"Dry" humor and Sarcasm

Post by **Hobie** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 8:21 am

I've noticed over the years that sarcasm and "dry" humor are extremely difficult for some folks to understand when absent the usual facial expressions and vocal tones one has in face-to-face encounters. Some folks will never "get it". Still, many people write as they talk, most probably do, and some folks are overly sensitive to slights, imagined or real.

So, I'll ask writers to carefully consider their words and readers to cut the writers some slack.

Thank you all for all the interesting posts and have a good day.

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 9:28 am

But we do have facial expressions here... they're called emoticons. People just need to learn how to use them properly.

(FWIW I have better luch sussing out Sarcasam & Dry Humour on the Web than in person... largely because I can't "read" faces. So I LOVE emoticons.

Post by **Hobie** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 10:03 am

Yes, use the emoticons!

Don McDowell · Post by **Don McDowell** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 10:18 am

Emoticons or no some folks are going to take a dislike to other's , for no reason other than they decide they need to.
When in doubt about someones intent, might be the best thing to PM or email that person and check to see if you really are being offended by the other person , or just thought you was.

Post by **Hobie** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 10:34 am

Don McDowell wrote:Emoticons or no some folks are going to take a dislike to other's , for no reason other than they decide they need to.
When in doubt about someones intent, might be the best thing to PM or email that person and check to see if you really are being offended by the other person , or just thought you was.

I've been "offended" gone and had lunch and returned to find the offending comment had somehow changed...

kimwcook · Post by **kimwcook** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 10:36 am

I have a very dry humor and if I've ever offended anyone on this forum I apologize.

There'll be no mistaking my angst if I truly feel offended. I've got pretty thick skin most of the time.

Bronco · Post by **Bronco** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 10:41 am

Hey,
Was that a shot???

Pun intended!

John

piller · Post by **piller** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 11:21 am

On the Texas Safari last year, I met several members of this forum. I found them all to be good men. What we need is to get together sometimes and find out what each other is like. I'd be willing to bet a box of .30-30 that you will find more new friends than enemies if you get together with others from this forum. Don't get too upset at others comments, cause if you don't know them, you don't know their manner of speaking. Not everything is meant to be irritating.

Otto · Post by **Otto** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 11:32 am

I don't use the emoticons because I'm never sure what they mean.

I frequently get the feeling that people don't get my sarcasm, but I have the same problem in real life. I am very sarcastic, and say things all the time that I think are hilarious, only to discover that most people think I'm a moron, and that I really believe some of the imbecilic things I say.

It doesn't help that I do ask some imbecilic questions from time to time.

The only person I've ever met who really gets me is my sister, and even she is only scoring about 70 percent.

JerryB · Post by **JerryB** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 11:34 am

I reckon that I do agree with ya'll because some folks seem to have onion skin hide on them and take offense at the least little thing. Don has a good idea, if you think someone is after your hide PM them.

Charles · Post by **Charles** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 11:45 am

OK... I will bite!

The issue:

1. Is there a difference between "dry humor" and "sarcasm"?
2. If so, what is that difference?
3. Is "dry humor" ever used with the intent to hurt, injur, put down or ridicule another?
4. Is "scarcasm" ever used with the intent to hurt, injur, put down or ridicule another?
5. If the answer to 3 and 4 above, is ever yes, how does the person know if it was intended in a harmful, unfriendly way or in a friendly warm way?
6. Do folks ever try and hide their hostility and mask it as "dry humor" or whatever?

Commentary: Things are not as simple as you (Hobie) suggest. Consider the possibility that some folks really do "get it" and really do understand dry wit and sarcasm, and perhaps they just don't like what the "get" or "understand".

Conclusion: On the impersonal web, it is far better that folks refrain from dry humor and sarcasm and say what they mean and mean what they say. Thusly done, there is no need for the silly little faces or trying to read between the lines to garner the intent.

P.S.: A few folks on this board, who are mostly jerks, think I am overly sensitive. Perhaps I am, but it because I am very familar with the species "Jerkis Americanus" and their less than honest use of "dry with" and "sarcasm". Please refer to the conclusion above.

Grizz · Post by **Grizz** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 1:05 pm

Very funny Hobie, love your dry wit.....

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 2:15 pm

Charles wrote:OK... I will bite!

The issue:

1. Is there a difference between "dry humor" and "sarcasm"?
2. If so, what is that difference?
3. Is "dry humor" ever used with the intent to hurt, injur, put down or ridicule another?
4. Is "scarcasm" ever used with the intent to hurt, injur, put down or ridicule another?
5. If the answer to 3 and 4 above, is ever yes, how does the person know if it was intended in a harmful, unfriendly way or in a friendly warm way?
6. Do folks ever try and hide their hostility and mask it as "dry humor" or whatever?

Commentary: Things are not as simple as you (Hobie) suggest. Consider the possibility that some folks really do "get it" and really do understand dry wit and sarcasm, and perhaps they just don't like what the "get" or "understand".

Conclusion: On the impersonal web, it is far better that folks refrain from dry humor and sarcasm and say what they mean and mean what they say. Thusly done, there is no need for the silly little faces or trying to read between the lines to garner the intent.

P.S.: A few folks on this board, who are mostly jerks, think I am overly sensitive. Perhaps I am, but it because I am very familar with the species "Jerkis Americanus" and their less than honest use of "dry with" and "sarcasm". Please refer to the conclusion above.

Let me be as clear as possible. Some people confuse Intentionally Rude with Speaking One's Mind Hint: The name calling gives it away every time.

rhead · Post by **rhead** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 2:20 pm

To those who have inadvertantly offended me. I got over it pretty quick.
To those that I inadvertantly offended. I hope you got over it before you got heartburn.

Did I at least mispell that the same both times?

Don McDowell · Post by **Don McDowell** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 2:33 pm

Sarchasm (n): the gulf between the author of sacrcistic wit and the person that doesn't get it.

Charles you need to also remember that no matter how great the knowledge of jerks one might think they have, there always remains the great possibility that one persons jerk, might be the next persons patron saint.

JustaJeepGuy · Post by **JustaJeepGuy** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 2:37 pm

rhead wrote:To those who have inadvertantly offended me. I got over it pretty quick.
To those that I inadvertantly offended. I hope you got over it before you got heartburn.

Did I at least mispell that the same both times?

I try not to offend, and it's hard to offend me. I feel the same as you, rhead. BTW, the only word I see misspelled is "mispell".

JerryB · Post by **JerryB** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 2:47 pm

Well Don ol hoss, I reckon I will just have to ride with you again on that one too. Seems like sometimes education just gets in the way of good sense,now I better quit cause I probably already done offended somebody.

Don McDowell · Post by **Don McDowell** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 2:49 pm

JerryB wrote:Well Don ol hoss, I reckon I will just have to ride with you again on that one too. Seems like sometimes education just gets in the way of good sense,now I better quit cause I probably already done offended somebody.

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 4:05 pm

If anyone here was able to read the msg I just sent my company about the pit of a truck stop they just sent me to, there was not sarcasm nor dry wit anywhere in the piece. I generally call it like I see it; I AM an obnoxious, opinionated mis-anthrope, and if you've failed to gather that from my posts... well, off to the corner and the Dunce's cap with ya!

Is that what ya mean, Hobie?

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 4:14 pm

Griff wrote:If anyone here was able to read the msg I just sent my company about the pit of a truck stop they just sent me to, there was not sarcasm nor dry wit anywhere in the piece. I generally call it like I see it; I AM an obnoxious, opinionated mis-anthrope, and if you've failed to gather that from my posts... well, off to the corner and the Dunce's cap with ya!

Is that what ya mean, Hobie?

Why a missed antelope?

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 4:18 pm

BlaineG wrote:
Griff wrote:If anyone here was able to read the msg I just sent my company about the pit of a truck stop they just sent me to, there was not sarcasm nor dry wit anywhere in the piece. I generally call it like I see it; I AM an obnoxious, opinionated mis-anthrope, and if you've failed to gather that from my posts... well, off to the corner and the Dunce's cap with ya!

Is that what ya mean, Hobie?
Why a missed antelope?

Surely you saw my report on the LCFD vs Roll Crimp... I am a terrible shot! At least, that day!

Don McDowell · Post by **Don McDowell** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 4:18 pm

Blaine we get it figured out what state he's in we can turn him in on the Poachers Hot line and split the reeward. There's no antelope seasons open right now.

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 4:39 pm

Also remember that the common focus here is actually "leverguns" (hence the site's name) - and other than agreeing that those particular chunks of wood and metal are cool, we have lots of other very diverse backgrounds and opinions.

AND we live in times when our government has come to thrive on increasing conflict among its citizens, in order to broker power in exchange for tax and lobbying money; this creates social and economic dysfunction, which adds to ALL our stress level, and with the subliminal message we all get daily from the news media that such-and-such a group is the source of all our problems, we're ready to lash out at rural, urban, rich, poor, white-collar, blue-collar, union, non-union, white, black, whatever - in reality the problems are seldom the groups but how those groups are being used and manipulated by political interests.

If we couldn't generalize, though, and use terms for 'groups' of people, it would make it hard to communicate, so we just have to use common courtesy. I've typed many a post, then purposely taken a break and come back to re-read it before sending it, only to find I was being an idiot, so I either re-worded it or hit the 'delete' key.

I once heard it estimated that about 10% of the population would shoplift, about 10% of the shoplifters would burglarize, about 10% of the burglars would rob at gunpoint, and about 10% of the robbers would rape or murder. There ARE bad people, and truly EVIL ones, out there, but I'd bet that our fellow forum members aren't in those bad groups, so cut them a little slack, if possible. (...besides, if you're nice to them, someday they might trade you a cool levergun or something!

)

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 4:46 pm

Don McDowell wrote:Blaine we get it figured out what state he's in we can turn him in on the Poachers Hot line and split the reeward. There's no antelope seasons open right now.

Ah, but... there's an open season on misanthropes! And, I'm right below ya today... enjoying the mild winter weather we're having!

Don McDowell · Post by **Don McDowell** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 4:53 pm

Oh lord hope you don't get tangled in that wind. It's been a fright since shortly after sunup this morning.

Griff · Post by **Griff** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 5:08 pm

Not quite so bad down here in Denver. It blew all the way from York, NE to Denver last nite & this morning, dropped off about the time I got here, then picked a couple of notches around 10am... rockin' the truck woke me from my nap! Tonite it's off over the Rockies into UUUUtah. Then I'm hopin down into SoCal as there's a cowboy match I ain't been too in 14 years that'd I'd like to make... gotta go, call the BIL and set up borrowin' some guns!

Charles · Post by **Charles** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 5:37 pm

Don - You are 100% correct that "jerkism" is often is the eyes of the beholder and one person's jerk may well be another's patron saint. That truth causes me to think:

1. Jerks often run in packs.
2. Being somebody's idol doesn't mean that idol is not a jerk. Case in point is Hitler, whom millions of folks idolized.
3. Sometimes jerkism is subjective and subject to personal interpretation. Other times jerkism is objective and as plain as rat stuff in the sugar bowl to quote Skeeter, quoting Joe D'Albini.

Jerry - You are also 100% correct that education sometimes gets in the way of common sense. There are such folks as educated fools. That truths causes me to muse on:

1. There are also ignorant fools. Fools coming in both the educated and ignorant varieties.
2. Education often enhances common sense, allowing one to practice it with greater precision.
3. Education has it limits in human beings, but on balance it is more of a virtue than a vice.

ADJM - Yes, this is a levergun site and we are all better off when we stick to that. However, Hobie hit the tee shot and I just knocked it a little farther down the fairway. I am all in favor of banning any non-levergun post, but the Mod needs to play by those rules as well. Can't, have it both ways.

No slight or offense intended to any of you good men. Just a little reflection on the subject at hand. To my knowledge, none of you is either a jerk or a fool..

Post by **Hobie** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 6:06 pm

Gentlemen,

I play by the house rules and I don't own the house. So, what I do is pretty much determined for me. HOW I do it is another thing but I haven't been fired, yet.

My mom once told me, long ago before the Alzheimer's, that I shouldn't be so full of myself to think that every insult I heard was intended for me. So, I don't. I figure it must be for some other fella. Always... And... I feel darn sorry for that miserable so and so...

(note the use of the emoticon...)

mikld · Post by **mikld** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 7:28 pm

I'm offended because you were offended by my dry humor.

AJMD429 · Post by **AJMD429** » Wed Mar 04, 2009 7:39 pm

mikld wrote:I'm offended because you were offended by my dry humor.

Yes, but I wasn't offended - until I realized that my not being offended had not offended you - NOW I'm offended...!

El Chivo · Post by **El Chivo** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 5:41 am

we all have our moods and situations, these can come out in the posts.

I for one am having situations at work where struggles with different cliques keep me in fighting mode. I log on to leverguns.com right after work, and sometimes I have a full head of steam. And where I took my formative years, sarcasm and dry humor are the major forms of relating.

Try living in Southern California. Everyone takes you so literally, you can be sarcastic and no one even notices. You have to ramp up the volume just to get a glimmer of recognition. And it's even worse in LA, where every tenth person knows more English than "Have a nice day".

Borregos · Post by **Borregos** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 6:49 am

Nobody is going to fire you Hobie

Post by **Ysabel Kid** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 8:43 am

AJMD429 wrote:
mikld wrote:I'm offended because you were offended by my dry humor.
Yes, but I wasn't offended - until I realized that my not being offended had not offended you - NOW I'm offended...!

Now I'm offended because I missed the post that this had become a "ladies' social forum!"

(emoticons, sarcasam, and dry humor combined - get it?

)

HATCHETTJACK · Post by **HATCHETTJACK** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 9:37 am

Ysabel Kid wrote:
AJMD429 wrote:
mikld wrote:I'm offended because you were offended by my dry humor.
Yes, but I wasn't offended - until I realized that my not being offended had not offended you - NOW I'm offended...!
Now I'm offended because I missed the post that this had become a "ladies' social forum!"

(emoticons, sarcasam, and dry humor combined - get it? )

oh dear

i thought this was a leverguns forum

, sorry ladies

Blaine · Post by **Blaine** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 10:02 am

I found him, Charles

Rusty · Post by **Rusty** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 11:15 am

I was forced to go to a company run seminar once for Sensitivity training. They told us there that when you offend someone the offending comment is offensive if the person who the comment was directed to is offended even if you did not mean it to be offensive. What I said at the time is still true today, if I MEAN to be offensive there will be no doubt.

Our fault may be that quite a few of us here have been or are still LEOs. I think one of the defense mechanisms that we utilize is a type of gallows humor that allows us to cope with everyday tragedy and yet retain some level of sanity.

That said I have never intentionally offended anyone on this forum to the best of my knowledge.

Charles · Post by **Charles** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 11:37 am

Rusty.. You make a very good point. I can also be offensive at time, but when I am, I darn well meant to be. I recall the line from the movie "Elmer Gantry"..." If my preaching offends you, maybe you need to be offended". There are indeed folks whose character, thinking and notions need to be confronted.

When I am intentionaly offense, I will own up to it and take the consequences. What gets under my skins is the folks who are intentionaly offense and disguise it as dry humor or scarcasm. When called on it, they won't "cowboy up" and admit to it. I guess that was the thrust of my original point. I am not making reference to any particular person or persons, but to a class of beings. There are always a few folks who take offense at anything I say and think it is directed toward them, which is not always the case.

To be certain there is scarcasm and dry humor that is not intended to offend and I find nothing wrong with that. I don't even have any trouble with intentionaly offense, as long as folks are honest about it and are willing to take the return flack.

HATCHETTJACK · Post by **HATCHETTJACK** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 12:23 pm

Charles wrote:Rusty.. You make a very good point. I can also be offensive at time, but when I am, I darn well meant to be. I recall the line from the movie "Elmer Gantry"..." If my preaching offends you, maybe you need to be offended". There are indeed folks whose character, thinking and notions need to be confronted.

When I am intentionaly offense, I will own up to it and take the consequences. What gets under my skins is the folks who are intentionaly offense and disguise it as dry humor or scarcasm. When called on it, they won't "cowboy up" and admit to it. I guess that was the thrust of my original point. I am not making reference to any particular person or persons, but to a class of beings. There are always a few folks who take offense at anything I say and think it is directed toward them, which is not always the case.

To be certain there is scarcasm and dry humor that is not intended to offend and I find nothing wrong with that. I don't even have any trouble with intentionaly offense, as long as folks are honest about it and are willing to take the return flack.

you just offended me..... i think

timkelley · Post by **timkelley** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 12:37 pm

After reading all of this thread, I am too tired to be offended.

bogus bill · Post by **bogus bill** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 12:41 pm

Know what you mean. There are a lot of edith bunkers out there!

Old Ironsights · Post by **Old Ironsights** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 12:45 pm

Loose morals everywhere! Children should not be exposed to the Filth of live Music. All that sax and violins...

What? Never mind...

GonnePhishin · Post by **GonnePhishin** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 1:31 pm

I like to think that dry humor is akin to a subtle or witty statement or joke- without intending to be nasty or mean spirited, and that sarcasm is an indirect sneer or put-down on to whom it is intended.

This does not make it right, however.