40-60 wcf Fan

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Dusty Texian
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40-60 wcf Fan

Post by Dusty Texian »

Have been a fan of the 40-60 wcf for many yrs. For me it's an easy cartridge to load for . Most of my loading and shooting with the 40-60wcf has been Bp. loads but even though I only have original 1876 Winchesters and not the newer replicas , I have tried Smokeless loads in my old Winchesters with good accuracy and no signs of harm but I tend to gravitate back to the Bp. loads because they work and just feel right in the old dinosaur Winchesters . The 40-60 wcf is a very mild cartridge to use for target shooting and hunting . In the past several yrs . hunting deer turkey and wild hogs the 40-60 wcf has been used more often than other rifle cartridge combo's that I have . It just seems to be the right balance between bullet weight bore size and powder charge for the type of hunting I do . In the picture is my Special order 1876 Winchester 40-60 wcf with 26" oct. barrel full mag. Sporting rifle . It has been used and does show its age but for being used since 1884 ( yr. made ) it is still sound solid and has a great shinny bore with good rifling . ,,,DT
1876 26 40-60 WCF .jpg
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3030
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by 3030 »

Nice pics, and I agree that the 40-60 is a great choice, for me I tend to gravitate towards the more modern 30WCF ---
by the way did I say nice rifle too... :)
hfcable
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by hfcable »

very very nice !! way to go !
cable
Walker
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by Walker »

Beautiful rifle! Now I need to read up on the 40-60.
yooper2
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by yooper2 »

Lovely rifle! The 40-60 WCF has always struck me as an example of moderation, enough bullet wieght, bullet diameter and velocity to get the job done.


Eric
Dusty Texian
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by Dusty Texian »

Thanks for all the comments . With a ROT of 1 in 40" for the 40-60 wcf bullets longer and heavier than the 210 Gr. will not stabilize in most guns . Years back I ran across a 1876 Winchester 40-60 wcf that had been cut down and the bore was on the worn out side and had its share of pitting . Even new the original Winchester 40-60 wcf barrel only has a groove depth of 3 thou. per side , and this one did not have much left . No matter what I tried it just would not shoot any better than 5-6 " groups at 50 yd. So I re - lined the barrel . I went with a 1 in 22 " ROT in this barrel , after cleaning up the crown on the newly re-lined barrel it ended up just under 23" . Now this ROT of 1 in 22 " will stabilize bullets up to 280 Gr. and still shoot the 210 Gr. bullet as well . My favorite or the rifles favorite ' bullet is the original .406 255 Gr. cast lead for the 40-82 wcf . With this bullet over 55 or 57 Gr. ff g Swiss powder it is very accurate and has been very effective on game . A pic. of the re- lined 76 Win .
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Last edited by Dusty Texian on Sat Jun 25, 2022 9:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
.45colt
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by .45colt »

Very Nice!! Thank You . :D .
Oldncrusty
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by Oldncrusty »

Awesome guns and ammo. Thanks for sharing.
Nath
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by Nath »

Wonderful.
To many folk look at ballistic performance with a view to looking for what is "better" when indeed there are or were far more enjoyable choices available.
Have you ever tried 4f in them?
Psalm ch8.

Because I wish I could!
Dusty Texian
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by Dusty Texian »

Nath wrote: Sun Jun 26, 2022 2:33 am Wonderful.
To many folk look at ballistic performance with a view to looking for what is "better" when indeed there are or were far more enjoyable choices available.
Have you ever tried 4f in them?
Thanks Nath , you certainly are correct . Many times another cartridge combo is pointed out as being better , and of course if one is hunting something larger or more dangerous than what I normally go after then sure there are better choices . The old 40-60 wcf was designed for Medium game at iron sight ranges , and if used within its limitations it still does the job very well . Like another member mentioned earlier it just has a good balance of , powder / bore / and bullet weight for what I do . No modern cartridge or firearm gives me more pleasure than the old style guns my flintlocks and Bp. cartridge guns for hunting or just shooting targets . About the 4f , I am not sure if the Bp. is graded / granulation numbers are different in Europe ? I think #4 Swiss may be different than ffffg Swiss , is that correct ? NO I do not use 4f , ffffg Black Powder would be very dangerous in a cartridge like the 40-60 wcf . I have used fffg Swiss and fffg Schuetzen / fffg Goex in this cartridge but the fouling was greater . The ffg Swiss powder works well for me . 160+ lb. Wt. buck taken while stalking using the 40-60 wcf Bp. load and cast bullet .
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Nath
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by Nath »

Thanks for the reply.
Yes some manufacturers don't use the standard f grading system in Europe buy I was referring to 4f.

There are in fact some examples of 4f or even finer being used in cartridges.
Whilst most hold to " it would be very dangerous " to use 4f in a muzzleloader or cartridge no one to date, and I have been asking for decades, has come up with any evidence of calamity from using 4f!

Whilst I have not got a brand of BP classed as 4f to hand I do have a brand graded as 'fine' and it mics out at between 3f and 4f. It is my preferred choice in all my shotguns including my 10g with a 2oz load.
It never ceases to amaze me how going from 3f to 4f is regarded as courting disaster!
Anyhow, glad for you. I just wanted to ask. In my search for evidence etc....👍
Psalm ch8.

Because I wish I could!
Dusty Texian
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by Dusty Texian »

Nath you may be correct that ffffg Black powder is safe being used as a main charge . I certainly have not done any pressure test in the use of ffffg Black powder as a main charge . I can tell the difference between fffg and ffg using the same brand for comparing using the Chronograph .The fffg seems to create more pressure than the ffg . Since ffg seems to work for me , I see no need to risk using a higher pressure load of ffffg . Not saying you are incorrect , just saying a charge of 60 Gr. ffffg in my cartridge guns would be more than I would want for pressure . In my case I will just stay with what Winchester recommends for this cartridge . Like you mentioned earlier I'm not looking to ( better the ballistic performance ) of the 40-60 wcf . I enjoy the mild cartridge as is . Good luck using your ffffg 4F Fine powder as a main charge I am sure with your extensive background with Bp. shooting you know what you are doing . Like you say No one has come up with calamity / evidence using ffffg in the cartridge , and I sure will not be one either . Think this was a loaded question , Pardon the pun ! ,,,, DT
Dusty Texian
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by Dusty Texian »

In my post earlier , I said that using ffffg or 4F Fine Black powder in the 40-60 wcf ( would be very dangerous ) . It has been pointed out that there has been no proof or evidence of that being true . I will admit I may be wrong and I have no evidence or have I tested the the use of ffffg 4F Fine Black powder in the 40-60 wcf case , so I should not have made that claim without proof ! It may be perfectly safe ? I have always read that leaving air space in a cartridge case or between ball and powder in Bp. firearms was unsafe and should not be done . I have not tested this theory either , and it may be rubbish also ! Again its just what I was always told and never had reason to question it . Still something I will not do ! I mention this because , just a guess , I think if I would load a case full of ffffg 4F Fine Bp. in my 60-40 wcf the pressure / velocity would be greater than necessary , so why do it ? Again just a guess because I have not tested that theory and have no proof ! Another guess is that if I would use ffffg 4F Fine Bp. trying to achieve the same velocity gained with the ffg 2F Bp. the charge would have to be reduced in bulk size to achieve the same pressure and velocity . Without a filler or wad , there would be an air space in the cartridge , so why do it ? .
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Pat C
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by Pat C »

Really nice rifles , I hope someday to rebuild that stripped receiver I have into a shooter. Had hoped to make everything from scratch out of modern steel .
Just finding time will be the biggest issue.
Dusty Texian
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by Dusty Texian »

Thanks Pat C , sounds like an interesting project .
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RIHMFIRE
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by RIHMFIRE »

HOLY COW....ANOTHER ONE!
YOU HAVE EXCELLENT TASTE IN GUNS!
LETS GO SHOOT'N BOYS
Dusty Texian
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Re: 40-60 wcf Fan

Post by Dusty Texian »

RIHMFIRE wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 6:44 am HOLY COW....ANOTHER ONE!
YOU HAVE EXCELLENT TASTE IN GUNS!
Not sure if its good taste or obsessed . Thank you Sir .
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