Reloading question

[Otto]

Quoted from another site:

Just a thought...

Many years ago I saw a picture of a revolver similarly destroyed (I think it was in precision shooting, but I could be wrong). The conclusion was that the powder used didn't fill the case. When the gun was leveled to fire, the powder flowed forward. If you can picture the powder in a case laying on its side, the level of the powder was lower than the primer hole. The primer fired igniting the entire charge at once, rather than from one end. The force of the explosion was directed upwards, removing the top half of the cylinder and the top strap of the gun. Their answer was to mix oatmeal in with the powder to fill the case and shake the cases to distribute. I haven't reloaded in a long time, so I don't know whether this would be an issue with this load. Or, you might have gotten a short powder charge in this one case

I am still relatively new to reloading, but I have never heard of this. Notice he is not talking about just filling the extra space, which I know is sometimes done with low-volume charges, but actually intermixing propellant with another substance.

[J Miller]

Quoted from another site:

Just a thought...

Many years ago I saw a picture of a revolver similarly destroyed (I think it was in precision shooting, but I could be wrong). The conclusion was that the powder used didn't fill the case. When the gun was leveled to fire, the powder flowed forward. If you can picture the powder in a case laying on its side, the level of the powder was lower than the primer hole. The primer fired igniting the entire charge at once, rather than from one end. The force of the explosion was directed upwards, removing the top half of the cylinder and the top strap of the gun. Their answer was to mix oatmeal in with the powder to fill the case and shake the cases to distribute. I haven't reloaded in a long time, so I don't know whether this would be an issue with this load. Or, you might have gotten a short powder charge in this one case

I am still relatively new to reloading, but I have never heard of this. Notice he is not talking about just filling the extra space, which I know is sometimes done with low-volume charges, but actually intermixing propellant with another substance.

Otto,

I call B.S. on this one. First of all what he is referring to is detonation. A theory that has yet to be duplicated in the lab. With large rifle cases and reduced charges of slow burning powders it can be duplicated repeatedly, not so with small charges of pistol powders in handgun cartridges.

I've been reloading hand gun calibers since 1975 and have used up a lot of Bullseye, 231, PB, 700X, and others in the .45 Colt and there is no basis for fact on what he said.

As for mixing oatmeal in the powder to fill up the space, that would be like pouring water in your gas tank to fill it up. It's an inert material that would hamper the powder at best, and render it useless at the worst.

If you have any Bullseye or 231 handy and a .45 Colt case measure out 6 and 7 grains respectively and put it in the case. These are legit data book loads and they fill up very little of that big case. Yet they are perfectly safe charges. And if leveled they do exactly what the dufas who posted the quote above mentioned.

Again, what I read in that quote is bogus B.S.

Every revolver that's lost the top of the cylinder and the top strap has been the result of a double or more powder charge or a double seated bullet. The reloaders are just using the detonation theory as an excuse so they don't have to take responsibility for their actions.

Sorry for being so wordy.

Joe

[Old Savage]

Depends on the powder. Powders like 296 and 110 aren't supposed to be loaded below 90% volume but others like Bullseye do not fill the case.

The explanation is not correct in general.

Read the manual and use the proper amount of the correct powder and work up from the lower levels.

[w30wcf]

Otto,

"SSE" (Secondary explosion effect) has never been duplicated in a laboratory in pistol cartridges that I know of. The most likely cause for the separation of a top strap is a double or triple charge of powder or a too deeply seated bullet.

As far as mixing oatmeal in with the powder, never heard of that.
Have heard of using a filler that would hold the powder to the back of the case, but not mixed in with the powder. I would expect the result of that would be very inconsistant ammunition....to the point of possibly sticking a bullet in the barrel(!). A dangerous practice!

Hopefully someone sets that poster straight.

w30wcf

[Guncase]

Just follow the recipe in the load manuals. If the load needs oatmeal, it will be listed in the data. You will not find any oatmeal in my reloading cabinet because in my 10+ manuals, I have never found a load that called for it. However, as Old savage said, there are loads that specify "do not reduce powder charge below listed weight".

[Otto]

I don't use fillers of any kind. The question was more a hypothetical one, about mixing anything with propellant. To me this would be like mixing two different powders: you have no idea what the result will be, or whether it would be remotely consistent.

Now if you'll excuse me, I have a sudden craving for a bowl of Cream of Wheat. Seriously.

[Chuck 100 yd]

You can shoot and feed the birds at the same time!!

DONT DO IT !!

[kimwcook]

I've never heard of the oatmeal filler, but I have used Dacron. I wouldn't do it again as it's a real pain to clean up. It melts and sticks pretty good.

[Griff]

Only legitimate use of a filler in a pistol case is with reduced charges of BP. And I haven't found that necessary except when below the 70% of volume. I have heard of it being espoused w/smokeless back in the '70s and I seem to recall an accompanying admonishment to include the weight of the filler with the weigh of the bullet in determining a proper powder charge. Seemed overly complicated to my then novice ears, so I've never participated in the pratice.

What Joe & the rest have said.

[TedH]

[deerwhacker444]

I have a bud who used to use Cream-o-wheat as filler in some of his black powder target pistols. Sounds like this fella might have his breakfast cereals mixed up.

[Thunder50]

I will have to call you guys out on the idea that every destroyed pistol is the result of an overcharge/multiple bullets. I have a S&W M-29 10.5" sihlouette gun that was destroyed by detonation. I had only loaded 13 rounds, weighed every one(no powder thrower), visually double checked the powder level in the cases in the loading block, then seated the bullets.

Gun let go on 9th shot. Just missed prairie dog on 8th shot, so it wasn't a barrel obstruction and it couldn't be two bullets as I was using 295gr SWC bullets, you couldn't seat two of those in a case anyhow.

I had just bought it new, two days earlier.

[Travis Morgan]

Now if you'll excuse me, I have a sudden craving for a bowl of Cream of Wheat. Seriously.

I've always loved the stuff, too. Now GRITS, on the other hand... YUCK!

[JohndeFresno]

I think the contributor was over 40 (like many of us here) and possibly just got his information a little mixed up. He was probably thinking about breakfast.

I like to mix jalapenos with my morning oatmeal, but it frequently causes explosions a little later.

[O.S.O.K.]

Now if you'll excuse me, I have a sudden craving for a bowl of Cream of Wheat. Seriously.

I've always loved the stuff, too. Now GRITS, on the other hand... YUCK!

Travis, mix a little cream and butter in the grits when you're fixin em up. Then, serve them with fried eggs - with the yolk still liquid - mix the yolk in with the grits and egg - mmmm manoman.

That's how I like em.

-----

As for the "detonation" - based on the description - I doubt it too. And I'd never use oatmeal for filler and mixing it in with the powder is ludicrous - as in, silly - not the rapper

Like said - just follow the load book directions and you'll be fine - though they've put "bad" data in there before- like reduced loads of 296 or H110 - and came-out with corrections later...

[piller]

I too used dacron filler once to reduce the load below what was listed. Everything worked fine except for the weird white spiderweb looking stuff in the air. I was lucky in my lack of experience. I don't mix anything with my powder anymore. Besides, oatmeal is too large, doesn't burn well, and my guns prefer polenta.

[Borregos]

TedH, love that flag

[the telegraphist]

Gday fellahs
Duplex loads have their place, but in large bores only 45/70 plus. Hand guns no. Lymans reloading manual (Cast Bullet handbook) covers this subject. Duplex loads and wads etc. Basically a small charge of a fast powder (Relatively speaking)to get the blackpowder boiler room going, its never been an exact science so tread with agreat deal of caution, have never
been game enough to try it though. Am sure others probably have and will be along shortly to add their experience.

The Telegraphist

[Travis Morgan]

Gday fellahs
Duplex loads have their place, but in large bores only 45/70 plus. Hand guns no. Lymans reloading manual (Cast Bullet handbook) covers this subject. Duplex loads and wads etc. Basically a small charge of a fast powder (Relatively speaking)to get the blackpowder boiler room going, its never been an exact science so tread with agreat deal of caution, have never
been game enough to try it though. Am sure others probably have and will be along shortly to add their experience.

The Telegraphist

In those cases, just use a MAGNUM (not Winchester) primer. The magnum primer will light more powder, faster.

Here recently, I've been farting around with H-110 in Ruger only .45 Colt loads, and figured, since the side of the Winchester primer box says,"For standard or Magnum loads", I'd be good to go.(Hodgdon's only recommends using magnum primers with this powder) It's a good thing I was firing slow, and carry a squib rod in my range box. Most of 'em lit, but I shudder to think what coulda happened during rapid fire with 270 gr. bullets breaking the speed of sound right in front of the muzzle, had I gotten a squib and not realised it in time.