Interesting old Colt and holster

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Chuck 100 yd
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Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Chuck 100 yd »

A friend owns this old Colt and commissioned me to make an old timey holster for it.
I thought you would be interested in seeing it.
Like they say, "if only it could talk" :wink:

The Holster and belt rig I made up for it.
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He wanted an old style rig. This is made from Will Ghormley`s Dodge City pattern for the 1858 Remington with 8" barrel. Perfect fit on this old girl! :D

Some pics of the old Colt.
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I could buy 6 new Rugers for what it is worth.
I believe I would not own it for long if it were mine.
I love it but love guns I can shoot more. :D
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Borregos
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Borregos »

That looks great :D
Yet another guy with talent on the board :D
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Old Ironsights »

Nice leatherwork.

Now, how about designing one for the Crosman 1377 for us wankers who want to have a holster for our Pellet Gun when we go afield? :wink:

(FWIW, I have a crossdraw setup with a pouch that holds (2) 35mm film canisters of pellets, but it ain't pretty at all...)
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Chuck 100 yd
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Chuck 100 yd »

Old Ironsights , Hay there pard! If I had a gun to go by I could come up with a holster.
I am so far behind now I don't get to work on stuff for me unless I can work it into a batch like I did with the pancake holsters on another post. :wink:
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Old Ironsights »

Chuck 100 yd wrote:Old Ironsights , Hay there pard! If I had a gun to go by I could come up with a holster.
I am so far behind now I don't get to work on stuff for me unless I can work it into a batch like I did with the pancake holsters on another post. :wink:
Depending on the Response of other Levergunner 1377 Owners (Nath, Hobie, hightime, rjohns, jreed...) - I WILL SEND CHUCK ONE OF MY SPARES as a pattern... -

Let's see how far this will go, eh? :mrgreen:
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Pitchy
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Pitchy »

Cool on both counts. 8) 8)
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Chas. »

Chuck, you do have a fine talent. I've made a few items of leather; holsters, sheaths, and such; but it would be years before I'd be as skillful as you. However to really make it look really old-timey, connect it with a rope to the back of your truck and drag it back and forth to work a couple of times. :mrgreen:

BTW, what model of Colt is that?
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pokey
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by pokey »

Old Ironsights wrote:I WILL SEND CHUCK ONE OF MY SPARES as a pattern.
chuck, if you really want to do this i have an example you can use.
no shipping, of course. :wink:
careful what you wish for, you might just get it.

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RIHMFIRE
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by RIHMFIRE »

Borregos wrote:That looks great :D
Yet another guy with talent on the board :D
+10 on that
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Chuck 100 yd
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Chuck 100 yd »

pokey, I would like to see one. I am not at all familiar with them.
Then a pattern would need to be made (no big deal)
Some input as to style, use, R or L hand, etc.
If you guys want it we can work it out.
Let me know. :wink:
Chuck 100 yd
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Chuck 100 yd »

Chas. , I believe it to be a Transition period gun of limited production.
It was made at the Colt factory as a conversion to cartridge but made up of cap and ball parts.
Note the caliber marking (no .44 WCF) Colt and Winchester were feuding at the time and Colt wold not give Win. credit for the chambering (.44-40 ,.44WCF)
Also note the patent dates, One year before the SAA came out. :D

Also, what percent of finish would you call what is left on this gun. The owner said about 30-40% original finish. I believe it to be much more than that at maybe 60-70%. Note the stock varnish that is left.Nickle plating on the trigger guard. No Case colors visible but the finish has not been worn off, just converted to patina by the years. :D
Last edited by Chuck 100 yd on Sun Dec 18, 2011 9:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Rube Burrows
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Rube Burrows »

Great looking rig you done there. The colt is nice too.
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by J Miller »

Is it a center fire or rim fire? If CF then it would be a 44 Colt not a 44WCF. If RF most likely 44 Henry RF. The 44 WCF did not come out until 1873. This gun predates that.

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Chuck 100 yd
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Chuck 100 yd »

You are right Joe, It is c. f. and I forgot the .44 Colt round.
Colt did mark the trigger guard with just .44cal. even after they came out with the WCF according to Mike Ventorino (sp?)

Good catch pard! :wink:
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by rjohns94 »

my crossman may not fit a holster:

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It is for sale anyways for $135 so I won't need a holster for it.
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Buck Elliott
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Buck Elliott »

Colt's 1872 Open Top, in .44 Colt...?

Nice leather work !
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Ysabel Kid »

Pitchy wrote:Cool on both counts. 8) 8)
+1

Cool gun. Another great holster (and belt)! 8)
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Griff »

I'm probably wrong... but I thought the Richards "Transistion Model" were built on the 1860 Army. The above model looks more like an 1860 frame, but a 1851 barrel fitted and made into a .44. I thought maybe that was just what the Italian clones were modeled after; but, I found this on-line:
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The SMALLEST production of 1860 Conversion Models is the Type II, as it bridges the gap between the Richards, and the final change, the Richards-Mason conversions. This Model, has the NEW firing arrangement, where the hammer strikes the cartridge directly through the channel cut in the recoil shield. Whereas the Richards did not, but used a spring loaded firing pin system, and a solid recoil shield. However, this was the LAST conversion to use the PERCUSSION era barrel ! The next full Mason-Richards used the solid frame barrel. serial No.19482X is a superb example of the TYPE II, as few were made, and they saw HARD use! This Mason-Richards conversion has about 75-80% of the original nickel plate, with the heaviest concentration being on the frame and cylinder. The barrel has thinned out somewhat to areas of a light gray, well blending patina. The hammer retains it's case hardening colors, and are vibrantly obvious. The Walnut grips retain about 75% of their original varnish. All factory markings: barrel address( New York America), frame patents( 2 line '72), and all Serial Numbers etc..are crisp, defined, clear and legible. The mechanical action is PERFECT, very crisp and deliberate on each cock of the hammer. The cylinder indexes, and locks tight perfectly, and releases with celerity of fire. This is a very , very fine example, of a very scarce and important conversion for Colt. it represents the steady direction toward the metallic cartridge era, with NO resemblance to the percussion era.
But, it appears I still have a lot to learn. I don't know what the "type I" looks like, but from the above description, the earlier "Richards" model and the "Mason-Richards" conversion are quite different.
It appears the Navy had some of their 1851s converted to .38 Colt:
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With the onset of the self contained cartridge era, and the immediate need of cartridge revolvers in the Military, plus the frugality of the Government, it gave birth to the Conversion revolver. ALL Navy Conversion revolvers were originally '51 Navy/Navy percussion revolvers, RETURNED to the Colt factory, and converted to .38 cartridge. They fall in Serial Range 41,000 to 91,000. This Navy Conversion is Serial No. 8951X, and is absolutely correct in every way, a true and perfect Navy/Navy conversion. The Butt and the Barrel bear all the correct markings, as well as a unique feature! the frame was re-stamped with the two line 1872 patent, over top of the original Colts/Patent, and the U.S., remnants of which can still be seen.
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LeverBob
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by LeverBob »

Good gravy marie...Chuck... the workmanship runs the pucker factor off the scale. It's beayootiful.

Again...there's more talent on this site than anywhere else.

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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Lefty Dude »

I do not think it is a conversion. It is an original 1872 open top. note the Pat. dates. This was only produced for less than two years. The 1873 arrived as the 45colt a Year later.

The caliber is most likely a 44 RF, like Winchester used in the Henry.
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Griff »

Lefty,

I also agree it's not a "non-factory" conversion. But, that looks suspiciously like an 1860 grip frame. I thought the 1872s used the 1851 like the 1873? It is clearly not a conversion as it has no relief in the right side of the barrel that shows it to be a former C&B barrel.

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Pitchy
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Pitchy »

Here`s some pics from a book called guns of the old west.
The all Colt open top from 1872 had a non rebated cylinder and newer style loading gate.
Hope some of these photos help.

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Griff
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Griff »

Thanks, Pitchy. So the one pictured at the bottom and the OP must be the last in the line of "open tops" as it obviously wasn't using left over 1860 barrels?
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Pitchy
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Pitchy »

Hard to keep track of all the changes, gets confusing, they do a pretty good job of showing all the convertions in this book.

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Griff
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Griff »

Obviously a book that SHOULD be in my library! Thanks again Pitchy!
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Pitchy
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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Pitchy »

One of the best books i`ve seen, great pictures.

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Re: Interesting old Colt and holster

Post by Ray Newman »

Yes, it is a M1872 Colt Open Top.

Reproduction available from Buffalo Arms and Cimarron:

http://www.buffaloarms.com/1872_open_to ... -3928.aspx
http://cimarron-firearms.com/OpenTop/OpenTop.htm#
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