Dicussion on COMBAT HANDGUN

[Paladin]

A great discussion on combat handguns that many of us hunters found out through trial and error.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zybc ...

[Scott Tschirhart]

One thing about the FBI is that they are not gunfighters.

They have some gunfighters in their HRT and other special units. But they also have diversity hires that have no business carrying a firearm.

One shot in one incident whee a 9 mm round stopped before hitting a heart (in a fight where over 100 rounds were fired) has led to the protocols that are universally accepted.

I’m really not so sure that the FBI, particularly the current FBI has any credibility on anything.

[JimT]

EXACTLY SCOTT!!
I've known a few old gentlemen (a couple who are still with us) who lived the real thing and who have the scars to prove it.

[Scott Tschirhart]

One thing about the FBI is that they are not gunfighters.

They have some gunfighters in their HRT and other special units. But they also have diversity hires that have no business carrying a firearm.

One shot in one incident where a 9 mm round stopped before hitting a heart (in a fight where over 100 rounds were fired) has led to the protocols that are universally accepted.

I’m really not so sure that the FBI, particularly the current FBI has any credibility on anything, particularly this issue.

Not their fault, but when was the last time you heard about the FBI being involved in any gunplay?

Ok, I remember Ruby Ridge, but that didn’t go particularly well. Oops! The Branch Davidian deal in Waco was ended by the FBI wasn’t it? I’ll shut up now.

Listen, I have very close friends who are retired FBI Agents. The FBI today is not the same.

[JimT]

I have the account of a gun store owner who was attacked by a sword-wielding individual. He got carved up pretty well before he got the .25 ACP out of his pocket, stuck it in the attackers eye and fired 4 times. It worked. He lived. The attacker did not.

[Ysabel Kid]

Listen, I have very close friends who are retired FBI Agents. The FBI today is not the same.

+1

My father was a FBI agent back in the late 60's through the 70's. He worked undercover, and those guys were gunfighters (fighters in general). Between political correctness, the ACLU, DEI, and then liberal/leftist politically-driven leadership, it ruined the organization.

[Steve in MO]

From people I know, the FBI Ballistics lab and the guys who work there know their stuff. No reason to question their work.

However, as we've previously noted, the FBI of 2026 is not the FBI of 1956. Gunfighters are not appreciated in that organization, nor I suspect in most of the other three letter organizations. Texas Rangers might be one of the only exceptions to that rule.

[Scott Tschirhart]

I work regularly with Texas Rangers. They are not gunfighters either. They mostly conduct investigations that cannot be conducted locally like public corruption and police shootings in smaller departments. They are not generally chasing down bad guys like in the old days. Just a change in focus.

[Lastmohecken]

The FBI probably made the right choice by going to the 9mm, but in my opinion, it had a lot to do with just fact that the 9mm is easier to shoot for the average person, because the average person just can't shoot the heavier guns, even the 40 cal. But personally, I like the 40 caliber Glock 22 better than about any 9mm. IMHO, the 9mm is basically just like the 6.5 Creedmore rifle debate. Sure they can do just fine but are much more dependent on the right bullet than a bigger gun that can get by with a little bit less of a trick bullet.

[wvfarrier]

Notice it never says "it the the most effective caliber" just that it is the most effective for the lowest common denominator agents

[Bill in Oregon]

I've gotten a big kick out James "Hot Dog" Reeves' other TFB videos, but this one is one of his best.

[Scott Tschirhart]

Notice it never says "it the the most effective caliber" just that it is the most effective for the lowest common denominator agents

I think this is correct. I’m not saying that a 9 mm won’t do a good job with proper shot placement. And I’m not saying that the FBI made a bad decision.

What I am saying is that we shouldn’t put so much stock in the FBI’s choice as it is not necessarily the best choice for other agencies or individuals.

Unfortunately I get to see more video of police shootings than I want to in my professional capacity. There is a difference between the 9mm and the .40 in real life. And the.40 comes out on top.

In recent years I haven’t seen many shootings with a .45 but I remember using it myself. It’s a better stopper.

Mass and diameter matter. But the ability to shoot well also matters.

[nwcatman]

Notice it never says "it the the most effective caliber" just that it is the most effective for the lowest common denominator agents

THIS!

[piller]

Let that 13 year old girl teach them to shoot. Autumn can shoot accurately with a 10mm in each hand.
The FBI of pre 1985 is not the FIB of today. Yes, I typed that the way I meant it. My respect for the Federal Insurrectionist Bureau is at the bottom of the Marianas Trench.

I was shooting at Alpine Gun Range one time, and a couple of FT Worth police were practicing. In uniform. Out of curiousity, I watched them. The older one was pretty decent. The younger one was not. There were also 2 guys in Government issue suits shooting. They were getting patterns. I went over and pulled out my Super Redhawk in .480 and proceeded to remove the bullseye. The two Feds, they did not identify themselves, came closer. They were having a private conversation. The two Officers also came over. They were polite, and asked about my gun. I let them shoot it. Both shot 1 round and had enough. The suits did not speak to any of us. I even put it down, turned to them, and called out asking if they wanted to try it. No response at all. Finally, I got a bit disgusted and walked over to their lanes. Looked at the targets out there at the 25 yard line, and just shook my head. I walked past them and said in my best imitation of Uncle Jed, "Piteeful, jest Piteeful!". One clenched his jaw. I laughed about that for a long time.
The Ft Worth cops were polite and seemed to have a genuine interest in shooting. Those 2 suits did not make me think positively of them.
Same range, I once met some fellow shooting a 22lr target revolver. He was putting an entire box of 50 rounds in an area that a nickel would easily cover. He was shooting slow. About 1 a minute. It was fun to watch for a few minutes.