lit and silhouetted I would still know it's her.
Before my step son moved out I knew his sounds and ways of moving too.

I can also tell you that when you first wake up, a persons lack of presence in bed doesn't always register on your mind. I've been startled awake many times when my system realized my wife was not there. Listen a moment and I know where she is, go back to sleep.

To shoot someone you have been living and sleeping with for some time is hard for me to understand. As has been said, why was he afraid? Had he been threatened? Had there been home invasions? Not enough information.

But one more thing I do know is when you get woke out of a dead sound sleep at ODark30 by something unexpected, you don't just wake up. You come fully conscious but totally disoriented and confused by a load of adrenalin. It's happened to me and after analyzing what happened I've come to the conclusion that this is the most dangerous time for someone to have a gun within reach.

Not enough information to know how this scenario plaid out as it did.

Joe

[Streetstar]

Great response == both KirkD and JMiller.


I wonder --- if this unfortunate tragedy had happened to a forum member, what our responses might be ---- This guy might have been a total klutz or a new shooter, or more likely -- a guy that hits the range maybe once a year ============ but then again, who knows.

I agree with J Miller that if i am woken from sleep, there is a small amount of disorientation, but enough time elapses in the time it takes to grab your self defense heater from the nightstand , stand up and walk to the doorway to peer down the hall- look, aquire the target and fire, that this should never have happened unless the dude was sleepwalking.

Who knows-- but my heartfelt condolences go out to her remaining family members, and to the dude too if he is just an untrained klutz with no self control -- if it really was an accident, it will be a significant emotional burden to bear indefinitely.