AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
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AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
by the ammo makers.
took scout and CarGo out to the woods today. put the red dot on the 556 chassis, (is that better than "platform"? ), and started in on the coffee cups, shot low, the steel plate, shot low, the other steel plate, miss miss low. cranked up two and started getting center line hits with 62gr nato 556 and 55gr 223. boring. the cheapest fire control group in the global inventory gave a smooth letoff that didn't jimmy the shots. the steam punk pins work as well today as they did in the bronze era.
pulled CarGo out, switched red dot to his rail, lubed him up, stuck a mag of 300 AAC BLK 220 subsonics into it, plate ding, plate ding, clay gone, gallon of stale cranberry juice, up and spinning, ground sluiced it for a while. changed to 125gr supersonic, ding, ding ding. changed to rem 120gr OTM. ding, ding, ding. boring.
scout was pouting so I put the other stale gallon up the hill a ways and tried to drill it with the 55 grainers. no joy, could I miss that bad? started walking toward the jug, shooting as I approached. finally got close enough to see that the bilge was empty, and when I picked it up there were a dozen holes in it. dead jug.
one thing to note about the pistol. there is hardly any recoil, what's there is straight back, no muzzle flip that I can tell. it's smooth, nothing on the buffer tube and it just slides along my cheek. no bump or torque. I rigged a field expedient sling, the dog's leash, and found the length that lets me push the gun against it forward which helps steady it up, although I wasn't having any trouble hitting without the sling.
I spent more time searching for brass than emptying it. I have to make a catcher or deflecter that will centralize them. But I got about 40 or so 45ACP empties in partial compensation from the guy that shoots from the lane and dumps brass for me.
I am glad to have CarGo and feel very confident it's a good self defender. for a pistol. It feels good having it under a jacket on the console. I'm thinking it will be a good deer gun skiff hunting in AK. Although he might get the beo mod, if he will just bear with me.
KelTec 9mm carbine is still the house gun because it's much more compact and much less likely to ventilate someone else's house.
All three of these tools are direct responses to the illigitimate, corrupt, lawless, out of control whatchamacallems, to whom I am thankful for opening up the world of spendthrift ammo consumption. My conservative gene finally acquiesed; you have to see it to understand it.
Grizz
took scout and CarGo out to the woods today. put the red dot on the 556 chassis, (is that better than "platform"? ), and started in on the coffee cups, shot low, the steel plate, shot low, the other steel plate, miss miss low. cranked up two and started getting center line hits with 62gr nato 556 and 55gr 223. boring. the cheapest fire control group in the global inventory gave a smooth letoff that didn't jimmy the shots. the steam punk pins work as well today as they did in the bronze era.
pulled CarGo out, switched red dot to his rail, lubed him up, stuck a mag of 300 AAC BLK 220 subsonics into it, plate ding, plate ding, clay gone, gallon of stale cranberry juice, up and spinning, ground sluiced it for a while. changed to 125gr supersonic, ding, ding ding. changed to rem 120gr OTM. ding, ding, ding. boring.
scout was pouting so I put the other stale gallon up the hill a ways and tried to drill it with the 55 grainers. no joy, could I miss that bad? started walking toward the jug, shooting as I approached. finally got close enough to see that the bilge was empty, and when I picked it up there were a dozen holes in it. dead jug.
one thing to note about the pistol. there is hardly any recoil, what's there is straight back, no muzzle flip that I can tell. it's smooth, nothing on the buffer tube and it just slides along my cheek. no bump or torque. I rigged a field expedient sling, the dog's leash, and found the length that lets me push the gun against it forward which helps steady it up, although I wasn't having any trouble hitting without the sling.
I spent more time searching for brass than emptying it. I have to make a catcher or deflecter that will centralize them. But I got about 40 or so 45ACP empties in partial compensation from the guy that shoots from the lane and dumps brass for me.
I am glad to have CarGo and feel very confident it's a good self defender. for a pistol. It feels good having it under a jacket on the console. I'm thinking it will be a good deer gun skiff hunting in AK. Although he might get the beo mod, if he will just bear with me.
KelTec 9mm carbine is still the house gun because it's much more compact and much less likely to ventilate someone else's house.
All three of these tools are direct responses to the illigitimate, corrupt, lawless, out of control whatchamacallems, to whom I am thankful for opening up the world of spendthrift ammo consumption. My conservative gene finally acquiesed; you have to see it to understand it.
Grizz
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
AR's are the Lego's of the gun world.
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Kind of a rifle-version of a Glock.sore shoulder wrote:AR's are the Lego's of the gun world.
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
.223 is much less likely than 9mm to ventilate someone else's house. .300 BLK, especially heavies, is probably more likely.Grizz wrote:
KelTec 9mm carbine is still the house gun because it's much more compact and much less likely to ventilate someone else's house.
ARs make sense, don't they? Even if you don't like them at first (like me) you kind of have to come around to appreciate them once you recognize the usefulness, advantages of the design, and advantages of the calibers.
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
yeah they're fun. I like 'em a lot.
are 9mms really prone to pass-thru on home invaders? I hadn't gotten that memo.
are 9mms really prone to pass-thru on home invaders? I hadn't gotten that memo.
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
I would have said "...1911". As there are a myriad of accessories for the 1911, to personalize it... tho' quite a few require some minimal gunsmithin' skills, while others require more complex work.AJMD429 wrote:Kind of a rifle-version of a Glock.sore shoulder wrote:AR's are the Lego's of the gun world.
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
1911 for sure - just like an AR, you can sell a guy one and sell him parts and accessories for the rest of his life.
On the 9mm, the reason that the pistol caliber carbines and sub-guns are disappearing from law enforcement in favor of 5.56 carbines is because they have poorer terminal performance on humans than 5.56 and are much more likely to be lethal after penetrating a wall than pistol calibers. 9mm is actually pretty good at penetrating walls, especially from a carbine.
On the 9mm, the reason that the pistol caliber carbines and sub-guns are disappearing from law enforcement in favor of 5.56 carbines is because they have poorer terminal performance on humans than 5.56 and are much more likely to be lethal after penetrating a wall than pistol calibers. 9mm is actually pretty good at penetrating walls, especially from a carbine.
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Yes --- its tough to build one that won't shoot if you practice due diligence in assembly . I guess thats why im an "on again, off again" AR fan -- My last time out with one was when a buddy and i were zeroing my new M14 .. (err M1A , old habits die hard).
I also had a Colt M4 (6920) that hadnt been zeroed yet. We were usung cheaper factory xm193 ammo which isnt known for accuracy , but after 3 or 4 rounds at the 25, then the 50, then the same at 100, the group results likely wouldnt make too many folks' brag board, but i shrugged and looked at my buddy and said ---"at this point we're just making noise-- this thing is dialled"
He took 5 shots at the the 100 meter board with similar results and we wiped it down and put it back in its case.
Next up was my M16 604 (on a semi auto lower) - this one has a Colt style 4x carry handle scope and i normally have a good time shooting it -- but the results were even better . The 1/12 twist barrel is optimized a bit for the 55gr pills and the results were better still, - i put 5 rounds downrange, verified results with a spotting scope, then put it back into the case -----
Shooting paper is boring
I also had a Colt M4 (6920) that hadnt been zeroed yet. We were usung cheaper factory xm193 ammo which isnt known for accuracy , but after 3 or 4 rounds at the 25, then the 50, then the same at 100, the group results likely wouldnt make too many folks' brag board, but i shrugged and looked at my buddy and said ---"at this point we're just making noise-- this thing is dialled"
He took 5 shots at the the 100 meter board with similar results and we wiped it down and put it back in its case.
Next up was my M16 604 (on a semi auto lower) - this one has a Colt style 4x carry handle scope and i normally have a good time shooting it -- but the results were even better . The 1/12 twist barrel is optimized a bit for the 55gr pills and the results were better still, - i put 5 rounds downrange, verified results with a spotting scope, then put it back into the case -----
Shooting paper is boring
----- Doug
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
I guess I was thinking of it this way:Griff wrote:I would have said "...1911". As there are a myriad of accessories for the 1911, to personalize it... tho' quite a few require some minimal gunsmithin' skills, while others require more complex work.AJMD429 wrote:Kind of a rifle-version of a Glock.sore shoulder wrote:AR's are the Lego's of the gun world.
M1A's and 1911's go together - robust if heavy design, powerful ballistics, generally not switch-caliber but plenty of aftermarket add-ons and upgraded parts. Also both are very 'classic' and attractive designs - guns you can warm up to and 'bond' with.
AR's and Glocks go together - lighter weight, less power but more capacity, fairly easy to switch calibers, and plenty of aftermarket stuff. Both are arguably more practical, if not more reliable, than their older counterparts. Neither is what I'd consider 'classic' or attractive - not guns you'd sit and sentimentally gaze at while you relax by the fire in the evening and read.
Last edited by AJMD429 on Sun Feb 01, 2015 12:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
just for clarification . . . I trust you know I appreciate your experience . . . ..223 is much less likely than 9mm to ventilate someone else's house
my gold dots stop in the second water jug from my xdsubcom. are they really going to pass through a torso or skull with enough snuff to penetrate walls?
not asking in doubt, just curiosity and caution.
the 9mm ball from the carbine does in fact have more smack-down, on steel pop-ups, than the pistol delivers.
but, on the theory that increased velocity causes greater and faster expansion with hollow points, is the increase in velocity that detrimental?
it seems to be an issue with 223, that too slow and they don't tumble or fragment, and that limits the practical barrel length.
I am coming from a 45/70 load that penetrates 12 jugs of water, which translates to a stack of 12 cooperating bad guys. my prior 223 experience consists of shooting golf balls hanging from junipers near Mayer.
I would like to learn more about this.
I appreciate the input, thanks
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Grizz,
I think the theory is that at the speeds the 223 is going, most of the bullets out there will start shedding their jacket quicker and start breaking apart faster than a slower moving bullet which will stay more intact after it hits something, but maybe not a rapidly expanding one like a gold dot or a winchester sxt
Makes me glad i live in an area where i dont have to worry about that too much though- nearest house is 1/4 mile away. If i was in an apartment or an area surrounded by siding houses, i would think about it though. A month ago, in a neighboring town to me, a sleeping 14 yo girl was shot and killed during a argument and shooting that happened on the street outside.
This isnt Detroit or Gary Indiana either. Moore, Oklahoma is mainstream USA. Makes it all the more shocking when things like this (plus the disgruntled Muslim food service worker last year) happen
I think the theory is that at the speeds the 223 is going, most of the bullets out there will start shedding their jacket quicker and start breaking apart faster than a slower moving bullet which will stay more intact after it hits something, but maybe not a rapidly expanding one like a gold dot or a winchester sxt
Makes me glad i live in an area where i dont have to worry about that too much though- nearest house is 1/4 mile away. If i was in an apartment or an area surrounded by siding houses, i would think about it though. A month ago, in a neighboring town to me, a sleeping 14 yo girl was shot and killed during a argument and shooting that happened on the street outside.
This isnt Detroit or Gary Indiana either. Moore, Oklahoma is mainstream USA. Makes it all the more shocking when things like this (plus the disgruntled Muslim food service worker last year) happen
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Got a new subscription to Guns&Ammo last year and this tactical stuff is about all of that is in that platform anymore.
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
AJMD429 wrote: ... Glocks... less power...
I beg to differ sir. May I introduce you to the Glock models 20 and 21, with the 21 .45 ACP matching and surpassing the 1911, and the model 20 10mm which leaves the 1911 in the dust with 15+1 rounds at 750+fpe.
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Some of us OLD PHARTS remember the AR & 1911... before there was a glut of crummy, euro-trash Glocks imported to the USA. OH? Did I say that out loud? But, since you put it that way... I see the train of thought... I was strictly thinkin' out the ability to change parts and sorta "personalize" the rifle & handgun. From my view, you either like the Glock... or get rid of it, 'cause there ain't much personalizing available.AJMD429 wrote:I guess I was thinking of it this way:Griff wrote:I would have said "...1911". As there are a myriad of accessories for the 1911, to personalize it... tho' quite a few require some minimal gunsmithin' skills, while others require more complex work.AJMD429 wrote:Kind of a rifle-version of a Glock.sore shoulder wrote:AR's are the Lego's of the gun world.
M1A's and 1911's go together - robust if heavy design, powerful ballistics, generally not switch-caliber but plenty of aftermarket add-ons and upgraded parts. Also both are very 'classic' and attractive designs - guns you can warm up to and 'bond' with.
AR's and Glocks go together - lighter weight, less power but more capacity, fairly easy to switch calibers, and plenty of aftermarket stuff. Both are arguably more practical, if not more reliable, than their older counterparts. Neither is what I'd consider 'classic' or attractive - not guns you'd sit and sentimentally gaze at while you relax by the fire in the evening and read.
Griff,
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
True; I was thinking of the 'original' Glocks in 9mm, but the 10mm is a different beast for sure. Kind of like putting on a 50 Beowulf upper on an AR-15...sore shoulder wrote:I beg to differ sir. May I introduce you to the Glock models 20 and 21, with the 21 .45 ACP matching and surpassing the 1911, and the model 20 10mm which leaves the 1911 in the dust with 15+1 rounds at 750+fpe.AJMD429 wrote:... Glocks... less power...
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Still can't alter 'em with the ease of the 1911 for "personality"... Having never seen a Glock "Texas BBQ" gun... I think I can say that without fear of contradiction!AJMD429 wrote:True; I was thinking of the 'original' Glocks in 9mm, but the 10mm is a different beast for sure. Kind of like putting on a 50 Beowulf upper on an AR-15...sore shoulder wrote:I beg to differ sir. May I introduce you to the Glock models 20 and 21, with the 21 .45 ACP matching and surpassing the 1911, and the model 20 10mm which leaves the 1911 in the dust with 15+1 rounds at 750+fpe.AJMD429 wrote:... Glocks... less power...
Griff,
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There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
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There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
I dont even know what BBQ gun is lol.
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
As far as accessorizing
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Heres a nice 10mm carbine.
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
"He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance." Declaration of Independance, July 4, 1776
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Nope, I would worry very little about over-penetration of a person resulting in injury to someone else with 9mm fired from a pistol.Grizz wrote: just for clarification . . . I trust you know I appreciate your experience . . . .
my gold dots stop in the second water jug from my xdsubcom. are they really going to pass through a torso or skull with enough snuff to penetrate walls?
not asking in doubt, just curiosity and caution.
Fired from a carbine, the possibility is increased, but there is small likelihood of penetrating a person, a wall, another wall, and hitting a neighbor inside his house. If you miss, then the likelihood increases, but the threat from penetrating a wall will be greatest on the other side of one interior wall, and less of a concern when you start to consider multiple exterior walls.
LE have to consider a lot of different possibilities than you do - you know your situation in your own home, I know mine, and we are not kicking down doors to enter the unknown.
.223 is superior from a Carbine than 9mm from a carbine in terminal performance, in avoiding penetrating walls, and sometimes in recoil, depending on the carbine. 9mm is quieter than 5.56, with less muzzle flash. The shorter the barrel, the bigger advantage the 9mm has in these areas. In most cases, either one will do what is needed for self-defense in or around the home.
If you use 5.56, the 77 gr OTM (Mk262) is the load for devastating terminal effect on humans and little penetration potential on even interior walls. If you need barrier penetration, the 55 or 62 gr. TSX loads are the ticket. Keep a mag of each with the gun. If you use 9mm, stick with any good HPs and avoid the frangible stuff - it is proven to have poor wounding reliability, yet is no less likely (more likely in some cases) to penetrate walls. If you need barrier penetration, use some good FMJs. Main thing is to hit the target, which I am sure you are quite capable of doing.
If you have a lot of people in different rooms inside your home, you might seriously consider the penetration potential of 9mm from a carbine. If you are just worried about hitting someone in a neighboring house, unless you miss and shoot through a window, I would not be too concerned. A 9mm HP that makes it through two exterior walls and the intervening space will likely have little wounding potential after that.
Now if you were using a .45-70 . . . call all your neighbors and tell them to duck . . .
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
"He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance." Declaration of Independance, July 4, 1776
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
So yea Griff, nothing as shiny as that 1911 but like the saying goes, 1911's are what you show your friends, Glocks are what you show your enemy.
Or one I coined.
Someday I will have a Model T, horse drawn farm implements, and a 1911.
Or one I coined.
Someday I will have a Model T, horse drawn farm implements, and a 1911.
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Sore Shoulder, I can only say them Glocky rifle looking things sure look silly, the tan one is just yucky. And are they even legal when you put a stock on them? Give me my Browning Hi Power or my trusty 1911 any day. Wood and steel, wood and steel, I say. God Bless.
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
My vision of a GLOCK BBQ Gun is a GLOCK laying melted all over the grate of the BBQ Grill!
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
No and yes. The short barreled stocked gun is illegal without gov permission and tax stamp etc, not sure which one but most likely SBR, though I'm not sure since it started out as a pistol not a rifle. The 16" barreled carbine is technically legal. As far as switching it back and forth, that I am not sure of either.rodeo kid wrote:Sore Shoulder, I can only say them Glocky rifle looking things sure look silly, the tan one is just yucky. And are they even legal when you put a stock on them? Give me my Browning Hi Power or my trusty 1911 any day. Wood and steel, wood and steel, I say. God Bless.
Don't get me wrong, I've always loved the 1911 ever since I saw Magnum PI stuff one in his waist band when I was a kid. I carried one in a mexican holster and toolbags for 7 years. However I'm a fan of simplicity, and Glock in my opinion has made the evolutionary step. When my 10mm has twice the energy as ball .45ACP and twice the ammo, and loaded it weighs less than an unloaded 1911, it's an easy decision for me. And when I saw my wife and daughters group sizes shrink and their confidence go through the roof shooting the Glock 17 compared to 1911, I realized Glock had made the perfect gun for women who don't shoot a lot.
But in the end it's really what each person likes and we are the most fortunate people on the planet to have the options. The rest is just food for discussion, magazine articles, and internet brawls.
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
65% of all LE Agencies carry a Glock, my Agency does..Glock's work, they are reliable, accurate and tough--they work wet, dirty, muddy, frozen, dragged out-of salt-water, fresh-water, muddy water...dragged behind a pick-up, dropped out of an airplane, or run-over by a car..are they "perfection", NO, but for the LEO on the street they simply work...they work so well that Smith & Wesson created their own called the M&P...and did I mention high-capacity... :)
- Griff
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Soulless euro-trash... no character... no panache (in case you're wondering: flamboyant confidence of style or manner)... The Glock is just a tool... and all that entails under any definition!
Griff,
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
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- Levergunner 2.0
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Glocks are great, 1911's are great. 1911's do have nice lines; glocks, well. 10mm is a semi-auto 41 Mag.
- AJMD429
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Yep. That's probably the most likely to go and go and go and then go some more, unless it hits armor plate or something.7.62 Precision wrote:Now if you were using a .45-70 . . . call all your neighbors and tell them to duck . . .
Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
"first do no harm" - gun control LAWS lead to far more deaths than 'easy access' ever could.
Want REAL change? . . . . . "Boortz/Nugent in 2012 . . . ! "
- Griff
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
No, gravity will take over guidance before too long...AJMD429 wrote:Yep. That's probably the most likely to go and go and go and then go some more, unless it hits armor plate or something.7.62 Precision wrote:Now if you were using a .45-70 . . . call all your neighbors and tell them to duck . . .
Griff,
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
SASS/CMSA #93
NRA Patron
GUSA #93
There is a fine line between hobby & obsession!
AND... I'm over it!!
No I ain't ready, but let's do it anyway!
Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
hey, that load has a 250 yard point blank rangeGriff wrote:No, gravity will take over guidance before too long...AJMD429 wrote:Yep. That's probably the most likely to go and go and go and then go some more, unless it hits armor plate or something.7.62 Precision wrote:Now if you were using a .45-70 . . . call all your neighbors and tell them to duck . . .
on Bison . . .
Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
I want an AR in 10mm real bad...sore shoulder wrote:Heres a nice 10mm carbine.
- sore shoulder
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Olympic Arms has/does make one, however their 18 round proprietary mags leave me cold. Maybe I'm being picky.
http://www.olyarms.com/shop/rifles/ar-1 ... odels.html
http://www.olyarms.com/shop/rifles/ar-1 ... odels.html
"He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance." Declaration of Independance, July 4, 1776
11B30
11B30
- 7.62 Precision
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
No it was called a Sigma, didn't work so well, was uglier than any Glock, and had a horrible trigger.1892 wrote:Glock's . . . . work so well that Smith & Wesson created their own called the M&P...and did I mention high-capacity...
And they had to pay Glock for it in the end.
They've since improved with the M&P.
http://www.SHWAT.com
Front Line Holsters • http://www.7-62precision.com • Custom Finishes • http://www.762precision.wordpress.com
Front Line Holsters • http://www.7-62precision.com • Custom Finishes • http://www.762precision.wordpress.com
Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
The later Sigmas got better.
The M&P was designed to beat Glock at it's own game, they specifically went in and fixed everything Glock wouldn't that people complained about.
Glock, having been told by the Glock USA branch since about 1999 this was coming, finally had to release the Gen 4 guns after sales dropped too much.
The M&P was designed to beat Glock at it's own game, they specifically went in and fixed everything Glock wouldn't that people complained about.
Glock, having been told by the Glock USA branch since about 1999 this was coming, finally had to release the Gen 4 guns after sales dropped too much.
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Back to AR`s.... They are like film cameras used to be. They made them just as cheaply as possible and still work so they can sell that $9.00 a roll film. With AR`s they sell gadgets and ammo.
- Streetstar
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
That giant box magazine does look disconcerting --- The only Glocks i own are the 20 and 29 (well, also a 42, but who's counting) --- and so i think they dropped the ball by not offering it up to take Glock mags like the .40 and 9mm carbinessore shoulder wrote:Olympic Arms has/does make one, however their 18 round proprietary mags leave me cold. Maybe I'm being picky.
http://www.olyarms.com/shop/rifles/ar-1 ... odels.html
I wonder if they even sell any of those ugly things
----- Doug
- sore shoulder
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Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
They would have to make a dedicated lower for the G20 mags, they make them for Glock 9mm and .40 mags. The G20/21 mags are too wide for an AR magwell.
"He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance." Declaration of Independance, July 4, 1776
11B30
11B30
Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
Grizz wrote:yeah they're fun. I like 'em a lot.
are 9mms really prone to pass-thru on home invaders? I hadn't gotten that memo.
Don't need to "pass through". Most shots miss the target completely.
Re: AR - - - it's a conspiracy I say
my scots gene makes me too cheap to miss . . . waste not, want not . . .BAGTIC wrote:Grizz wrote:yeah they're fun. I like 'em a lot.
are 9mms really prone to pass-thru on home invaders? I hadn't gotten that memo.
Don't need to "pass through". Most shots miss the target completely.