Speaking Of Marlins

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 7:31 pm

Brand new 1894 in .357 Mag arrived at my dealer today. They appear to be in the pipeline, or very close.
Probably pick it up tomorrow.
Fingers crossed on quality.

I LIKE Marlin leverguns & want to see Remington salvage the brand.
Denis

edwardyoung · Post by **edwardyoung** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 7:40 pm

Hey Denis. Hope you're doing well

Sixgun · Post by **Sixgun** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 7:49 pm

Glad to see your spending your money on American made products. Hope the best for 'ya.

-----6

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 7:53 pm

Hey Edwardy,
Moderately well, thanks.
Shilling for Marlin, as you see.

Six,
Dunno if I'll be keeping it, depends on how well they did on this one.

Have a 16-incher I'm kinda fond of.

How well would an 1894 translate into a Mare's Leg.......?
Denis

edwardyoung · Post by **edwardyoung** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 8:12 pm

DPris wrote: Have a 16-incher I'm kinda fond of.

Denis

I thought you broke up with that guy

Post by **Chuck 100 yd** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 8:17 pm

Some of the reading I have done lately say that Remington has come far in improving the Rem-Marlins in the last few months. I haven`t handled one to know if that is so.
The fancy 336 that was in one of the mags sure was purdy though. The only thing I didn`t like was the forend is even fatter than they were just before Marlin closed. Not easy to fix that with the fancy checkering is had on it.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 8:58 pm

I hope so I need a carry rifle to match my new GP100.

JM Marlins are going sky high too. I really don't have a preference between the two just want a good shooting/working lever.

Post by **Old Savage** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 9:01 pm

Ones I have seen of late have looked good.

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 9:13 pm

How'd that paternity suit come out, Edwardy?

Denis

edwardyoung · Post by **edwardyoung** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 9:19 pm

DPris wrote:How'd that paternity suit come out, Edwardy?
Denis

Turns out he's my son, and my brother. We're all very pleased

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 9:51 pm

Still keepin' it in the family, after all these years....

Denis

edwardyoung · Post by **edwardyoung** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 10:04 pm

DPris wrote:Still keepin' it in the family, after all these years....
Denis

Mama's very jealous - and a great kisser.

7.62 Precision · Post by **7.62 Precision** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 2:54 am

DPris wrote: How well would an 1894 translate into a Mare's Leg.......?
Denis

Probably just fine, but with a $200 translator's fee, I would keep a slightly shortened but usable stock on it.

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 10:03 am

Naw, dislike those abnaturally long stock nubs that come on the Chiappa & Rossi versions.
They just don't look right.

Denis

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 10:12 am

I'm not even going to comment on that thread drift... (son & brother? I know what that means...)

But, after today:

piller · Post by **piller** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 11:28 am

I will be waiting with bated breath to see the pictures. By the fish like the worms better when they are clean.

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 12:23 pm

Pictures? Pictures!
Don't you know what an 1894 Marlin looks like by now????

Denis

GonnePhishin · Post by **GonnePhishin** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 2:19 pm

Let us know how the quality is. I have a couple from early 2000's that are just dandy.

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 2:28 pm

Shall do.
Leaving in about an hour, back to the computer later tonight.
Denis

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 7:30 pm

Ok, where'd we get to?

Mixed bag, but some distance ahead of the last new one I had here two or three years back that was so bad it was returned unfired.

Tight action, that'll smooth up with wear, like my wife says I have.

Overall machining is notably better.
Front sight not canted. Also not tilted in dovetail with visible daylight under it.
Rear dovetail clean, rear sight not canted.

Still slight bolt overhang at rear, but not overly offensive, much less than on other recent samples, and the angles & curves are done better there to mate it between bolt & frame.

Trigger slightly gritty, very minor travel before letoff & no overtravel once it breaks.
Seen a lot worse, could be better, can be easily corrected for grit & travel. No deal killer, will smooth up with use.

No lever rattle.
Half-cock notch & push-button safety retained.

The wood's still a weak point.
Checkering is pressed, with rounded diamond tops that detract a bit from the nice grain of the oiled walnut.
Front fore-end is a much better fit, no visible gap between its rear & the front of the frame. That's a definite improvement over several I've see in the past two years.
Still fat.

Love it or hate it.

I'm thinking we may be stuck with the overall stock situation that developed when Remington moved Marlin.
I've see horrendible gaps almost big enough to insert a dime in between stock & frame where they met, with daylight visible through the gap, and I've seen some samples where that gap was filled by something that looked very much like bubblegum.
I've also handled one whose stock actually wobbled on a brand new gun.

Marlin buttstocks used to be fitted to each gun at the old factory.
Now, those are outsourced by Remington, and during the post-move period were apparently just bolted on as they came. Bought in batches to a generic spec, and if it fit, it fit. If it didn't, it went out as-is with gap left gaping, or got the filler.

Extrapolating, I'd assume that was a cost-cutting step to eliminate the time needed to do the old way of fitting wood to metal.
I have NOT heard this from Remington, I'm not quoting anybody there.

On this new one, there's a stepped or "raised" section at the front end of the wood, with a slight gap above & below it.
If I were an engineer looking to figure out a way to semi-fit a stock in such a way as to reduce both gap and fitting time, I think I might spec that raised section at the stock's front a few thousandths longer with the supplier so that if it fit as it came, no additional work required to remove at least 50% of the visible gap. If it was too long, removing material from 50% or so of the front end would take less production time to get a contact fit than working to "whittle" back the entire front end.

Dunno if that makes sense, but the net result is about a half-inch of contact between wood & steel visible on both sides of the frame, with the rest of the "join" above & below showing slight gaps.
The wood's also a little proud around the tangs at its front end, top & bottom.

Nitpicky, but markedly better than many newer Marlin levers I've seen recently.
I doubt we'll ever get back to the old stock fit, so this'll probably be a matter of just learning to live with it.

Elsewhere, the rubber buttpad is well-fitted, while the rear sling swivel stud is screwed in at a very visibly cockeyed angle & not seated fully.

I think the core gun is better, still room for improvement, but at least there IS improvement.
Ain't quite what it used to be, but neither am I, and what is nowdays?

May shoot it next week, probably be two weeks.
If it does well on paper, may very well end up keeping it.
The last one that was here, not a chance.
Denis

edwardyoung · Post by **edwardyoung** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 7:37 pm

I guess I'll consider putting a 357 Remlin back on my to-get list. Nice bit of shilling, there.

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 7:43 pm

I gives ya da good, I gives ya da bad.

Denis

edwardyoung · Post by **edwardyoung** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 7:46 pm

DPris wrote:I gives ya da good, I gives ya da bad.
Denis

Would you consider giving me a 357 Marlin?

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 7:48 pm

Naw. You're OK & all (once you get past that family thing), but if I buy it, I keep it.

Denis

edwardyoung · Post by **edwardyoung** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 7:51 pm

I guess that's only fair.

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 8:00 pm

Pretty much the way I saw it.

You know how us shills is.

Denis

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 10:04 pm

Nice report Denis.

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Wed Jun 11, 2014 10:57 pm

Sorry about the pictures.
Denis

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:35 am

DPris wrote:Sorry about the pictures.
Denis

s'alright... I still got a "mental picture of a Marlin '94! BUT... it is hard to imagine a "FATTER" forend!

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:37 am

can that fat forearm be any worse then the one on an early 1950s 39A? Forearms can always be put on a diet.

Sixgun · Post by **Sixgun** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:54 am

BrentD wrote:can that fat forearm be any worse then the one on an early 1950s 39A? Forearms can always be put on a diet.

I too, am not a fan of the fat Marlin forarms, but..............they sure help to hold the gun steady when offhand shooting. My best silhouette scores have always come from early/late forties Model 39's and I've used everything from semi auto Model 63's, 1890 and 62 Winchesters, 1920's Marlins and late Marlins .----------6

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 11:50 am

I prefer the slimmer lines of the Win & Rossi 92s, but....

Denis

plowboy 45 · Post by **plowboy 45** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 6:37 pm

I took a shoeing rasp to mine, fixed it right up.

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:19 pm

That oughta do it.

Denis

BrentD · Post by **BrentD** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:24 pm

plowboy 45 wrote:I took a shoeing rasp to mine, fixed it right up.

I used a jackplane and a drawknife on mine.

piller · Post by **piller** » Thu Jun 12, 2014 7:38 pm

There are some folks on here who know how to fix an ugly forearm, or it sounds that way.

GonnePhishin · Post by **GonnePhishin** » Sat Jun 14, 2014 12:19 am

DPris: thanks for the pretty comprehensive report. What a shame. Glad I have older ones.

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Sat Jun 14, 2014 2:31 am

Not all bad & a definite improvement over what they've been doing.
Biggest complaint I have is the stock, which is a two-part issue: Either do decent checkering or don't bother, and I'd like to see a better fit.

Dunno if they'll do anything about either, but hopefully they will once they get more settled in with the new equipment.

Otherwise, not too bad, pending a shooting session.

Denis

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Tue Jul 01, 2014 10:50 pm

Spent an interesting half hour on the phone with a Marlin rep today.

First, my previous info that the stocks are outsourced was erroneous, all done at Lexington & Iion.
Second, they are aware of the fit & checkering issues, working on those.
Third, my sample was built in May or June as one of 100 pre-production guns intended for largely internal testing & refinement.
Fourth, Marlin is a separate operation from Remington, as far as production goes, with Marlin people working on Marlin guns in a separate building. Employees are not interchangeable.
Fifth, Marlin has some fun plans for the future that I'm thinking levergunners will find interesting.

Just FYI.
Denis

Streetstar · Post by **Streetstar** » Tue Jul 01, 2014 11:17 pm

DPris wrote:Spent an interesting half hour on the phone with a Marlin rep today.

First, my previous info that the stocks are outsourced was erroneous, all done at Lexington & Iion.
Second, they are aware of the fit & checkering issues, working on those.
Third, my sample was built in May or June as one of 100 pre-production guns intended for largely internal testing & refinement.
Fourth, Marlin is a separate operation from Remington, as far as production goes, with Marlin people working on Marlin guns in a separate building. Employees are not interchangeable.
Fifth, Marlin has some fun plans for the future that I'm thinking levergunners will find interesting.

Just FYI.
Denis

I hope so --- heck even S&W had (or has) some dark days ----- stuff from the 80's not as nice as the current "Classics" offerings, but commanding high prices due to being "pre lock"

--- I am not particularly enamored with the Marlins i have in my stash one way or another, but they are not Krieghoff double rifles, or fine old shotguns --- they are in a price range where the closest competitor is a RamLine stocked bolt rifle like a basic 700 Rem or a Savage of some form or fashion --- even a Weatherby Vanguard (but those are closet bargains compared to the others in the $500 range IMO ) ---

The MArlins i have do their job very well with little flash or fanfare --- i like them that way

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Wed Jul 02, 2014 7:09 pm

DPris wrote:Fifth, Marlin has some fun plans for the future that I'm thinking levergunners will find interesting.
Just FYI.
Denis

No "teasers" as to what this means... I lack an imagination!

Or, more properly, mine's over-active... I need some sorta qualifier...

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Wed Jul 02, 2014 11:24 pm

And, at the moment, I lack permission to speak publicly about Marlin's future plans.

Have to leave it, for now, at saying I'm told they are very serious about restoring the brand & have plans for variations that should both surprise and appeal.

Denis

cas · Post by **cas** » Thu Jul 03, 2014 8:41 am

Maybe they'll get it all straightened out, just in time to pack it all up and move it to Alabama.

7.62 Precision · Post by **7.62 Precision** » Thu Jul 03, 2014 2:31 pm

DPris wrote:And, at the moment, I lack permission to speak publicly about Marlin's future plans.

Have to leave it, for now, at saying I'm told they are very serious about restoring the brand & have plans for variations that should both surprise and appeal.

Denis

I'll wait and see. Several times now that have made big marketing pushes claiming they mad a big change, when the results proved otherwise. It is going to tai hard proof before most dealers fall for this kind of hype again. If you understand their business model, coming in from the automotive industry, they are going to be strong on marketing and weak on fixing issues. They will see Marlin as one of their budget-to-midrange brands, and treat it accordingly - cut costs, pump money into marketing.

This is not the first time we have heard the same thing from the Freedom Group.

I hope there are some people at Remington with both the motivation and the clout to stand up to the puppetmasters and make a difference for this brand.

DPris · Post by **DPris** » Thu Jul 03, 2014 3:32 pm

I'm aware of the Freedom Group's record & image, this is not my first rodeo in discussions with either their people, or industry reps in general.

I have a wait & see attitude, too, but I'm passing on what I can on a forum that involves interest in leverguns.

No hype.

The re-intro of certain Marlin leverguns is going through an extensive testing process; my sample was one of 100 pre-production 1894Cs built with production parts to test the equipment processes & assembly processes.
Those guns will be evaluated in various areas by 25 different people, and tweaks made as necessary.

They are very well aware of how much they screwed up the Marlin levergun image.
Two different people involved in the re-boot have both admitted "We screwed up" when they did the move from old to new plant.

If what I'm told now comes to be, and this sample here indicates it's on the road, I still have hope for the brand.

Think calibers & configurations in terms of expanded offerings planned, once the re-intros are stabilized.

Denis

7.62 Precision · Post by **7.62 Precision** » Thu Jul 03, 2014 5:47 pm

I wasn't arguing, just vein cautious. I spoke to someone in the Freedom Group very early, when they were first organizing to buy firearms company and had their strategy explained to me. They were Cerberus then, and planned to structure their firearms acquisitions just like an automotive company. They told me that the biggest "problem" in the firearms company was that there were way too many independent players, so no one got rich - production costs were too high for anyone to make the right profits. They envisioned an industry in which no more than two players controlled all of the firearm manufacture and importation, with sub brands under a main brand (think GM, with Chevy, GMC, Buick, Oldsmobile, etc.). Some brands would be budget brands, some would be midrange, others pro, and others luxury brands.
Some brands would have each level under the same brand in different models (budget consumer rifles, hunting-grade rifles, law enforcement-grade rifles, competition-grade rifles, and luxury-grade rifles).

The problem is, guns aren't cars, and anyway, I think that cars were cooler when there were more players. Now, everything looks the same as everything else.

It seems that everything did not go exactly as the Freedom Group expected, and they backed off a little from their original plan for some reason, but they still managed to mess a lot of stuff up. I don't buy DPMS parts any more. I don't recommend current production Marlins right now, though I hope that will change. The new Remington pistol was a disappointment in that the look and fee lot quality isn't there like it could be.

On the other hand, Remington has some great people there, and some of both their long-time products like the 700 and its more modern variants are very good.I am confident that they have people in a number of their brands who know what should be done. Let's see if they can do it.

I hope they turn the Marlins around. If they don't someone else will build it better. Henry would already be there if they lost some chunkiness and added a loading gate.

Rifles are expensive to build well. You can't keep your price low and your margins way up. They need to spend some money, tighten the margins, and make their profit on the ammo and accessories, which is where the margins are.

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Thu Jul 03, 2014 7:02 pm

I'm not super picky....if they can't do wood and blue, I'll take stainless/composite as long as it fits mo betta.....

.45colt · Post by **.45colt** » Fri Jul 04, 2014 9:20 am

There is hope. As I related last month on another post, I looked at a new 45-70 SBL and it was close to perfect in wood to metal fitting and the lever worked like butter. if I didn't have two I might have bought it.