See through mount for model 94

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morryholdings
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See through mount for model 94

Post by morryholdings »

I got a good deal on 1980's era Winchester 94 a few years ago. It came with see through sights. I didn't put a scope on it, but the eyes a getting older and need more range so I mounted a Leopold scope. But when I went to bore sight it, the scope is aimed quite a bit a higher than the iron sights. I adjusted the scope to the lowest elevation setting and it's still to high.

I think I can fix it by raising the rear ring mount, but I'm not sure how to do it. Any ideas?
Pisgah
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Re: See through mount for model 94

Post by Pisgah »

Yes, you can probably shim it enough to make it work. But the real solution is to get rid of the see-thru mount. They don't really allow you to use the scope or the sights very effectively.
BenT
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Re: See through mount for model 94

Post by BenT »

If your eyes are getting older like mine then get rid of the see through mounts and just use the scope. See through mounts are a compromise anyways. The only way a can use irons sights is with a peep sight. I like a 2x7 power scope. Leave it on 2x and shoot with both eyes open.
If you want to shim a scope, I have luck using a small piece of innertube between the bottom scope ring and scope. I had to use that on a 30-30 with a scout scope mount.
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AJMD429
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Re: See through mount for model 94

Post by AJMD429 »

I use a scope if I actually want to SEE what I'm shooting at, most of the time. Certainly expecting less than 2 MOA groups is silly if your own vision is only 4 MOA. That's what I found with my own 'old eyes'.

I can use 'old-eyes' sights well of four types:

1. a receiver-mounted one that is 'ghost-ringed' - the Williams FP being my favorite. I will painstakingly sight it in with the aperture off the bench, but once sighted in I'll remove the aperture because that makes it much faster to acquire, and still just about as accurate. I can shoot 2-4 MOA with an aperture sight like that.

2. a tang-mounted one I can use WITH the aperture, since it is closer to the eye - my rifles with tang sights are all set up with a bunch of Taurus-branded ones I got good deals on that are basically clones of the Marbles, with both elevation and windage adjustments. Due to their fragility I use them mostly on 'target-shooting' rifles versus for hunting, plus the Williams FP's ghost-ringed are better in the less-bright light typical for hunting situations. Maybe slightly more accurate than the Williams as set up above, but that could also be the type guns I mount them on (usually 24" rifles) and the fact that I'm usually shooting them from a rest.

3. Another sight worth considering that I've found VERY helpful for a practical 'hunting' gun is the Marbles Bullseye. It allows the fastest 'snap-shooting' of any sight I've ever used, although the ideal red-dot/holo is close. However, the design includes TWO rings, and if you take the extra half-second or so to align the smaller one, you can shoot into an inch at 25 yards all day long with most rifles.

I have some attempts at showing the view of a Bullseye sight on this thread... Hard to duplicate what the eye 'sees' but I think my photos are close.

https://levergunscommunity.org/viewtopi ... 74#p390174

How's THIS for a sight that doesn't block anything from view...???

Image

Here's what a regular 'open sight' would obscure in comparison....

Image

The photos can't do it justice, but when you are snap-shooting you instinctively use the larger thick ring as a 'ghost ring' and will be center-mass of a biped out to 25 yards no matter how fast you shoot. Pause just a second and your eye will accommodate to the smaller thinner ring, and you'll refine your centering of the bead, and then can shoot very accurately.

4. a scope or other 'optic' - :o - it may be a 10-40x beast I use for a heavy bolt action gun I only shoot off the bench, a mid-size 5-20x I use for more ordinary use hunting or just regular fun at the target range, or a compact 2-8x on something like my 375 Ruger. It may even be a compact Bushnell Fastfire-II on a handgun or carbine, with or without a laser, or a larger holographic or red-dot like the various SPARC sights. All of them seem to work just fine if you keep in mind the intended target and use.

I find that once I've decided to 'horribly deface' a rifle with an optic of some sort, the practical issues are:

A. I have to be able to SEE something to hit it. If I want to be able to hit a chicken-egg at 100 yards, but my vision only allows me to see a grapefruit at that range, pretending I can shoot that gun without a magnifying scope is insane. So if I need magnification, I use it, and I use ENOUGH to do the job. For me, if a 4x scope won't allow me to see the target I may want to hit, I'll use a 10x; there's no 'macho' reward to me in getting by with a lesser power.

B. Speed is the other consideration. Some optics are faster - the lower magnification, of course, and the wider field of view, of course. Beyond that, I think the less 'junk' that obscures things outside the 'field of view' the better (see the link and the Marbles 'Bullseye' sight, below), and the reticle is important. Concentric rings are intuitive and fast, and if combined with a central 'dot' they allow precision if you take the extra second to align the dot.

Again, I use scopes ALOT, but I find that the three non-optic sights I can still use are:

1. some tang sights - but they are a bit fragile and impractical for much of what I tend to do.

2. the Williams FP 'ghost-ringed' - probably the best all-around compromise, and super-easy to adjust and sight-in.

3. the Marbles 'Bullseye' - drift-adjustable like factory sights are, which is annoying, but once you have them sighted-in, they are fast and easy to use and so far my old eyes do just fine with them.
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