357 MAXI

[pistolhunter]

I'am trying to make a 357 max lever action. Is it posible and has anyone done this. My thought is to use a 30-30 mod 94 win. I need all the advice I can get Thanks .

Lars

[AJMD429]

While you're waiting for someone to answer who actually KNOWS something, I'll tell you I've seen numerous posts and threads here and elsewhere on it, with the consensus (seeming to me, anyway) being that it theoretically IS possible, but the expense and gyrations make it very difficult - nearly like building a gun from scratch - if you use any of the common short-action lever guns. Maybe a long action gun would suffice, but then you could just get it in .35 Remington (which is what I did). HOWEVER, there ARE a couple people who have trimmed .357 Max brass to just a bit longer than the .357 Magnum, so it WOULD fit and function in the short leverguns, and up-loaded it hotter than a .357 - still can't really use the same loads (case capacity, pressures etc.) but can maybe hot-rod some. ANOTHER solution if you just want a fast .357 bullet in a lever carbine is to do a .357 Bain & Davis conversion on a .44 Mag levergun. As I understand it, all you really have to do is re-barrel the gun. (If I ever do THAT, I'll do it with a stainless 1894SS and have me a nice deer gun )

I hope I didn't stray too far from the truth on the prior threads, but I think I got most of it right.

[J Miller]

Well, here is my 2 bits worth. Why not use a Winchester 94AE in .357? It's a long action. There is enough length capability.
About all I would think you'd need would be to modify the carrier and the cartridge guides and maybe the lever. Plus a chamber lengthening.

That seems to me to be a fairly easily doable project.

Joe

[Old Savage]

Tycer I believe is the man on this - but he makes a 360 ????? or other. He did the last one with a 94 357.

[AJMD429]

Here's one of the longer .357 ones I was referring to...

.357 Special Magnum - http://ammoguide.com/?catid=247
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NOMINAL PERFORMANCE

Bullet Weight: 180 gr
Muzzle Velocity: 1690 fps (handgun)
Muzzle Energy: 1142 ft-lbs

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* * * please go to (link) - http://ammoguide.com/ to view the data! * * *

[Hobie]

I have some small experience with the .357 Maximum. Dave Deering is now making up a run of 300 of his 190 gr. bullets just for this cartridge. I don't have a .360 DW dimension drawing. Steve Riciardelli has taken down his page. However the .360 DW is 1.415" or just about midway in the difference between these two. Tycer's gun and some, maybe most Handi .357s seem to accept the .360 DW. This doesn't seem to be odd. At least one person paid the tariff and had a Marlin 1894 converted to .357 Max. IIRC he reported troublesome functioning and an extremely long lever throw. As Joe points out the 1894 AE .357 Mag would be the rifle to start with BUT the two fellas I've read who started such a project had some other problem(s) . I think one had a problem with the angle at which the case was brought to the chamber. I don't claim to fully understand it, I'm just reporting. I don't think the other fella ever got back to us.





I've been reading all the posts about wanting to and trying such conversions since joining the forum in 2003. I've never read of a fully successful conversion, and just don't get it. It would be far smarter, if one wants .357 Maximum performance in a small levergun, to use the .357 Bain and Davis. If you are using the longer Winchester 94 or Marlin 336 action you might as well go to the better .38-55 or .35 Rem respectively. Either choice would be far cheaper.

Of course, cheap or easy isn't necessarily a factor to a real levergun loony.

[mikehaas]

AJMD429 said:
Here's one of the longer .357 ones I was referring to...

[AJMD429]

I have some small experience with the .357 Maximum.

I KNEW "Mr. .357 Maximum" would chime in, which is why I prefaced my comments with "While you're waiting for someone to answer who actually KNOWS something,"

Of course, cheap or easy isn't necessarily a factor to a real levergun loony.

That's for sure! I still have dreams of getting that 1894SS in .44 Mag, and turning it into a .357 Mag, or maybe getting TWO, and making one into the .357 Bain & Davis!

[pistolhunter]

Well thanks for the replies. I'm going to start and see what happens. I will keep you all informed. I will start with the mod 94 in 30-30, it will have enough room, maybe too much.

Lars

[Nath]

I never understood why it was not done in the first place by Winchester!!
Seems a perfect candidate for a 94 to me, no?

Nath.

[Travis Morgan]

I've wondered how this project would work in one of the Winchester autoloader chambered for .351? If a guys cared to cannibalise one, I think it'd be a dandy little hog gun.

[Tycer]

The angle of the 357 carrier will chamber a WFN in a Win 94 @ 1.85". Any longer and the angle when the bolt picks up the round is too sharp and the round wedges. The carrier and guides need to be reworked to get the head of the cartridge up higher for anything longer. I have not messed with anything besides altering the cartridge guide openings and cleaning up the forward part of the chamber where the DW brass was getting pinced into the .360" diameter bullets. The other 357s I have have tighter bores than that one and I did not need to use the .360" bullets. I do use the fat bullets, and I did open them up too, but only because I want to use the same ammo in all three. The DW will run a 200 grain cast to 1875 and a 180 to 2000.

If you want to run the same ammo in your revolver and a lever, you could easily just scale back to the 360 DW.

[AJMD429]

One other tidbit is that the .357 maximum (and I'd presume all the other 'hotter' .357's) is a higher pressure round than the regular .357. - 40,000 vs. 35,000 I think. If you're using a gun the factory chambers for modern .30-30 loads, I can't see that would be a problem, but OTOH I know the Handi-Rifles that come in .357 Magnum aren't supposed to be rechambered in .357 Maximum. Although the reasons include a "different" receiver lockup, I think the biggest factor is the firing pin (and hole in the breech) on the shotgun frames they use for .357 Mag and .44 Mag are larger, and increase the likelihood of primer rupture.

[Hobie]

I apologize for not including these links:
- Stephen Cutter's ".357 Maximum"
- my own "The .357 Remington Maximum in the Contender Carbine"

[Hobie]

I've wondered how this project would work in one of the Winchester autoloader chambered for .351? If a guys cared to cannibalise one, I think it'd be a dandy little hog gun.

Not going to work due to pressures.

[Travis Morgan]

......but OTOH I know the Handi-Rifles that come in .357 Magnum aren't supposed to be rechambered in .357 Maximum. Although the reasons include a "different" receiver lockup, I think the biggest factor is the firing pin (and hole in the breech) on the shotgun frames they use for .357 Mag and .44 Mag are larger, and increase the likelihood of primer rupture.

It'd probably also cause them to come unlocked. I've seen this in one chambered in either .223 or .30-30, I believe. Every time the lady fired it, It opened up.

[Travis Morgan]

I've wondered how this project would work in one of the Winchester autoloader chambered for .351? If a guys cared to cannibalise one, I think it'd be a dandy little hog gun.

Not going to work due to pressures.

What about with a stronger spring?

[Hobie]

I've wondered how this project would work in one of the Winchester autoloader chambered for .351? If a guys cared to cannibalise one, I think it'd be a dandy little hog gun.

Not going to work due to pressures.

What about with a stronger spring?

Or a heavier block? Or a longer receiver? There's a reason Winchester abandoned the technology of those guns (.32 WSL, .35 WSL, .351 WSL and .401...). The 1910 just wasn't popular and much of that was due to the power vs weight ratio (at least that's what old timers told me). The .351 is about a .357 Mag. The .401 produces .357 Max performance albeit in a larger caliber which allows that at reduced (compared to the Max) pressures.


Gotta go to work!